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Old Jul 12, 12, 4:42 pm   #1
 
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FRA-TLV going from L/H to S/H - How do you feel about it? [merged]

while looking at the booking system at lufthansa.com

it seems no more F on TLV-FRA
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Old Jul 12, 12, 5:05 pm   #2
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by photographer2012 View Post
while looking at the booking system at lufthansa.com

it seems no more F on TLV-FRA
Yes, there's no F on the A32S that will be serving the route.
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Old Jul 12, 12, 5:17 pm   #3
 
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Yes, there's no F on the A32S that will be serving the route.
it seems as it's going to be A330 on TLV-FRA and A320 TLV-MUC

the lufthansa.com/expedia systems and the winter schedule 12-13 topic in this group show A330.

but for some reason it's also been published (at an Israeli website) they are changing all routs to A320/1

but still....not able to book F on TLV-FRA. (but for some reason it lets you book F on A320 TLV-MUC this winter)
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Old Jul 12, 12, 5:30 pm   #4
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Originally Posted by photographer2012 View Post
while looking at the booking system at lufthansa.com

it seems no more F on TLV-FRA
Ah crap.
We're booked JFK-FRA-TLV in F on 12/28-29 returning 1/6.
Still showing a 330 but F is now zero'd out.
4 hours in a 320/321 Y seat masquerading as J? I don't think so.
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Old Jul 12, 12, 11:55 pm   #5
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I think if true (and I read this on the israeli new site as well) it's a really bad move on LH's behalf.

The route has offered a L/H product for years and while I'm sure people can live with losing F on a 4 hour flight, losing the L/H business is a very different matter.

I know plenty of Senators traveling the route for connections and i can't see them sticking with LH if the route goes S/H.
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Old Jul 13, 12, 2:05 am   #6
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FRA TLV will stay three class, too much business at stake, LH knows that.

To the original question, LH currently has 6 340-300 aircraft configured to be 2 class, they do fixed service to various destinations already.

The new two class 744 and 343 (with new C) are yet to be refitted into a two class config, so you won't see any appearing in the schedules till the Summer 2013 plan is published.
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Old Jul 13, 12, 4:16 am   #7
 
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Originally Posted by oliver2002 View Post
FRA TLV will stay three class, too much business at stake, LH knows that.

To the original question, LH currently has 6 340-300 aircraft configured to be 2 class, they do fixed service to various destinations already.

The new two class 744 and 343 (with new C) are yet to be refitted into a two class config, so you won't see any appearing in the schedules till the Summer 2013 plan is published.

do you have any idea why you cant book F in the LH website for this winter on TLV-FRA?

do all LH A330 have F class?
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Old Jul 13, 12, 6:57 am   #8
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Originally Posted by photographer2012 View Post
do all LH A330 have F class?
Yes, they do.
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Old Jul 13, 12, 7:13 am   #9
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Originally Posted by photographer2012 View Post
do you have any idea why you cant book F in the LH website for this winter on TLV-FRA?
Good question. Can't book F and F is zero'd out across the board in December and January. Oliver, this smells like they are indeed going to dump F and just haven't updated the schedule to sub 320/321s.



I tried booking F on LH.com and I got this...

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Old Jul 13, 12, 7:58 am   #10
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Originally Posted by oliver2002 View Post
FRA TLV will stay three class, too much business at stake, LH knows
Like I said in another thread, I think people can live without F on the 4 hour flight, but going from a L/H to a S/H product is a very different story.
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Old Jul 13, 12, 8:08 am   #11
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TLV is the only destination in that area they serve with longhaul, recently CAI and previously AMM lost the widebody service. If there is revenue to be had, its in the TLV sector, surely LH knows that. I doubt the DL/CO(UA)/US direct TATL services have hit LH that badly. Who knows. If Easyjet and co kill the yield to TLV ex Europe then filling the widebody and making money on it may convince LH to deploy their aircraft some place else. We all don't know or see the figures they have.
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Old Jul 13, 12, 8:18 am   #12
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Originally Posted by clubman View Post
Like I said in another thread, I think people can live without F on the 4 hour flight, but going from a L/H to a S/H product is a very different story.
+1
I can live with long-haul Business from FRA but no way would I put up with 4+ hours in a Y seat sold as C. At least LX still offers long-haul C and BA has three class F on one of its daily LHR flights.

Quote:
Originally Posted by oliver2002 View Post
If there is revenue to be had, its in the TLV sector, surely LH knows that. I doubt the DL/CO(UA)/US direct TATL services have hit LH that badly. Who knows. If Easyjet and co kill the yield to TLV ex Europe then filling the widebody and making money on it may convince LH to deploy their aircraft some place else. We all don't know or see the figures they have.
Makes sense and perhaps this is what we're now seeing.
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Old Jul 13, 12, 3:12 pm   #13
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oliver2002 View Post
TLV is the only destination in that area they serve with longhaul, recently CAI and previously AMM lost the widebody service. If there is revenue to be had, its in the TLV sector, surely LH knows that. I doubt the DL/CO(UA)/US direct TATL services have hit LH that badly. Who knows. If Easyjet and co kill the yield to TLV ex Europe then filling the widebody and making money on it may convince LH to deploy their aircraft some place else. We all don't know or see the figures they have.
I am asking myself if LH maybe canibalized itself by introducing MUC with a long haul plane. Why bother flying via FRA if I can fly via MUC and I am sure a big portion of european connecting traffic decided to fly via MUC instead on the day flight. What I hope they will do is to offer BER-TLV and MUC-TLV with short haul planes catering to leasure / non premium traffic with goal to operate them as profitable O & D traffic and continue to offer a premium service with a 3 class product on both daily flights via FRA anythig else would not make sense considering the high ratio of HON's and SEN's living in Israel.
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Old Jul 13, 12, 7:18 pm   #14
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Originally Posted by LXA350 View Post
I am asking myself if LH maybe canibalized itself by introducing MUC with a long haul plane. Why bother flying via FRA if I can fly via MUC and I am sure a big portion of european connecting traffic decided to fly via MUC instead on the day flight. What I hope they will do is to offer BER-TLV and MUC-TLV with short haul planes catering to leasure / non premium traffic with goal to operate them as profitable O & D traffic and continue to offer a premium service with a 3 class product on both daily flights via FRA anythig else would not make sense considering the high ratio of HON's and SEN's living in Israel.
The MUC-TLV flight is indeed changing to the short-haul 321, effective October 28.
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Old Jul 14, 12, 4:24 am   #15
 
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Originally Posted by SFO777 View Post
The MUC-TLV flight is indeed changing to the short-haul 321, effective October 28.
this is a fact, the question is the rumours about the FRA flights
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