Flyingbiker

We were booked KRK LHR on 21st of this month and when we arrived in WAW we were delayed then cancelled until early morning on 22nd. The ground staff quoted technical issues. We were put in a hotel at the airport then checked out for an early morning flight, this was also delayed by just under 4 hours due to technical issues. Wrote to LOT requiring compensation and they responded that no claim is justified as the delay was due to
"We would like to emphasise the cancellation and delay of the said flights was caused by the reasons beyond carrier’s control – unexpected flight safety shortcomings."
Is this a valid response from them or should I chase this and how?

dj_jay_smith

This could be a valid reason, but I suggest that you chase anyway. As they could just be trying to get out of their commitments.

Write back and state that you do not accep their reason, and that staff locally told you at the time of cancellation that it was a technical reason not a flight safety reason and that you expect them to pay according to EU law.

If they don't, then you will have to go through the Polish civil aviation authority who would regulate this for LOT.

warakorn

LOT can be sued in British court, as well.

We are talking about two delays of more than 4 hours. That cannot an extraordinary circumstance.

Lack

Write a complaint to the local authority - ULC. They'll get to the bottom of the airlines reasoning.
Was it a 734 flight? Those are the oldest frames in their park and with only three in the fleet, there's no replacement. One goes out of service, and LHR/BRU/TLV/IST can get a rolling set of delays/cancellations which is anything but extraordinary circumstance.

oliver2002

LO has retired their 734 earlier this year and moved SP-LLE, LLF and LLG to LO Charter:
http://www.airfleets.net/flottecie/L...20Airlines.htm

They leased two Canjet 738s but they seem to do only charters (LO7xxx):
http://www.flightradar24.com/data/airplanes/C-FYQN
http://www.flightradar24.com/data/airplanes/C-FYQO

Its seems the OPs LO flight was operated by SP-LLE, which was running late for days before 21JUL:

http://www.flightradar24.com/reg/splle

So LO LHR knew very well that this flight was late, especially since they changed the departure time to 1240 early in the morning:


View Screen Capture

Question is if the OP asked for alternative transport to KRK in LHR itself.

Lack

They're just pained that way (just another sign of neglect). LOT.com still lists them in the fleet (not that their website is a trustworthy source).
Plus like you listed, they're doing mainline routes, no time left for charters.

Flyingbiker

Thanks for the wealth of info up there, I am in the process of writing to them and the civil aviation authority. I asked for proof that the delay was due top extraordinary circumstance a week ago and they have not responded, I guess that is their tactic, we will see how we go. One thing though, the list above pertains to the aircraft that actually flew the morning flightfrom WAW to LHR , delayed on the 22nd. Any ideas which ac was scheduled for the 1515 flight on 21st? This would be the one that was technical.

Flyingbiker

Just got a response from LOT ( see below) and I am very surprised, is an engine failure not reasonable grounds for compensation?
It is disappointing to learn that you remain unsatisfied with LOT Polish Airlines’ response.


Although we endeavour to resolve such matters amicably, we also realise that this may not always be possible, and a review of the situation has not changed our response.



Please be informed that flight LO279 was cancelled due to engine aircraft failure.



The technical fault of the aircraft planned to operate the flight was detected immediately prior to departure and required immediate repair in Warsaw. It was unavoidable and could have impinged on flight safety, what indicates extraordinary circumstances which exempt the carrier from the obligation to pay compensation.



While the flight LO281 was delayed due to aircraft damage caused by airport boarding sleeve.



In this situation the carrier the carrier undertook efforts and actions to minimise the disruption by choosing different aircraft to operate the flight.



We would like to emphasize that LOT Polish Airlines perform all maintenance checks of operated planes in accordance with the law, international regulations and the producer’s recommendations. The objective of such checks is to exclude the possibility of technical fault occurrence. There are situations, however, when the avoidance of a technical problem is impossible.



At the same time kindly be informed that we do not submit the technical reports to passengers. Such confidential information may be provided by operational or technical department to authorized institutions only.

oliver2002

Time to activate the EU261 enforcement body, they will have access to that data

Tsun

This is their standard way to dodge paying compensation. Report to Polish Civil Aviation office, and if they still won't yield, go to court, this should be pretty straightforward case.

Flyingbiker

Have just sent the full communication to the Polish Civil Aviation, let s see how that goes....

TPJ

This might me useful:

http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/legal_servic.../07c549_en.pdf

[quote]

The fact that an air carrier has complied with the minimum
rules on maintenance of an aircraft cannot in
itself suffice to establish that that carrier
has taken all reasonable measures to relieve that carrier of its obligation to pay compensation.

[unquote]

Mechanical problem is not an 'extraordinary situation'.

Flyingbiker

Still plugging away with this, downloaded the form from Polish Civil Aviation;
http://www.ulc.gov.pl/en/passengers-...ng-a-complaint
Filled in full details and sent it off on 6th of this month, followed up 2 days back but no response whatsoever. All communications sent to;
[email protected]
Any ideas anybody?

olekorlo

is it possible to send it by email? they always asked me to do it by normal mail.
And 2 days... c'mon they have at least 14 days to respond but they are quite fast so no worries.

Germanfflyer

Mechanical reasons other than bird strike are NEVER (this has been rules many times by the EU high court) a reason not to pay EU 261 - the authorities will not get you your money - you will need to sue them.

There are many online agency's offering this if you do not want to do it yourself.