Boy, are there a lot of threads about these three cities/areas! We're planning our first trip to Italy Oct. of 2010. Oct. is not set in stone, however.
We're tentatively planning to fly into FCO & spending three full days in Rome. Then train to Florence & spending 3 or 4 days there, with side trips to Tuscany towns, including Siena (love red wines) & maybe Pisa. Then train to Venice for approx. 3 days. Plan to fly home from VCE.
We'll be using either AA, DL or UA (3P so can get E+ seats) miles in Y. Have Marriott (30K), SPG (45K) & PC (60K) points for 4-6 nights and then we'll use B&B's or small hotels for the balance. Obviously, we'd like to stay in the same hotel/B&B while visiting each area.
Besides reading a lot of threads here we also have our first guidebook. Planning is half the fun, right?
I'd appreciate any suggestions on airlines, hotels & how to divide up our time. We could spend up to 14 days if necessary/advisable.
We're in our early 60s and pretty healthy, although my wife has problems going up & down a lot of stairs.
Guide books - good start, but do get lots more. They really are quite different, and certain ones will work better for you than others. Check out an armload at your local library. Then keep a pencil and paper nearby as you read them. Make lists headed by the possible cities. Each time you read something you really want to do, note it in the appropriate list.
Then look at the lists of videos and movies and books most guide books list. Read as many of those as interest you. "Death in Venice" by Thomas Mann popped into my mind, but there are tons of others of a lighter nature. Ah, yes, "Three Coins in the Fountain" and "Roman Holiday".
Your time division will just naturally suggest itself after this process.
I hope you get Murano and Burano islands on your Venice list. Think right now if you could use a totally unique and spectacular light fixture from Venice/Murano. Measurements, colors, etc. They wire for US, and ship reliably. And Burano is so completely different.
If your wife will go along with it, maybe a little fitness program so those inevitable stairs won't be so daunting? Start today? Sign up for something? The trip could be a great motivator.
Good routing, by the way. No back-tracking, and concentration in areas.
And finally, even grocery store inexpensive wine in Italy is very drinkable. Pack a corkscrew!
there are a lot of steps in venice, and rome is built on a bunch of hills(remember). ride the vaporetto a lot, and take cabs up the hills. our favorite hotel is pretty far up via veneto(must be a thousand feet uphill). we catch a cab at the bottom and ride up.
pisa and sienna add too much. just do a one day through chianti. if florence is too mobbed and you are not all that excited about the art and architecture, spend a few extra days in chianti. should be around the end of harvest season.
there are a lot of steps in venice, and rome is built on a bunch of hills(remember). ride the vaporetto a lot, and take cabs up the hills. our favorite hotel is pretty far up via veneto(must be a thousand feet uphill). we catch a cab at the bottom and ride up.
pisa and sienna add too much. just do a one day through chianti. if florence is too mobbed and you are not all that excited about the art and architecture, spend a few extra days in chianti. should be around the end of harvest season.
What's your fav. hotel on the via veneto, jer? I'll have to do some research on Chianti. Thanks.
Romelle, some great suggestions. We have started a WORD doc and we're adding to it daily. Thanks.
Add-on question: Is a rental car a good idea for seeing Tuscany (Chianti area & maybe Siena), using Florence as a base? This will probably only be one or two days.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philemer
Add-on question: Is a rental car a good idea for seeing Tuscany (Chianti area & maybe Siena), using Florence as a base? This will probably only be one or two days.
A rental car is a necessity for Tuscany - unless your only day trip from Florence is to Siena - which is easily accessible by bus.
sounds like the right amount of days for each stop. i agree with jer - chianti is probably enough if you want to stay over. if you just want to do a day trip you can do siena or chianti or any one of those.
Rome - lots of hills, yes. but also a pretty good hop on/hop off bus system that acts as a subway essentially. the only "must tour" indoor place I'd say would be the vatican museums/vatican. anything else you can tour on your own without a guide (those are good because a) there is so much to see, and b) they let you bypass the lines). Do you know where you might want to stay? There is so much to see and do, and (perhaps more importantly) so much good to eat! and there is also a lot of walking here because so many of the sights are "buried" within city neighbourhoods. but take it easy and you'll love it. possibly my favourite city in the world, and i've seen lots of 'em.
