Mar 28, 2014, 10:58 am
Last edit by: MasterCharge
Welcome to Manufactured Spending. If you are new here, please spend some time reading before posting. Most likely your questions have already been answered multiple times. Consider deals that you share. These threads are searchable by Google. A volatile deal may be worth holding close to the vest.
Hints
1) On FT, topics are heavily consolidated. Sometimes the title of the thread and first few posts may not properly reflect the broad range of discussion inside the thread. Be sure to visit any thread relating to the product or service you want to learn more about because you might be surprised by how in depth the discussion really is. Example: This thread... I know, the first few posts are confusing.
2) Use Google to search FT. It works a lot better than the built-in search.
Important Rules
1) MSing is very YMMV. It varies by store, manager, and right down to the cashier working at the moment. That being said, always be nice and courteous in the face of rejection. The biggest secret for success is to lay low so you can try again.
2) DO NOT spend more than you can afford. START WITH SMALL AMOUNTS TO TEST THE WATER! As an example.. don't start with a $5000 purchase of VGCs if you can't afford to float that much! Instead, buy one and try it, and scale up once you are comfortable with a new method. It's easy to lose track, or get robbed, when you are handling so much money. Getting a refund is NOT always possible.
3) DO NOT ask employees, cashiers, customer service representatives, etc... about how to MS, or about things you read on this forum. The information you read here are very specific, unknown, legal uses of products or services. Most employees, cashiers, and even managers do not know about them. At best you'll get bad information. At worst you'll create a lot of unnecessary misunderstanding.
4) It bears repeating that there are no guarantees. you could easily buy $10,000 in gift cards or some other instrument, only to discover that your method for liquidating them vanishes the very next day. MS is not "normal" financial activity ("normal" being defined by the banks), and thus is often perceived as "suspicious" even if it is "legal."
5) never underestimate the risk of criminal activity. gift cards can easily be stolen, loaded onto a compromised account, loaded in a debit card skimmer, or even fraudulent (e.g., an already used card put back on the rack).
If you have a question that does not seem to fit anywhere, or you have not found an appropriate place for it, post it here.
a helpful note from seat17D about some of the inherent risks of MS:
Take what you read with a grain of salt. No law enforcement agency cares if you are loading 5k to a bluebird per month unless you are loading your money from illegal activities like crack sales. Even at that point they only care about your crack sales, not your bluebird load.
Nobody is going to ask you "why are you loading your bluebird" or "where did you get the money you want to load on your bluebird" when you go to walmart.
Hints
1) On FT, topics are heavily consolidated. Sometimes the title of the thread and first few posts may not properly reflect the broad range of discussion inside the thread. Be sure to visit any thread relating to the product or service you want to learn more about because you might be surprised by how in depth the discussion really is. Example: This thread... I know, the first few posts are confusing.
2) Use Google to search FT. It works a lot better than the built-in search.
Important Rules
1) MSing is very YMMV. It varies by store, manager, and right down to the cashier working at the moment. That being said, always be nice and courteous in the face of rejection. The biggest secret for success is to lay low so you can try again.
2) DO NOT spend more than you can afford. START WITH SMALL AMOUNTS TO TEST THE WATER! As an example.. don't start with a $5000 purchase of VGCs if you can't afford to float that much! Instead, buy one and try it, and scale up once you are comfortable with a new method. It's easy to lose track, or get robbed, when you are handling so much money. Getting a refund is NOT always possible.
3) DO NOT ask employees, cashiers, customer service representatives, etc... about how to MS, or about things you read on this forum. The information you read here are very specific, unknown, legal uses of products or services. Most employees, cashiers, and even managers do not know about them. At best you'll get bad information. At worst you'll create a lot of unnecessary misunderstanding.
4) It bears repeating that there are no guarantees. you could easily buy $10,000 in gift cards or some other instrument, only to discover that your method for liquidating them vanishes the very next day. MS is not "normal" financial activity ("normal" being defined by the banks), and thus is often perceived as "suspicious" even if it is "legal."
5) never underestimate the risk of criminal activity. gift cards can easily be stolen, loaded onto a compromised account, loaded in a debit card skimmer, or even fraudulent (e.g., an already used card put back on the rack).
