Another thing is that I have way over 100,000 FF miles with Delta and could not use them R/T from ATL-BKK no matter what partnering airlines were involved. Tried everything and could find nothing. Sure, if you want to fly Air France through Paris for 240,000 FF Miles then they may have something. Since Korean is one of their partnering airlines I would have figured that Skymiles seats would have been available.
I'm beginning to think that the FF miles programs are a total fraud with all airlines. Maybe the FAA or Consumer Protection Agency should look into these bogus practices.
I think you're overstating your case a bit here. As a data point, I've been using DL SkyMiles to claim two or three First Class or Business Class award tickets on Singapore Airlines ATL-BKK every year since 2005. Have a look in the Delta forum and you'll find lots of info on how to use DL miles for award travel to Asia. I've had better luck with SQ than with KE, which unfortunately has award-travel blackout dates around the times I usually want to go. I've also flown KE ATL-ICN-BKK (and other routes) in Business and Economy and have had no complaints. I actually think KE is rather under-rated.
I think you're overstating your case a bit here. As a data point, I've been using DL SkyMiles to claim two or three First Class or Business Class award tickets on Singapore Airlines ATL-BKK every year since 2005. Have a look in the Delta forum and you'll find lots of info on how to use DL miles for award travel to Asia. I've had better luck with SQ than with KE, which unfortunately has award-travel blackout dates around the times I usually want to go. I've also flown KE ATL-ICN-BKK (and other routes) in Business and Economy and have had no complaints. I actually think KE is rather under-rated.
Well, first thing is that you have to be a Delta Medallion member, either Silver, Gold, or Platinum to upgrade. I have regular Medallion member status as most of my miles were accumulated over a year ago and my Silver Medallion status expired.
Secondly, I had no idea that, as a premium Medallion member, you could upgrade on any other airline (including partnering airlines) except on Delta flights. This must be something that has changed recently.
Thirdly, you cannot utilize Skymiles to upgrade on any other airline except Delta. I confirmed that with Delta a few weeks ago. Also, if you want to use Skymiles to upgrade on Delta you have to have a full fare economy ticket which is about twice as expensive as a discount ticket.
It's nice to know that you have been able to utilize your Skymiles to get award tickets in Business or First Class, on partnering airlines and I assume also on Delta. Unfortunately, for the rest of the 99% traveling folks, this is not an option. 99% of traveling folks don't have corporations paying for full fare economy or even business and first class for them. That is probably the only reason that you and your fellow travelers can afford the outrageous costs associated with business or first class. Now, if I don't currently have enough Skymiles, according to Delta's rigged requirements that don't conform with their written policies, to obtain an economy class ticket US - Southeast Asia, then I sure as hell don't have enough Skymiles to obtain a business or First Class ticket, do I?
My beef is with Delta Airline's written policies that do not conform with what they actually practice. Can Delta show me 1 seat availability at any time, on their airline or any of their partnering airlines in economy class, wherein I can use 30K, 60K, or 90K worth of Skymiles R/T US - Southeast Asia? I actually sat at the computer 1 entire day and entered 100s of scenarios. I also called Delta's reservations department. Not 1 available seat for either 30K, 60K, or 90K on Delta or any of their partnering airlines. And, I tried booking up to a year in advance just for drill.
With regard to Korean Airlines. Again, my beef is not with KE's service, professionalism, on-time scheduling, the quality of its aircraft, etc. KE is as good or possibly somewhat better than most airlines in these catagories. Certainly they are lightyears better than just about any US carrier. My beef is not only Korean's but just about all carriers "cattlecar" seating in economy class. I don't care whether it's 31 inch seat pitch or 34 inch seat pitch. The absence of any type of comfort quality and the total disregard for their economy passengers would be shocking if it were not the norm in this industry.