Florence - you could easily spend the entire 3-4 days here without even going on a day trip. that being said, the countryside is really nice - so if you want to do a day trip i'd think thats a great idea. especially if you like wine and its harvest time. I think artviva provides lots of tours, and i've heard people say that franco fadda gives good winery tours but i have no experience. please remember to pre-book the uffizi and accademia entry - although in october you might not need to (but this summer the uffizi had a 2.5 hour line for example). as a caution there is a ton of walking involved in florence - but taxis weren't overly expensive. one thing I've never found in a guidebook is that you should go to Piazza Michaelangelo (waaaay up a hill on top of the town) by taxi for sunset. don't eat there - its expensive and not great. but majestic views of the city.
Venice does have a lot of steps if you were to wander inland - as you have to go over a lot of canals. one way to avoid this somewhat is to buy an unlimited pass for the vaporetto and use it as an on-off bus to get from location to location. another way is to just go slow and use the railings - the thing about venice is you sort of have to wander around aimlessly and get hopelessly lost to really get the charm of the place.
there are really lots of great things to see in all these places. given that you are in your 60s and north american (I think) I would recommend the Rick Steve guidebooks. he's not my favourite because he's really opinionated and sort of tells you what to see instead of just telling you everything that there is to see...but he does give you a really great idea of the area, with good background. My personal preference is the Lonely Planet or Let's go guidebooks - buy the country or city specific ones and you get more information than you can handle and great recommendations.
in terms of car rental - i think sixt, europcar and avis gave me the best rates. there're also usually promotions. if you think you'll stay in wine country you'll potentially need a car I think. unless you want to go by bus or hire a driver.
if you want recommendations by place happy to help.
sounds like the right amount of days for each stop. i agree with jer - chianti is probably enough if you want to stay over. if you just want to do a day trip you can do siena or chianti or any one of those.
Rome - lots of hills, yes. but also a pretty good hop on/hop off bus system that acts as a subway essentially. the only "must tour" indoor place I'd say would be the vatican museums/vatican. anything else you can tour on your own without a guide (those are good because a) there is so much to see, and b) they let you bypass the lines). Do you know where you might want to stay? There is so much to see and do, and (perhaps more importantly) so much good to eat! and there is also a lot of walking here because so many of the sights are "buried" within city neighbourhoods. but take it easy and you'll love it. possibly my favourite city in the world, and i've seen lots of 'em.
Florence - you could easily spend the entire 3-4 days here without even going on a day trip. that being said, the countryside is really nice - so if you want to do a day trip i'd think thats a great idea. especially if you like wine and its harvest time. I think artviva provides lots of tours, and i've heard people say that franco fadda gives good winery tours but i have no experience. please remember to pre-book the uffizi and accademia entry - although in october you might not need to (but this summer the uffizi had a 2.5 hour line for example). as a caution there is a ton of walking involved in florence - but taxis weren't overly expensive. one thing I've never found in a guidebook is that you should go to Piazza Michaelangelo (waaaay up a hill on top of the town) by taxi for sunset. don't eat there - its expensive and not great. but majestic views of the city.
Venice does have a lot of steps if you were to wander inland - as you have to go over a lot of canals. one way to avoid this somewhat is to buy an unlimited pass for the vaporetto and use it as an on-off bus to get from location to location. another way is to just go slow and use the railings - the thing about venice is you sort of have to wander around aimlessly and get hopelessly lost to really get the charm of the place.
there are really lots of great things to see in all these places. given that you are in your 60s and north american (I think) I would recommend the Rick Steve guidebooks. he's not my favourite because he's really opinionated and sort of tells you what to see instead of just telling you everything that there is to see...but he does give you a really great idea of the area, with good background. My personal preference is the Lonely Planet or Let's go guidebooks - buy the country or city specific ones and you get more information than you can handle and great recommendations.
in terms of car rental - i think sixt, europcar and avis gave me the best rates. there're also usually promotions. if you think you'll stay in wine country you'll potentially need a car I think. unless you want to go by bus or hire a driver.
if you want recommendations by place happy to help.
happy travels!
Thanks, jeff3380. Not sure where we will be staying in Rome yet. We have enough points for a few nights with ICH (Holiday Inn or Crowne Plaza), Starwood, Marriott and HH. Some of these properties are 5 to 6 miles out of town. Any recommendations for something close to town center that's not too expensive? We'll definitely do the Vatican tours & the hop-on, hop-off bus.
Good ideas on Florence. We'll likely rent a car for a day, or two, and head to the countryside. We like museums but like the countryside better.