If you have a question that does not seem to fit anywhere, or you have not found an appropriate place for it, post it here.
a helpful note from seat17D about some of the inherent risks of MS:
I will speak to only the impacts and actions that have been taken (or threatened) to me personally over the years
1. Account closure - always got my money back. Moderate frequency. Little to no long-term impact UNLESS my wife was the first one to find out when her card was declined in public setting
2. Blacklisted by an FI - lower frequency. Short- to medium term impact. Eventually the FI's greed heals all wounds.
3. Blacklisted by a governmental agency -- lower frequency. Variable long-term impact as governmental agencies never actually forget, they just don't take action (see below)
4. Banned from a retail establishment -- threatened, but never actually banned. Mostly just pointed discussion from a misguided manager. Low-medium frequency.
5. Banned from an online establishment -- lower frequency, generally lower impact. Generally permanent, at least for me so far.
6. Cashback forfeited or clawed back -- generally happened to me as part of a credit card shut down. so far only forfeits and not clawbacks, but they are possible
And then there are the things law enforcement can and has done
1. Executed a warrant to subpoena my banking and other financial records without my knowledge
2. Contacted my FIs to inquire as the nature of my financial relationship
3. Frozen the portion of my assets that were currently involved in the activity they were investigating
4. Visited my home -- when I was not there -- to "interview" my spouse, etc. regarding their knowledge and involvement ... and to attempt to obtain additional documentation not already obtained by the subpoenas
5. Threatened to seize my assets. Not just the ones frozen. Not just those I currently possessed. But all assets they deemed as ever having been part of the criminal activity. (Think every GC, MO, etc. you have purchased over the past 3-5 years)
6. Threatened one or more felony charges. (Consider having to explain THAT to your wife or boss.)
And that all was for something that was completely legal, once the 'splaining was done.
Of course once LEO opens a criminal investigation, it never actually closes unless they take you to court and fail. So even though I was cleared of the charges, the original case file is out there ready to be dusted off.
In the end, my biggest concern is the extent to which something will permanently impact my marriage or ability to enter into financial contracts (felony charges would be one example). Fortunately once the initial shock of LEO's investigation wore away, both my marriage and financial relationships were intact. Very thankful both she and a few key FI's stood by me.
When you MS, you are running with scissors.
1. Account closure - always got my money back. Moderate frequency. Little to no long-term impact UNLESS my wife was the first one to find out when her card was declined in public setting
2. Blacklisted by an FI - lower frequency. Short- to medium term impact. Eventually the FI's greed heals all wounds.
3. Blacklisted by a governmental agency -- lower frequency. Variable long-term impact as governmental agencies never actually forget, they just don't take action (see below)
4. Banned from a retail establishment -- threatened, but never actually banned. Mostly just pointed discussion from a misguided manager. Low-medium frequency.
5. Banned from an online establishment -- lower frequency, generally lower impact. Generally permanent, at least for me so far.
6. Cashback forfeited or clawed back -- generally happened to me as part of a credit card shut down. so far only forfeits and not clawbacks, but they are possible
And then there are the things law enforcement can and has done
1. Executed a warrant to subpoena my banking and other financial records without my knowledge
2. Contacted my FIs to inquire as the nature of my financial relationship
3. Frozen the portion of my assets that were currently involved in the activity they were investigating
4. Visited my home -- when I was not there -- to "interview" my spouse, etc. regarding their knowledge and involvement ... and to attempt to obtain additional documentation not already obtained by the subpoenas
5. Threatened to seize my assets. Not just the ones frozen. Not just those I currently possessed. But all assets they deemed as ever having been part of the criminal activity. (Think every GC, MO, etc. you have purchased over the past 3-5 years)
6. Threatened one or more felony charges. (Consider having to explain THAT to your wife or boss.)
And that all was for something that was completely legal, once the 'splaining was done.
Of course once LEO opens a criminal investigation, it never actually closes unless they take you to court and fail. So even though I was cleared of the charges, the original case file is out there ready to be dusted off.
In the end, my biggest concern is the extent to which something will permanently impact my marriage or ability to enter into financial contracts (felony charges would be one example). Fortunately once the initial shock of LEO's investigation wore away, both my marriage and financial relationships were intact. Very thankful both she and a few key FI's stood by me.
When you MS, you are running with scissors.
Nobody is going to ask you "why are you loading your bluebird" or "where did you get the money you want to load on your bluebird" when you go to walmart.
New to Manufactured Spending? Start Here.