If the airline industry were serious about service to their customers, which they are not as their priorities are all in the wrong place, they would get rid of both business and first class. Use the space to expand the economy class section and thereby give adequate comfort to all of its passengers. If it means charging a little bit more per ticket so be it. And, don't say that it can't be done for profit circumstances. I used to fly a lot in the Middle East. I flew Gulf Air, a major carrier, mostly in economy class. Their economy class was the most comfortable I have ever experienced. Plenty of legroom, wide soft seats, and a sense of space throughout the cabin. I was never uncomfortable flying from Bahrain to Europe. And, Gulf also had business and first class cabins.
I used to work in the airline industry for a major private carrier with over 75 aircraft. Never have I seen such a total lack of caring as I see these days. Most of the airlines would go out of business if it were not for government subsidies and they would deserve to. Let's clue the airlines in to the human condition that exists in 2009. Most of the world practices egalitarian principals, or at least makes an effort to. We no longer have royalty in most countries. Dukes, Earls, and Princes are out of style. Certainly the US has a history of rejecting class systems. Why then do these airlines continue to perpetuate a class system in their mode of transportation which does not serve any equitable purpose except to please the very few and make the rest uncomfortable and as a result pretty angry.
Last edited by Floridathunderstorm; Apr 21, 09 at 10:03 pm.
It looks like the 77W flights are showing up on NW for WP redemptions, given they are one of the few true flatbed options on Skyteam this will be a good option to check out. But why the 2x3x2 layout? If you're going to go fully flat, why not get rid of the middle seat too?
BTW, anyone with pictures of these new seats?
Well, first thing is that you have to be a Delta Medallion member, either Silver, Gold, or Platinum to upgrade. I have regular Medallion member status as most of my miles were accumulated over a year ago and my Silver Medallion status expired.
You have to be a Medallion to get complimentary domestic upgrades. You do not have to be a Medallion to use miles to upgrade on either domestic or international flights. I don't know what you mean by "regular Medallion," if your Silver status has expired. Medallion is the elite level, and you're either Silver, Gold, Platinum, or not a Medallion at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Floridathunderstorm
Secondly, I had no idea that, as a premium Medallion member, you could upgrade on any other airline (including partnering airlines) except on Delta flights. This must be something that has changed recently.
Thirdly, you cannot utilize Skymiles to upgrade on any other airline except Delta. I confirmed that with Delta a few weeks ago. Also, if you want to use Skymiles to upgrade on Delta you have to have a full fare economy ticket which is about twice as expensive as a discount ticket.
Again, confused as to the meaning of "premium Medallion." You can use SkyMiles to upgrade on certain partners, such as Singapore. I believe it's available on Air France too. No, you do not have to buy a full-fare economy ticket to upgrade. Domestic upgrades are available in Y, B, M, H, Q, or K fare classes. K is not altogether expensive on some routes. It might be double a deeply discounted sale fare in T class, true, but most K fares are not exactly crazy if you consider you're getting the upgrade confirmed. For international, you can upgrade from Y, B, or M fares on Delta. Y is full-fare economy. M is usually somewhere in the range of half of full-fare economy. Y USA-Europe might run around $4000, M usually around $2200. Depending on seasons, you can get so-called "discounted" fares for $1000 or even less, if you hunt around. More or less the same to Asia.
As for award seat availability using SkyMiles on Delta and its partners, including Korean Air, see this thread with over 1000 posts regarding success finding award seats.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Floridathunderstorm
It's nice to know that you have been able to utilize your Skymiles to get award tickets in Business or First Class, on partnering airlines and I assume also on Delta. Unfortunately, for the rest of the 99% traveling folks, this is not an option. 99% of traveling folks don't have corporations paying for full fare economy or even business and first class for them. That is probably the only reason that you and your fellow travelers can afford the outrageous costs associated with business or first class. Now, if I don't currently have enough Skymiles, according to Delta's rigged requirements that don't conform with their written policies, to obtain an economy class ticket US - Southeast Asia, then I sure as hell don't have enough Skymiles to obtain a business or First Class ticket, do I?
