Does anyone knows special codes for Marriott?
May 6, 2004, 11:56 pm
#256
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Pittsburgh
Programs: MR/SPG LT Titanium, AA LT PLT, UA SLV, Avis PreferredPlus
Posts: 31,008
Originally Posted by MCOisHOME2ME
Something that is probably unethical, but has worked well for me.
May 7, 2004, 5:55 am
#257
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Some place in this wonderful world (usually at 39,000 ft in seat 1C)
Programs: CO Gold Elite / NW Gold Elite
Posts: 13,747
Originally Posted by MCOisHOME2ME
Something that is probably unethical, but has worked well for me.
On the Marriott.com website for each specific hotel property, "nearby businesses" are typically listed along with the hotel amenities, restaraunts, etc. It seems logical (and my experience has shown it to work) that these nearby companies would be likely to have special corporate rates with the hotel.
As mentioned previously in this thread, its usually pretty easy to guy the 3-letter code for most big companies (FED=federal express, COK=Coca Cola, BOA=Bank of America, etc.) I usually run through the list of company and drop in 3 digit codes and typically find one that works pretty well. Just this week I got a room for $89 that would have been $159 with no code.
On the Marriott.com website for each specific hotel property, "nearby businesses" are typically listed along with the hotel amenities, restaraunts, etc. It seems logical (and my experience has shown it to work) that these nearby companies would be likely to have special corporate rates with the hotel.
As mentioned previously in this thread, its usually pretty easy to guy the 3-letter code for most big companies (FED=federal express, COK=Coca Cola, BOA=Bank of America, etc.) I usually run through the list of company and drop in 3 digit codes and typically find one that works pretty well. Just this week I got a room for $89 that would have been $159 with no code.
May 7, 2004, 12:16 pm
#258
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 674
Originally Posted by socrates
This isn't "probably unethical" but is highly (IMO) unethical if you can not produce the requested "ID required at checkin"....and in most cases if you can not produce the ID your rate will be changed to the best available rate at that time
In 20 years of traveling, I have used various company's rates (typically, what I would consider in 100% legitimate situations) and have never been asked for any type of identification whatsoever. What type of "ID required at checkin" are they talking about? Does a business card suffice? What if you're not an employee of a particular company, but you're in the area to visit that company (job interview, mutual business, audits, consulting, etc) - would those not be considered legitimate uses of that company's rate?
I guess the logical line to draw would be to base it upon who is going to ultimately pay for the room. If the company will ultimately pay (even if, for example, its a passed through expense that is initially paid by a consultant), it seems to be that using the company's rate is 100% legitmate (however, by that criteria, if the CEO of IBM is on a personal trip, he wouldn't be able to use the company code). But that begs the question, if the front desk clerk does for some reason ask for ID, how would she/he know whether the rate was legitimate? Is a manager really going to change a rate if a customer comes in and explains that they aren't technically an employee of IBM, but they are in town for a job interview with IBM?
I agree that this is certainly a "gray area", and Marriott would probably prefer that only employees of a company use the rate code (actually, Marriott would probably prefer that even they pay the higher rate, but that's beside the point), but I disagree that it is "highly" unethical. If Marriott was truly concerned about such practices (including use of lpr, npr, pkg, etc), they could easily set up a special reservation line - or even a password protected website - to handle bookings of these "special" rates. At the very least, they could use some ambiguos alpha-numeric code like I've seen car rental companies use, rather than IBM, MMM, FRD, FED, BOA, etc. My understanding is that they do a fair job of limiting use of the VIP and Marriott employee codes; if it was truly a concern, they could do the same thing with the company codes.
Just my 2 cents, but perhaps the length of this post indicates that I do protest too much.
May 7, 2004, 12:33 pm
#259
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,720
Originally Posted by MCOisHOME2ME
So would you basically find this entire thread unethical then? Is the approach I described really any different than dropping in "lpr" or "npr" for a city and seeing what you come up with? Clearly some of the rates I've seen with those rates must have been errors (such as free parking and b'fast for 2, mid-week, in downtown Atlanta for $59) - or at the very least, were never designed for widespread distribution and use.
In 20 years of traveling, I have used various company's rates (typically, what I would consider in 100% legitimate situations) and have never been asked for any type of identification whatsoever. What type of "ID required at checkin" are they talking about? Does a business card suffice? What if you're not an employee of a particular company, but you're in the area to visit that company (job interview, mutual business, audits, consulting, etc) - would those not be considered legitimate uses of that company's rate?