Jul 28, 2014, 3:09 pm
#886
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 3,688
I've been a newbie once but before I immersed fully into it, I did a lot of research on it whether it's for me or not. First thing I did was to check my credit report and FICO score. When I found out I was within excellent range, I started doing the AppORamas but even then I took calculated risks and made plans on how I was going to meet the min spend required for each card I got approved. Even then, getting approved was not my problem since we were already getting targetted offers, it was just a matter of choosing which ones are worth my time doing....lol
One thing I always ask those about to get into MS is whether they are still carrying a CC balance and paying interest on it (including Balance Transfers, if any), and if they say yes, I'd tell them to tread lightly fwiw because charging a couple $Ks on their CCs when they're not certain how to turn them back to cash the quickest method possible means they may have to pay interest on that $amount. I have to remind them of the interests that CCCs charge is way, way more than what one will earn in CB or miles doing MS so it's a losing proposition no matter how you look at it. Having a float (aka available cash on hand to pay for CC bills when it's due) is one thing that one thing important to keep in mind before they decide to go on a "GC shopping spree" just because all others are doing it and said it's profitable (to them
, what about you?).
If it was me, before I apply for any card, I'd make sure to put my ducks in a row first and make plans exactly how to go about it. I said ducks meaning I have plans A,B,C,D,E etc in case I find roadblocks to one route.
btw, welcome to FT and as long as you're having fun doing this, it won't feel like it's work; once it stresses you out and you find yourself in deep financial trouble, it may be time to step back and re-assess the situation. Good luck!
One thing I always ask those about to get into MS is whether they are still carrying a CC balance and paying interest on it (including Balance Transfers, if any), and if they say yes, I'd tell them to tread lightly fwiw because charging a couple $Ks on their CCs when they're not certain how to turn them back to cash the quickest method possible means they may have to pay interest on that $amount. I have to remind them of the interests that CCCs charge is way, way more than what one will earn in CB or miles doing MS so it's a losing proposition no matter how you look at it. Having a float (aka available cash on hand to pay for CC bills when it's due) is one thing that one thing important to keep in mind before they decide to go on a "GC shopping spree" just because all others are doing it and said it's profitable (to them
, what about you?). If it was me, before I apply for any card, I'd make sure to put my ducks in a row first and make plans exactly how to go about it. I said ducks meaning I have plans A,B,C,D,E etc in case I find roadblocks to one route.
btw, welcome to FT and as long as you're having fun doing this, it won't feel like it's work; once it stresses you out and you find yourself in deep financial trouble, it may be time to step back and re-assess the situation. Good luck!
Jul 29, 2014, 11:14 am
#888
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: NYC
Posts: 111
I need help on deciding on what card to get next specifically for MS. I currently have:
PRG (opened 7/3/13)
SPG (opened 4/6/14)
CSP (opened 4/18/14)
Ink Plus (opened 5/8/14) - wife's
Citi Plat (opened 5/19/14)
Citi Exec (opened 5/31/14) - cancelled
Chase Freedom - wife's (oldest card)
BOA Travel Rewards - oldest card
I'm thinking either the Old Amex Blue for 5% cb (my wife was very fond of this idea) or possibly the Ink in branch to get the 70k bonus. My initial goal with MS was for miles/points, but now I'm open to other possibilities.
Thanks for any advice.
PRG (opened 7/3/13)
SPG (opened 4/6/14)
CSP (opened 4/18/14)
Ink Plus (opened 5/8/14) - wife's
Citi Plat (opened 5/19/14)
Citi Exec (opened 5/31/14) - cancelled
Chase Freedom - wife's (oldest card)
BOA Travel Rewards - oldest card
I'm thinking either the Old Amex Blue for 5% cb (my wife was very fond of this idea) or possibly the Ink in branch to get the 70k bonus. My initial goal with MS was for miles/points, but now I'm open to other possibilities.
Thanks for any advice.
Jul 29, 2014, 1:25 pm
#889
Join Date: May 2014
Location: LAX
Programs: AA, UA, DL, NSA, CIA, MIB
Posts: 537
I need help on deciding on what card to get next specifically for MS. I currently have:
PRG (opened 7/3/13)
SPG (opened 4/6/14)
CSP (opened 4/18/14)
Ink Plus (opened 5/8/14) - wife's
Citi Plat (opened 5/19/14)
Citi Exec (opened 5/31/14) - cancelled
Chase Freedom - wife's (oldest card)
BOA Travel Rewards - oldest card
I'm thinking either the Old Amex Blue for 5% cb (my wife was very fond of this idea) or possibly the Ink in branch to get the 70k bonus. My initial goal with MS was for miles/points, but now I'm open to other possibilities.
