weero

No one needs an F experience. Even modern C seats are beyond what one needs for relaxation and comfort on are Earthly destinations.
It really does sound like it. That MUC is much smoother for coach pax than FRA is for people in Biz seems not to matter. Only that C suffers and F does not in FRA and that Y suffers a whole lot more than C is perceived a true privilege.

Much like an egalitarian antidote ... the former are happier if everyone is worse off as long as no one has a better experience and the latter are happy of they have an inferior experience as long as the rest has an even worse one....

TheBOSman

I note you said "modern C seats" and not "LH's C seats" .

SFO777

No one needs a C experience either. The back of the plane arrives at just about the same time as the front or middle of the plane.

NA-Flyer

TheBOSman

The true glory of the F experience; not having to sprint off the plane to get to immigration first!

Big_Foot

God, you are scaring me! Flying next week and having high hopes
for the new F lounge. Hopefully it will not be that bad...

SFO777

Outbound LAX-MUC will be fine, as long as you are not in 1D or 1G, aka the loo seats. It's the MUC-LAX return that is the problem.

Guava

I agree that LH F on flights less than 10 hours are overkill. If F is an experience for you regardless how often you fly, then you can't do LH F justice for anything less than 10 hours. My LH F experience are considerably more enjoyable on ultra-long haul vs. flights to US East Coast. For one thing, the FA can get a little nervous if you do not wish to eat right away after boarding. They are worried due to short flight time even though they may not say it but it's written on their face.

Ber2dca

From a business point of view, given the advancements in business class (which is arguably now more comfortable in many cases than first class was 25 years ago) and the introduction of PE, there is a point where F is a pure vanity project both from a branding point of view and a pax point of view.

LH, given its self-regard, would probably never cull F entirely but it's quite simple math that extra PA and Y seats that you can reliably fill with paying customers beat a much smaller number of often empty F seats (or F filled with non-paying customers) in terms of the money coming in. And I imagine it's not easy to fill F with paying customers on the shorter long-haul routes because most in the target audience will think C is enough for that flight length.

There are some people on here who at times seem to confuse airplanes with boutique luxury hotels, but at the end of the day it's commercial transportation i.e. applied logistics and not a wish fulfillment vehicle for those fascinated by luxury.

divjan

i can not believe that there is a even a discussion about MUC and how the pax are handled be it Y or premium
i have been using MUC as a preferred airport since 1999 as well as LH First class product and have nothing but praise on how MUC treats their pax, would choose MUC any time over FRA, especially when connecting

my comment and advice to the picture of the boarding scrum=too early at gate, stay in lounge an extra 20min to avoid that->my usually solution when I dont want to mix with "unwashed masses"

tng11

Not terribly surprised they're scrapping F on some of these A330 routes - but surprised on JFK since the loads on both FRA and the MUC flights are always high.

Routes like YYZ and YUL have absolutely dismal F passenger numbers - the both times I flew to/from YUL in LH F, I was the only passenger booked in the F cabin on an award ticket and other passengers in the cabin were op-ups. Checking most dates close to departure, both routes either have empty F cabin or 1 passenger booked. No surprise LH is getting more out of selling an additional 47 seats in place of a cabin that is mostly being filled by op-ups and award tickets.

Granted, this is no big loss to me considering that I always route through the USA to get F to FRA (YYZ lost it some time ago). FRA has the better aircraft (74H/388), better lounges and overall experience.

Germanfflyer

Do you really think they would have a special configuration of the A330 just for JFK?

TheBOSman

NYC always thinks it is the center of the universe though .

oliver2002

As do people who fly F on points

TheBOSman

Hey I resemble that remark!

I've only flown LH F on trips involving BOS though. Though I have flown the MUC-BOS (on a day when FRA-BOS wasn't operating at all), so I'm personally slightly miffed about the change unless LH operates FRA-BOS daily this winter (unlike winter 2015). Doesn't affect me as much here in AUS now of course, but at least JFK won't be losing the F to FRA too like BOS did for a few days that winter.