I guess the logical line to draw would be to base it upon who is going to ultimately pay for the room. If the company will ultimately pay (even if, for example, its a passed through expense that is initially paid by a consultant), it seems to be that using the company's rate is 100% legitmate (however, by that criteria, if the CEO of IBM is on a personal trip, he wouldn't be able to use the company code). But that begs the question, if the front desk clerk does for some reason ask for ID, how would she/he know whether the rate was legitimate? Is a manager really going to change a rate if a customer comes in and explains that they aren't technically an employee of IBM, but they are in town for a job interview with IBM?
I agree that this is certainly a "gray area", and Marriott would probably prefer that only employees of a company use the rate code (actually, Marriott would probably prefer that even they pay the higher rate, but that's beside the point), but I disagree that it is "highly" unethical. If Marriott was truly concerned about such practices (including use of lpr, npr, pkg, etc), they could easily set up a special reservation line - or even a password protected website - to handle bookings of these "special" rates. At the very least, they could use some ambiguos alpha-numeric code like I've seen car rental companies use, rather than IBM, MMM, FRD, FED, BOA, etc. My understanding is that they do a fair job of limiting use of the VIP and Marriott employee codes; if it was truly a concern, they could do the same thing with the company codes.
Just my 2 cents, but perhaps the length of this post indicates that I do protest too much.
In 20 years of traveling, I have used various company's rates (typically, what I would consider in 100% legitimate situations) and have never been asked for any type of identification whatsoever. What type of "ID required at checkin" are they talking about? Does a business card suffice? What if you're not an employee of a particular company, but you're in the area to visit that company (job interview, mutual business, audits, consulting, etc) - would those not be considered legitimate uses of that company's rate?
I guess the logical line to draw would be to base it upon who is going to ultimately pay for the room. If the company will ultimately pay (even if, for example, its a passed through expense that is initially paid by a consultant), it seems to be that using the company's rate is 100% legitmate (however, by that criteria, if the CEO of IBM is on a personal trip, he wouldn't be able to use the company code). But that begs the question, if the front desk clerk does for some reason ask for ID, how would she/he know whether the rate was legitimate? Is a manager really going to change a rate if a customer comes in and explains that they aren't technically an employee of IBM, but they are in town for a job interview with IBM?
I agree that this is certainly a "gray area", and Marriott would probably prefer that only employees of a company use the rate code (actually, Marriott would probably prefer that even they pay the higher rate, but that's beside the point), but I disagree that it is "highly" unethical. If Marriott was truly concerned about such practices (including use of lpr, npr, pkg, etc), they could easily set up a special reservation line - or even a password protected website - to handle bookings of these "special" rates. At the very least, they could use some ambiguos alpha-numeric code like I've seen car rental companies use, rather than IBM, MMM, FRD, FED, BOA, etc. My understanding is that they do a fair job of limiting use of the VIP and Marriott employee codes; if it was truly a concern, they could do the same thing with the company codes.
Just my 2 cents, but perhaps the length of this post indicates that I do protest too much.
I refrained from posting because I thought that others would chime in, and I was not disappointed.
You are way off base with your observations because offers that may appear to be only offered during a weekend can be offered during the week, just like a hotel could not participate in an offer, at all.
At bottom, it is the hotel's discretion if and when to offer a rate or promotion. Should they have made an error and forgot to withdraw an offer, well, for one, you don't know for sure that they have done so, or whether the management has decided to offer that rate to drum up some more business, or there was a mistake made but they have injected that rate into the stream of commerce and usually will honor it unless the error is so extreme that they wish to abrogate the offer and acceptance with the time honored and court sanctioned excuse of mistake of contract.
What you do, is very different. You fraudulently represent yourself to be something you are not -- an individual who is eligible to use such rate. Make no mistake about it, what you do is unethical, period. Your attempts to explain away your reprehensible conduct makes your behavior all the more transparent, and wrong.
Had you truly read the entire thread that you posted to, you no doubt would have seen, that Socrates and I, and others, already had covered use of codes that one is not eligible to use. Almost to a person, at least those who posted in response to their specific queries, they refrained from using a certain code, when they learned that they were ineligible to use it ... or that they may face the consequences for wrongly doing so.
Your decision to post to this thread trumpeting your fraud, notwithstanding that earlier admonition, is a thumb in the eye to Socrates' company and all the other FTers who seek to obtain a good rate legitimately, as well as a profound lapse of ethical judgment on your part.
You may continue with your rationalizations, but you will find no quarter or even acceptance of your 2 cents here, as those pennies were probably obtained under the most dubious circumstances.