I don't use my Skymiles for awards on Delta. Earn on Delta, burn on Singapore or Korean Air. With a few exceptions for business travel from time to time, I pay for my own tickets with my own cash. No corporation has ever paid for me to fly Business. I have paid my own way in Business and, on rare occasion, in First. You just have to be a careful shopper. Pre-merger Northwest used to run fare sales in discounted business class USA-Asia for under $3000. I hope Delta does the same. Thanks to FlyerTalk, I purchased an upcoming Business Class ticket through a travel agent and paid a little over half of what Northwest wanted for the same ticket at nwa.com. FlyerTalk has also pointed me toward a number of other good fares and good strategies for finding good fares.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Floridathunderstorm
If the airline industry were serious about service to their customers, which they are not as their priorities are all in the wrong place, they would get rid of both business and first class. Use the space to expand the economy class section and thereby give adequate comfort to all of its passengers. If it means charging a little bit more per ticket so be it. And, don't say that it can't be done for profit circumstances. I used to fly a lot in the Middle East. I flew Gulf Air, a major carrier, mostly in economy class. Their economy class was the most comfortable I have ever experienced. Plenty of legroom, wide soft seats, and a sense of space throughout the cabin. I was never uncomfortable flying from Bahrain to Europe. And, Gulf also had business and first class cabins.
I used to work in the airline industry for a major private carrier with over 75 aircraft. Never have I seen such a total lack of caring as I see these days. Most of the airlines would go out of business if it were not for government subsidies and they would deserve to. Let's clue the airlines in to the human condition that exists in 2009. Most of the world practices egalitarian principals, or at least makes an effort to. We no longer have royalty in most countries. Dukes, Earls, and Princes are out of style. Certainly the US has a history of rejecting class systems. Why then do these airlines continue to perpetuate a class system in their mode of transportation which does not serve any equitable purpose except to please the very few and make the rest uncomfortable and as a result pretty angry.
Airlines eliminating First and Business class altogether, particularly for long-haul international travel, just isn't going to happen. First might go, as it has on Delta and certain other carriers, but some premium class is going to be around for a long time. I won't get into the class warfare aspect of these comments.
Now, what all this has to do with Korean Air's new 77W ICN-BKK is beyond me.
the first class looks way different from the current one. but the new business class looks pretty much the same except wider and it can go 180 degree lie-flat
the first class looks way different from the current one. but the new business class looks pretty much the same except wider and it can go 180 degree lie-flat
Agreed. I wonder how much of a modification of the existing seats the new business seats will be. Can they keep the basic structure of the existing seats, spread them out a bit more, and adjust the reclining mechanism? Or do they have to rip 'em out entirely and put in brand new stuff? The existing seats are fairly new (some might tut-tut about being last-generation), so it'd be a shame to have to dispose of them.
Agreed. I wonder how much of a modification of the existing seats the new business seats will be. Can they keep the basic structure of the existing seats, spread them out a bit more, and adjust the reclining mechanism? Or do they have to rip 'em out entirely and put in brand new stuff? The existing seats are fairly new (some might tut-tut about being last-generation), so it'd be a shame to have to dispose of them.
i think they're putting the new generation seats on newer aircrafts and on older aircrafts that haven't been refitted yet like the A330's and the other 777's
looks like KE is increasing the "Korean Air" letters on their newer aircrafts. there's a thread in airliners.net about it and imo it looks good. it doesn't look so bad like some people are saying. i saw a pic of KE's new 77W as well and it looks like they've increased the logo size on the engines also. which i also think looks good
looks like KE is increasing the "Korean Air" letters on their newer aircrafts. there's a thread in airliners.net about it and imo it looks good. it doesn't look so bad like some people are saying. i saw a pic of KE's new 77W as well and it looks like they've increased the logo size on the engines also. which i also think looks good
Link to photos? I searched airliners.net and didn't spot any.
