beaubo

Well, the speculation about WHETHER KL will merge their FFP with AF is officially over, as per the quote in the FD newsletter I just received.


"Last but not least, it is the intention to launch a new, joint Air France-KLM frequent flyer program in the course of 2005, which will ensure that members will hold one card giving them access to an even wider range of airline and non-airline partners with whom they can earn and spend Miles. "

At this point, the speculation will shift to HOW will the merger be implemented.
I'll be curious to find out if PEs will maintain their exemplary array of benefits.

Here's hoping

alanw

Shall we commence the panic now, or wait?

Jenbel

Panic now I think. Much more fun, and saves time and effort later on.

onlysuites

Panic now !!

Any guesses as to which of AF's levels they will put PE's, GE's & SE's?

pmcg

Shall we start organising the "Mileage Spending Runs" just now?

Maybe we could have some FT KLM meets all over the place and expire the miles in everyones accounts.

I for one would bail out if they make significant changes.

EWANMEBABE

See you on the other side Pat, I am already there. With the track record of KLM for sure its all history now.

mike turnbull

Not being a member of the current Air France scheme, would anybody care to guess the 'Good news and Bad news' when the new scheme is introduced...likely to be the same, better or worse ?? What is better about the AF scheme..(or worse) ? I for one, am worried that the FD scheme will be watered down.

graraps

As far as I understand it, the best part of F+ is that you don't have to spend 80% of your life on a bloody plane to become a top-level elite. IIRC it's 40k for people who don't live in France. Flying economy, that's 3 long-haul round-trips or 10 European ones...That's what it gives it the edge! Contrary, I imagine I would have to spend with LH an amount equal or even greater to what I make over the year just to get SEN status!

The worst that can happen with the FFP merger is the creation of a totally different programme that is more "competitive" with LH and BA, excluding cheap fares from meaningful mileage earning and moving elite qualification levels up. I have a feeling that this will happen indeed!
What next? American-style "you can't get into the lounge even if you're an elite unless you buy a membership"? Oh wait, KL have already started this! I am sure AF will take the particular cost-cutting idea even further!

hfly

Gee, someone who flies 37,500 in Biz on KLM gets PM in a year. I really don't see how that beats flying 40k on AF at the end of the day, especially if you live in France. Then again the benefits which AF gives its top tier customers are less as well.

Then again I want top tiers to have to fly a lot, I do not want to be lumped in with the proletariat that thinks that three long haul RT's is Frequent Flying.

My biggest quandary will be whether to maintain two seperate top tier Skyteam accounts or not!?!

stut

Anyone any idea what the redemption levels are like? I can find precious little info on airfrance.fr...

Should I be spending my KLM miles now, or will it not matter so much?

graraps

40k in ECO. Just 20 in biz. You're quite fortunate if you can afford to always pick and choose the class you are flying in

You are right that 3 long hauls probably doesn't constitute very frequent flying, but my guess is that most people primariliy fly short-haul. Unless there are segment qualification criteria (which I believe isn't the case with F+), AF should keep the mileage requirements where they are now (after all 40k is 20 European roundtrips and that isn't infrequent!)...As people on the DL forum have noted, chasing volume flyers makes good sense. The relentless pursuit of the FatCat intercontinental premium class FF as excercised by other airlines probably isn't very clever, since these people don't tend to care that much about FFP benefits (as they get them included in their full first/biz fares).

JOUY31

F+ does have segment qualification criteria :
- 15 segments for Bleu
- 30 segments for Rouge
For French F+ members, domestic segments (as opposed to miles earned on domestic flights for mileage based qualification) are not taken into account for segment based qualification.

graraps

My understanding is that levels are similar but that KL has more offers like the webaward thingy. Redemption levels are valid throughout Skyteam, so you could always do a bit of digging at www.csa.cz/en or www.aeromexico.com.mx (don't go to Korean as it seems like they beg to differ!)

graraps

Thanks for pointing this out! I have to keep guessing, as there is so little on F+ that I can check online! Could you run a little comparison of the programmes?

JOUY31

AF country-specific websites, such as www.airfrance.co.uk or www.airfrance.nl (which can all be reached through www.airfrance.com) list the requirement for travel from the country to AF destinations in Tempo (coach) class, under the SkyTeam award scheme:

- requirements for l'Espace Affaires (business class) are 150% to 160% of the miles required for Tempo
- requirements for l'Espace Premiere (first class) are twice the miles required for Tempo

For award travel without being restricted to award fare buckets ("opti-miles" scheme), requirements are twice the amount needed for the SkyTeam award scheme. This scheme is valid on AF flights only, although IIRC, DL has a similar scheme.