Last edited by NJUPINTHEAIR; May 7, 2004 at 12:36 pm
May 7, 2004, 1:01 pm
#260
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Some place in this wonderful world (usually at 39,000 ft in seat 1C)
Programs: CO Gold Elite / NW Gold Elite
Posts: 13,747
Originally Posted by MCOisHOME2ME
So would you basically find this entire thread unethical then?
Last edited by socrates; May 7, 2004 at 1:08 pm
May 7, 2004, 2:51 pm
#261
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Aug 2002
Programs: UALifetimePremierGold, Marriott LifetimeTitanium
Posts: 71,110
I appreciate this thread remaining open!!!
While some corp codes are posted on it, I don't use them since I don't work for the corps in any capacity (and ethics aside, I'd worry they'd ask for the corp id which of course I wouldn't be able to produce, although in fairness to others who have also posted, I can say I was never once asked for id when I did work for corps who had legit rates). Guess it depends on how strict the rules are or whether the clerks are just used to corp visitors. I have seen them ask for AAA or travel agent cards, however.
However, there have been codes posted that are available to us that I could legitimately qualify for but would not have known to use had it not been for this thread, and that has helped me quite a bit when booking stays.
So for that reason I would ask that the thread remain open (and going OT, if someone's also a Hilton person in addition to Marriott & has any rate codes available for them that are legit/open to folk, how 'bout starting a thread there, as that's my other chain
).
While some corp codes are posted on it, I don't use them since I don't work for the corps in any capacity (and ethics aside, I'd worry they'd ask for the corp id which of course I wouldn't be able to produce, although in fairness to others who have also posted, I can say I was never once asked for id when I did work for corps who had legit rates). Guess it depends on how strict the rules are or whether the clerks are just used to corp visitors. I have seen them ask for AAA or travel agent cards, however.
However, there have been codes posted that are available to us that I could legitimately qualify for but would not have known to use had it not been for this thread, and that has helped me quite a bit when booking stays.
So for that reason I would ask that the thread remain open (and going OT, if someone's also a Hilton person in addition to Marriott & has any rate codes available for them that are legit/open to folk, how 'bout starting a thread there, as that's my other chain
).
May 7, 2004, 5:13 pm
#262
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Pittsburgh
Programs: MR/SPG LT Titanium, AA LT PLT, UA SLV, Avis PreferredPlus
Posts: 31,008
Originally Posted by MCOisHOME2ME
So would you basically find this entire thread unethical then?
Well maybe not the whole thread, there is infomration on Marriott policies, publically available codes, etc., which are fine.
Posting corporate codes for use by those not related to the corporation? And your lame attempt at justifying it?
Yes
I could write a full reply, but NJUPINTHEAIR did it more eloquently than I ever could.
Last edited by CPRich; May 7, 2004 at 5:16 pm
May 7, 2004, 7:21 pm
#263
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Some place in this wonderful world (usually at 39,000 ft in seat 1C)
Programs: CO Gold Elite / NW Gold Elite
Posts: 13,747
Originally Posted by SkiAdcock
So for that reason I would ask that the thread remain open (and going OT, if someone's also a Hilton person in addition to Marriott & has any rate codes available for them that are legit/open to folk, how 'bout starting a thread there, as that's my other chain ).
).
May 7, 2004, 7:54 pm
#264
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 674
Wow, didn't mean to start such a firestorm.
I have read most of this thread, but didn't re-read it before my recent post, so I apologize for hitting on a taboo subject that has already been chastized. I'll certainly refrain from using this tactic in the future since it seems that everyone here has the universal opinion that it ain't right.
However, I pretty much stumbled upon this tactic because over the years I have used Corporate rates at various hotel chains in circumstances where I believe the use of the code was 100% legitimate - even though I was not an employee of said company. Accordingly, what are your opinions of using an IBM company code (just to pick an example company) in the following situations?
On an unrelated topic, is the following action ethical?
You are a manager at a hotel and a guest checks in. That guest has reserved a standard room for 10 days, but has elite status that would entitle her to upgrade to a suite for free. Your hotel is full, except for one suite that sells for 7 times the cost of a standard room - and that suite is not reserved for any of the next 10 nights. When the guest asks about the upgrade, you indicate that no upgrade rooms are available. Afterall, with the hotel sold out, it is possible that a walk-in guest may show up who is desperate for the room and may pay a substantially higher rate for the room. And very likely that someone may reserve it sometime over the next 10 days.
IMHO, using the IBM rate code in any of the above listed items (except possibly the last one) would be more ethical that the action of the hypothetical hotel manage in the italicized section above. But, using a "made up" company code just to get a lower rate, would probably be more unethical than the hotel manager's actions.