Thanks for any advice.
PRG (opened 7/3/13)
SPG (opened 4/6/14)
CSP (opened 4/18/14)
Ink Plus (opened 5/8/14) - wife's
Citi Plat (opened 5/19/14)
Citi Exec (opened 5/31/14) - cancelled
Chase Freedom - wife's (oldest card)
BOA Travel Rewards - oldest card
I'm thinking either the Old Amex Blue for 5% cb (my wife was very fond of this idea) or possibly the Ink in branch to get the 70k bonus. My initial goal with MS was for miles/points, but now I'm open to other possibilities.
Thanks for any advice.
I'm in a holding pattern until next month with my next applications.
Jul 29, 2014, 1:34 pm
#890
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: NYC
Posts: 111
Credit score is 784 according to credit karma, but 732 according to credit sesame. Why the big discrepancy?
Jul 29, 2014, 1:58 pm
#891
Join Date: May 2014
Location: LAX
Programs: AA, UA, DL, NSA, CIA, MIB
Posts: 537
Actually I wasn't trying to brag or start a pissing contest. I don't have all that many cards either and I've only been at this for a few months myself. I've taken very small steps because I'm going at it alone and I don't want to ever have to deal with trying to unload any more than 4 gift cards at one time. I know that means I'll be making extra trips to to unload them and that maybe it's not completely 'free' but it's what I choose to do. As long as I can keep doing what has been working for me I'm happy. I am now starting to make paths towards Serve(sans ISIS) and might look into TMobile Debit. But again, baby steps.
Jul 29, 2014, 6:29 pm
#892
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: The great Midwest
Programs: None
Posts: 67
One thing I always ask those about to get into MS is whether they are still carrying a CC balance and paying interest on it (including Balance Transfers, if any), and if they say yes, I'd tell them to tread lightly fwiw because charging a couple $Ks on their CCs when they're not certain how to turn them back to cash the quickest method possible means they may have to pay interest on that $amount. I have to remind them of the interests that CCCs charge is way, way more than what one will earn in CB or miles doing MS so it's a losing proposition no matter how you look at it. Having a float (aka available cash on hand to pay for CC bills when it's due) is one thing that one thing important to keep in mind before they decide to go on a "GC shopping spree" just because all others are doing it and said it's profitable (to them , what about you?).
, what about you?).
Jul 29, 2014, 8:42 pm
#893
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,269
U.S. bank new acct bonus -- fund with cc?
U.S. bank is offering $150 for a new account and is allowing you to fund with a credit card. Anybody know if that would be treated as a purchase or a cash advance? Does it depend on the credit card? I'd like to use Citi Exec card.
https://www.usbank.com/splash/poweru...x.html#150POWR
https://www.usbank.com/splash/poweru...x.html#150POWR
Jul 30, 2014, 5:43 am
#894
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,269
U.S. bank is offering $150 for a new account and is allowing you to fund with a credit card. Anybody know if that would be treated as a purchase or a cash advance? Does it depend on the credit card? I'd like to use Citi Exec card.
https://www.usbank.com/splash/poweru...x.html#150POWR
https://www.usbank.com/splash/poweru...x.html#150POWR
http://www.doctorofcredit.com/does-f...-cash-advance/
Jul 30, 2014, 7:22 pm
#895
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: NYC
Programs: SPG, Hyatt, HH, MR, Emirates
Posts: 48
U.S. bank is offering $150 for a new account and is allowing you to fund with a credit card. Anybody know if that would be treated as a purchase or a cash advance? Does it depend on the credit card? I'd like to use Citi Exec card.
https://www.usbank.com/splash/poweru...x.html#150POWR
https://www.usbank.com/splash/poweru...x.html#150POWR
Do you know the maximum you can deposit by CC?
Jul 31, 2014, 1:06 am
#896
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Pensacola
Programs: AAdvantage, BAEC
Posts: 17
I need help on deciding on what card to get next specifically for MS. I currently have:
PRG (opened 7/3/13)
SPG (opened 4/6/14)
CSP (opened 4/18/14)
Ink Plus (opened 5/8/14) - wife's
Citi Plat (opened 5/19/14)
Citi Exec (opened 5/31/14) - cancelled
Chase Freedom - wife's (oldest card)
BOA Travel Rewards - oldest card
I'm thinking either the Old Amex Blue for 5% cb (my wife was very fond of this idea) or possibly the Ink in branch to get the 70k bonus. My initial goal with MS was for miles/points, but now I'm open to other possibilities.
