mojo2121

Thanks for the advice - ill have to check that out. Still leaning towards traveling the night before, spending the day in Kyoto and heading to Tokyo that night (we are more night than morning people re: taking the early morning train to Tokyo the following day - though I suppose we could sleep on the train...). Would a hotel keep our luggage checked during the day or is there a place at the train station to keep it?

Interesting to hear about karaoke. Where/what is a good night life thing to experience while there?

Thanks all for the help thus far.

DanielW

Just looking at a quick trip to Kyoto too. Does this look like a good deal?

http://www.japanican.com/en/tour/detail/VJOPENTK/

LapLap

It used to be a better deal for two people travelling together (for the same price a night in a modest hotel was included) but this may still be the most economic way of visiting Kyoto from Tokyo using the bullet trains.

It doesn't say whether you can use the Nozomi train but even if it is Hikari only this represents a significant saving on the cost of a return trip (around 26,500yen).

Do factor in the following before you make your decision:
Cost of return trips from your arrival/departure airport to Tokyo.
Cost of transit within Tokyo and how many trips will be made using JR (will depend on location of your hotel)
Cost of other planned day trips/excursions
Subtract this amount from 7,300yen
Then decide if the remaining total is money worth spending on keeping your options open should you wish to make a spontaneous trip somewhere.

A rough example of what I mean is as follows:
An option for many travellers visiting Tokyo via NRT is the Suica & N'EX pass which is 5,500yen return and includes 2,000yen worth of credit for travel within Tokyo. It is similar to the actual value of a JRPass if using it to get to and from Tokyo and make journeys within the city (assuming that your hotel has access to a JR line).
Going on this, and on the assumption that your trip is a short one, by buying a JRpass for 28,300yen you would effectively be paying 1,800yen to keep the option of travelling nearly anywhere on a whim open vs the 21,000yen Japanican tour plus 5,500yen Suica + N'EX return ticket.

Note that the minimum cost of getting to and from NRT is 2,000yen return by bus and one can travel within Tokyo with about 500yen per day. It is cheaper to get into Tokyo from HND. In other words, if you are really frugal and plan carefully, the most the Japanican tour can save you is about 4,500 yen (give or take 500yen).

DanielW

Thanks, Laplap. Not used to all these options and systems for catching a train! As well as getting to see Kyoto, I want to take the Shinkansen/Bullet Train for the first time. I think the JRpass excludes the fastest Shinkansen though (Nozumi)?

I double checked with Japanican about any restrictions on time/train etc., and from their response there doesn't seem to be(?).

LapLap

Thanks for clarifying, I guess that is some compensation for the excursion round trip tickets dumping the accommodation part of the deal (a Nozomi option used to be available for an extra cost)

The Nozomi is only about 20 minutes faster than the Hikari, a difference you will be oblivious to when travelling. The other upsides to travelling via Nozomi are more frequent trains (every ten minutes vs every half hour but you may be restricted to a particular train anyway, if so this benefit is negated with the Japanican issued ticket), and potentially less crowded cars, but by booking in advance you would almost certainly have a reserved seat anyway.

Factor in what losing 40 minutes (20 minutes x 2) of travel time really means when weighed up alongside the other factors I mentioned (principally the opportunity to be spontaneous) before you make your decision.
You'll see Nozomi trains on the platform regardless and can take pictures of yourself standing next to them.

I travelled on a series E5 Hayabusa Shinkansen from Sendai to Tokyo not so long ago. The actual seat and carriage used were exactly the same as on the slower E2 Hayate train used to travel North, only the engine at the front was different.

mojo2121

Goes back to Tokyo for a bit, is the Conrad a good location for seeing the sites on Odaiba island, the fish market, taking in some of the nightlife, etc?

yellow_peril

I think that now they use the same N700 trains for nearly all the Hikari services too, it is only the number of stations they stop at that changes. There is a new train in the same series (N700A?) that goes between Tokyo and Kyoto but from the outside the only difference is the sticker!

op487062

Conrad is within walking distance of Tsukiji. Leave early, expect to be at the market by 430am if you want to get in. Odaiba is a short monorail ride from the hotel. nightlife? depends where you want to go.

ksandness

Night life? It's tricky. Since you're with your wife, the hostess bars are probably not the best destination.
There are bars that cater to the expense account crowd, with an emphasis on the expense. There are bars that operate like private clubs and will not let you in unless you're with a regular.