However, I pretty much stumbled upon this tactic because over the years I have used Corporate rates at various hotel chains in circumstances where I believe the use of the code was 100% legitimate - even though I was not an employee of said company. Accordingly, what are your opinions of using an IBM company code (just to pick an example company) in the following situations?
- The purpose of the trip requiring the hotel stay is a consulting engagement for IBM.
- You are a 1099 independent contractor working at IBM headquarters, but are not an employee.
- You work for a subsidiary of IBM, but not IBM directly.
- You work for a company that IBM has a 50% ownership interest in.
- You work for a company that IBM has a 10% ownership interest in.
- You legitimately work for IBM, but you are on a personal, non-business-related, vacation.
- The purpose of the trip requiring the hotel stay is a job interview with IBM
- The purpose of the trip requiring the hotel stay is a training session sponsored by IBM.
- The purpose of the trip requiring the training session is a charity golf event sponsored by IBM.
- You used to work for IBM, but no longer do.
On an unrelated topic, is the following action ethical?
You are a manager at a hotel and a guest checks in. That guest has reserved a standard room for 10 days, but has elite status that would entitle her to upgrade to a suite for free. Your hotel is full, except for one suite that sells for 7 times the cost of a standard room - and that suite is not reserved for any of the next 10 nights. When the guest asks about the upgrade, you indicate that no upgrade rooms are available. Afterall, with the hotel sold out, it is possible that a walk-in guest may show up who is desperate for the room and may pay a substantially higher rate for the room. And very likely that someone may reserve it sometime over the next 10 days.
IMHO, using the IBM rate code in any of the above listed items (except possibly the last one) would be more ethical that the action of the hypothetical hotel manage in the italicized section above. But, using a "made up" company code just to get a lower rate, would probably be more unethical than the hotel manager's actions.
May 7, 2004, 9:24 pm
#265
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: dfw
Programs: AA EXP/MM, HGP ♦; former elite in Hilton, Marriott & DL (just under MM thanks to Leo)
Posts: 415
I actually have done almost all of these and since you asked, the hotel will usually honor its corporate rate depending on an agreement it may have with the company. In exchange for the company's exclusive or preferential business, the hotel will also honor these reasons
Since you may be looking at a negotiated rate, a non-employee should ask IBM if they can use their rate, or ask the hotel's front desk, reservation department or GM. If you are afraid to ask any of the above, then you probably already understand your self-righteousness is mostly based on not getting caught. Corporate rates are not hidden sales.
Playing games since Marriott franchises decided to not give the elites upgrades to suites does not justify commiting fraud.
On second thought, maybe I'll go out and buy a walker and a costume kit to add a few years to my appearance. I bet I could get some pretty decent AARP rates!
What's that sonny, I need a card? Why my good ole' BelAire is just outside. Why would I want another car? Please stop dilly dallying and give me my room keys. I really need to take a nap before I meet my WWII buddies. Huh, what's dis plastic dohicky? Oh I think I've seen these silly plastic keys on Matlock. Turns to the left right? Huh speak up....
- The purpose of the trip requiring the hotel stay is a consulting engagement for IBM. sometimes
- You are a 1099 independent contractor working at IBM headquarters, but are not an employee. maybe
- You work for a subsidiary of IBM, but not IBM directly. usually
- You work for a company that IBM has a 50% ownership interest in. maybe
- You work for a company that IBM has a 10% ownership interest in. doubtful
- You legitimately work for IBM, but you are on a personal, non-business-related, vacation. usually
- The purpose of the trip requiring the hotel stay is a job interview with IBM almost always - and often billed directly to company's account
- The purpose of the trip requiring the hotel stay is a training session sponsored by IBM. sometimes
- The purpose of the trip requiring the training session is a charity golf event sponsored by IBM. doubtful
- You used to work for IBM, but no longer do. retired->maybe, otherwise->you're kidding right?
Since you may be looking at a negotiated rate, a non-employee should ask IBM if they can use their rate, or ask the hotel's front desk, reservation department or GM. If you are afraid to ask any of the above, then you probably already understand your self-righteousness is mostly based on not getting caught. Corporate rates are not hidden sales.
Playing games since Marriott franchises decided to not give the elites upgrades to suites does not justify commiting fraud.
On second thought, maybe I'll go out and buy a walker and a costume kit to add a few years to my appearance. I bet I could get some pretty decent AARP rates!
What's that sonny, I need a card? Why my good ole' BelAire is just outside. Why would I want another car? Please stop dilly dallying and give me my room keys. I really need to take a nap before I meet my WWII buddies. Huh, what's dis plastic dohicky? Oh I think I've seen these silly plastic keys on Matlock. Turns to the left right? Huh speak up....