Thanks for any advice.
PRG (opened 7/3/13)
SPG (opened 4/6/14)
CSP (opened 4/18/14)
Ink Plus (opened 5/8/14) - wife's
Citi Plat (opened 5/19/14)
Citi Exec (opened 5/31/14) - cancelled
Chase Freedom - wife's (oldest card)
BOA Travel Rewards - oldest card
I'm thinking either the Old Amex Blue for 5% cb (my wife was very fond of this idea) or possibly the Ink in branch to get the 70k bonus. My initial goal with MS was for miles/points, but now I'm open to other possibilities.
Thanks for any advice.
Another thing would be to look at just how much MS you are planning on doing. The Ink does have a $50,000 5x limit after all. On the other hand, if you don't plan on doing tens of thousands in MS, the Ink bonus is HUGE.
Of course, you could just get both...
Jul 31, 2014, 9:13 am
#897
Join Date: May 2014
Location: LAX
Programs: AA, UA, DL, NSA, CIA, MIB
Posts: 537
EDIT: Just opened the account, shows up on my SPG Amex as "US BANK DIRECT BANK".
EDIT: Emailed rec from AMEX "Account Alert: Cash Withdrawal Transaction" Guess I'll call up USBank Customer Service.
EDIT: CSR at USBank doesn't know why I got the email from Amex. Suggested I call Amex. Now I have to figure out how to approach this one. *puts on thinking cap
Last edited by cajunguy; Jul 31, 2014 at 5:05 pm
Jul 31, 2014, 11:59 am
#898
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: NYC
Posts: 111
One thing you may want to consider when making this decision is the locations of Grocery/Drug Stores and Office Supply stores in relation to the roads and parts of town you frequent. Also, office supply GCs can be purchased online obviously, but say, in theory you already go to a drug store and applicable grocery store a couple of times a week, the time outlay in acquiring GCs from those locations would be virtually nil at this point.
Another thing would be to look at just how much MS you are planning on doing. The Ink does have a $50,000 5x limit after all. On the other hand, if you don't plan on doing tens of thousands in MS, the Ink bonus is HUGE.
Of course, you could just get both...
Another thing would be to look at just how much MS you are planning on doing. The Ink does have a $50,000 5x limit after all. On the other hand, if you don't plan on doing tens of thousands in MS, the Ink bonus is HUGE.
Of course, you could just get both...
Looking at my tracking spreadsheet, I did about 12k the first month, 35k last month (meeting min spend on a number of cards), and about 20k this month (much more reasonable amount). Unless I'm hitting sign up bonuses, I would just use easy, simple methods of MS. However, with the Amex Blue, I'd be tempted to max things.
I would apply to both cards, but do you think that with the recent apps I have, that I would be at risk of being rejected for either. If so, which should I apply to first?
Aug 1, 2014, 3:17 pm
#899
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 12
Thanks. I'm in NYC so I have a number of drug stores and office supply stores just a few blocks from both work and home.
Looking at my tracking spreadsheet, I did about 12k the first month, 35k last month (meeting min spend on a number of cards), and about 20k this month (much more reasonable amount). Unless I'm hitting sign up bonuses, I would just use easy, simple methods of MS. However, with the Amex Blue, I'd be tempted to max things.
I would apply to both cards, but do you think that with the recent apps I have, that I would be at risk of being rejected for either. If so, which should I apply to first?
Looking at my tracking spreadsheet, I did about 12k the first month, 35k last month (meeting min spend on a number of cards), and about 20k this month (much more reasonable amount). Unless I'm hitting sign up bonuses, I would just use easy, simple methods of MS. However, with the Amex Blue, I'd be tempted to max things.
I would apply to both cards, but do you think that with the recent apps I have, that I would be at risk of being rejected for either. If so, which should I apply to first?
Aug 1, 2014, 4:00 pm
#900
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 3,688
I'm sorry to hear you got shutdown by AP doing 2K a month, there really is no rhyme and reason for their shutdowns, unless you:
a. used the same credit card number to send to the person using the same CC information to send money to you;
b. used same bank account information;
c. your IP addy was flagged for being the same for the one sending and receiving.
If you did none of the above and still got shutdown, you may have been a victim of random shutdowns.