Aside from hotel bars, you'll probably want to check out discos and so-called "live houses," where rock, pop, folk or jazz ensembles play. Larger venues host international acts; Western musicians in all genres from classical to hard rock play Tokyo.

Your guidebook (have you bought it yet?) can provide information on which venues are foreigner-friendly. In addition, the English-language press has listings of what's happening around town.

mojo2121

Thanks a lot for the additional feedback all!

Regardless of time spent in Kyoto, I am still planning on going there right from NRT when we arrive. Problem is, our flight gets in at 5:20pm. Is that enough time make it through customs, get your bags, etc and still catch a bullet train out there that night? A brief attempted search of the train schedules made it look kinda tight...

evergrn

You should be good, although you'll get into Kyoto fairly late. Worst-case scenario from gate to train platform at NRT is ~1hr with checked bags. Since you're probably not too familiar with NRT and since I presume you're going to stop by ATM and then stop by JR Office to redeem JR Pass and/or get train tix, add on 30min. Anyways, if your flight arrives on time, I think you'll have no problem catching the 6.48pm Narita Express to Tokyo. The only potential concern is the time required at JR Travel Office where a line can go from nothing to 15min long in a matter of a few minutes sometimes.

At Tokyo Sta, you'll transfer to 8.10p Nozomi shinkansen (arrives Kyoto 10.48p) if you're not using JR Pass. If using JR Pass, you'll wait for the 8.40p Hikari shinkansen (arrives Kyoto 11.21p).

EDIT:
Sorry... if you're using the JR Pass, the best thing to do is to do either of the following:
1). 6.48p NEx from NRT to Shinagawa (arrives at 7.58p), then transfer to Hikari leaving Shinagawa 8.10p for Kyoto (arrives at 11.01p).
2). 7.12p NEx from NRT to Tokyo (arrives at 8.13p), then transfer to Hikari leaving Tokyo 8.40p for Kyoto (arrives at 11.21p).

For your peace of mind, I'd just plan on doing the second option. Make sure you recheck that the above trains exist on the day of your travel. Train schedules can sometimes differ a little bit depending on whether it's weekday, weekend or holiday.

abmj-jr

That 8:40 pm Hikari seems to stop service after January of this year. After that, the 8: 03 pm, from Tokyo, or 8:10 pm, from Shinagawa, seems to be the last Hikari. At least the later train is not showing up in Hyperdia.

evergrn

Yeah, you're right. He'd better catch the 6.48pm NEX to Shinagawa then. Or just forget about JR Pass and just go with Nozomi. No shortage of Nozomi to Kyoto, even in that time of the day. NEx+Nozomi(return, Tokyo-Kyoto)+NEx = ~2000yen more than a 1-week JR Pass.

abmj-jr

Yes.

OP, if you get through Customs and Immigration quickly and hustle down to the JR service center to exchange your Rail Pass voucher, you might make it in time to catch the last feasible N'Ex to Shinagawa Station at 6:48 pm. It arrives at 7:58 pm and the last Hikari departs at 8:10, leaving you 12 minutes to connect. That is doable at Shinagawa as it is pretty small and easily navigable. I would NOT try to do a 12 minute connection at Tokyo Station.

If, while you are in line at the JR center, it looks like you will not make it in time for that last set of JR Pass eligible trains, you can always just purchase a ticket on the Nozomi to get to Kyoto. There are a few later N'Ex and Nozomi combinations that will get you to Kyoto without having to rush. In that case, I would just NOT exchange the Rail Pass voucher and plan on returning it for a refund after getting home. There is a 10% restocking fee. You would, of course, have to pay for all of your subsequent rail travel but could continue to use Nozomi for other shinkansen travel.

EDIT: I just noticed that the only rail travel you are planning is NRT-TYO-KYOTO-TYO-NRT. If that is the case, the JR Rail Pass would save you a little money but not a huge amount. In your case, with that late arrival, you might just be better off forgetting about the Rail Pass and just plan on paying as you go and use Nozomis.

milepig

I would not plan a 9pm Kyoto departure. The Kyoto highlights are 1 temples/shrines and 2 DINNER in one of so many Michelin starred restaurants. Stay the night.