Last edited by traveling_again; May 7, 2004 at 9:42 pm
Jul 15, 2004, 6:58 am
#266
Join Date: May 2004
Location: PHL
Programs: UA 1k, US ex-CP, NW silver, Marriott plat, SPG gold, Hertz 5*
Posts: 421
Which codes are legit
What would be considered the appropriate codes (i.e. not company or certain group specific) codes that anyone could use? It would be nice to know which codes I could use to get room rates down under my per diem allowance.
Jul 15, 2004, 10:38 am
#267
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: New York USA
Posts: 2,933
In a nutshell, these are the codes I plug in most frequently these days:
AAA (of course, only if you have an AAA card, which costs about $45/yr and can pay for itself in one trip)
ENT (you can buy the Entertainment book on line for $10 now, and this has saved me $70 per NIGHT on occasion!)
OTP (right now, the best code out there if you are paying with a Visa card)
ADP (advance purchase rate, though I find it often isn't actually charged til checkout anyway)
M11
BAR
MEB
LLR
LPR
R8H and I24 (Renaissance)
S29 (Caribbean)
Of course, make sure you check the rate rules at time of booking to be sure you meet the requirements (card or certificate might be required at checkin).
The fourth page of this thread gave a great, comprehensive list of all the codes, but many of those are regional, seasonal or company-specific. Still, if you have time, it doesn't hurt to plug those in and see what you come up with. The ones I listed here are the ones I've had the most success with on a regular basis.
AAA (of course, only if you have an AAA card, which costs about $45/yr and can pay for itself in one trip)
ENT (you can buy the Entertainment book on line for $10 now, and this has saved me $70 per NIGHT on occasion!)
OTP (right now, the best code out there if you are paying with a Visa card)
ADP (advance purchase rate, though I find it often isn't actually charged til checkout anyway)
M11
BAR
MEB
LLR
LPR
R8H and I24 (Renaissance)
S29 (Caribbean)
Of course, make sure you check the rate rules at time of booking to be sure you meet the requirements (card or certificate might be required at checkin).
The fourth page of this thread gave a great, comprehensive list of all the codes, but many of those are regional, seasonal or company-specific. Still, if you have time, it doesn't hurt to plug those in and see what you come up with. The ones I listed here are the ones I've had the most success with on a regular basis.
Last edited by flyerwife; Jul 15, 2004 at 10:41 am
Jul 15, 2004, 8:40 pm
#268
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Programs: AA- Lifetime Platinum; Marriott - Lifetime Platinum: Starwood - Gold; IHG - Platinum
Posts: 2,201
Flyerwife: Nice summary you gave us. Thanks! When I tried the LLR the rules stated "fireman/policeman & ID required". So, most of us can't use that.
When I did a search using the LPR a few of my rate rules stated: "written authorization required". I went thru all the pages in this thread searching "written authorization" and got no results. Does anyone remember what may have been said and deleted about these words? Just what does it mean? I found it on a rate I would qualify for.
Thanks for any help.
When I did a search using the LPR a few of my rate rules stated: "written authorization required". I went thru all the pages in this thread searching "written authorization" and got no results. Does anyone remember what may have been said and deleted about these words? Just what does it mean? I found it on a rate I would qualify for.
Thanks for any help.
Jul 15, 2004, 8:49 pm
#269
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: HKY
Programs: DL-DM MM & RW, UAL- PS, Marriott Lifetime PLT, SPG-PLT, Hilton-Gold
Posts: 4,468
Originally Posted by paradocs
Flyerwife: Nice summary you gave us. Thanks! When I tried the LLR the rules stated "fireman/policeman & ID required". So, most of us can't use that.
When I did a search using the LPR a few of my rate rules stated: "written authorization required". I went thru all the pages in this thread searching "written authorization" and got no results. Does anyone remember what may have been said and deleted about these words? Just what does it mean? I found it on a rate I would qualify for.
Thanks for any help.
When I did a search using the LPR a few of my rate rules stated: "written authorization required". I went thru all the pages in this thread searching "written authorization" and got no results. Does anyone remember what may have been said and deleted about these words? Just what does it mean? I found it on a rate I would qualify for.
Thanks for any help.
Jul 15, 2004, 11:22 pm
#270
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Programs: AA- Lifetime Platinum; Marriott - Lifetime Platinum: Starwood - Gold; IHG - Platinum
Posts: 2,201
Thanks so much longing4piedmont ! I appreciate your help!