Unlimited bus/vaporetta pass in Venice is a good idea. We might stay at a Best Western in Mestre. It is highly recommended on Trip Advisor & across the street from the train station(10 min. to downtown Venice).
If using points doesn't work out in any of the 3 cities does anyone have recommends on inexpensive hotels? I've seen quite a few on T.A. and hotels.com. It's really hard to decide where to use points & where to pay cash.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philemer
Unlimited bus/vaporetta pass in Venice is a good idea. We might stay at a Best Western in Mestre. It is highly recommended on Trip Advisor & across the street from the train station(10 min. to downtown Venice).
!
The Best W'ern in Mestre is NOT a mere 10 minutes from "downtown" Venice.That is a rough estimate of the time it takes to get from Venezia-Mestre train station to Venezia-S.Lucia train station. Venezia S. Lucia is anywhere between 20 (water taxi) to 45 minutes (vaporetto) from Piazza San Marco - which would rightly be considered "downtown" (I've actually never heard of anyone using the term "downtown" w/regard to VCE).
Rather than hotels.com, try venere.com - which has a wider variety of Italian options.
The Best W'ern in Mestre is NOT a mere 10 minutes from "downtown" Venice.That is a rough estimate of the time it takes to get from Venezia-Mestre train station to Venezia-S.Lucia train station. Venezia S. Lucia is anywhere between 20 (water taxi) to 45 minutes (vaporetto) from Piazza San Marco - which would rightly be considered "downtown" (I've actually never heard of anyone using the term "downtown" w/regard to VCE).
Rather than hotels.com, try venere.com - which has a wider variety of Italian options.
Thanks for straightening me out. I don't know the "lay of the land" too well yet, but I'm slowly learning. Someone on T.A. mentioned "10 minutes" and I assumed they meant the central part of Venice. I'll check venere.com site tonight.
venice i'd try cash and points at the westin europa/regina -- they seemed to have the most cash and points options available -- and i personally think that's the best value option. IC hotels also now do cash and pts, so try one of those maybe. honestly the greatest thing about venice is venice at night after all the tours are done, and ESPECIALLY after the cruise ships are gone. being near san marco is key - especially to be near that area at night. i'd suggest using that as a point of reference. there are 2 best westerns right beside san marco (but not on the grand canal) - both of which looked decent from the outside. i loved being on the grand canal for the views and the air - your preference might be different. i'd try to stay away from the train station - lots of school groups seemed to be there, and honestly it was far from where i wanted to be at night.
in rome I stayed at the st regis, but i think a search here shows that a lot of people liked a smaller hotel in rome. possibly something like hotel art? i'll try a search and if i find it repost. the first few times in rome i stayed at the sheraton roma - its a 20 minute bus ride (free shuttle) to town, but it was nice and had a lounge with free computers and breakfast (for plats/club floor guests). i really do prefer staying in town and not dealing with shuttle buses - but it was pretty full every time and its really reasonably priced. for HH pts a lot of people love the cavalieri hotel - but again its expensive usually. the cavalieri is near the vatican. the excelsior and st regis are near (ish) piazza barberini/piazza repubblica. neither location is absolutely amazing, but neither is bad either. i personally have no interest in most of the area around the vatican (other than for the vatican) and its kinda far from where tourists go at night (trastevere, piazza navona, campo d'fiore, trevi fountain, spanish steps, pantheon areas largely). if i had my choice i'd always try to stay near where I want to end up at night - less dragging my tired feet around
in florence I was at the excelsior (i'm a starwoods guy clearly) and it was fantastic. however, there are a lot of options in florence - so a search for that on tripadvisor might net you an equally great B&B or something for much less. make sure you are actually in the old town - try for near the duomo or the uffizi/piazza signoria or the ponte vecchio. these are common "nearby" descriptions on hotel websites.
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another opinion
I spent a week in Tuscany back in May, and here's my two cents. We chose to stay in Siena in a self-catering apartment, get a rental car, and make day trips from there. We really liked walking around Siena and driving the countryside in Chianti and other regions around Siena. We did do one day in Florence - it's a definitely busier than the rest of Tuscany (well - except for the perpetual carnival around the Tower of Pisa). If you are into villages and countrysides more than museums, you might think about basing in Siena instead of Florence.
Either way - it will be great and you will be glad you went!
I spent a week in Tuscany back in May, and here's my two cents. We chose to stay in Siena in a self-catering apartment, get a rental car, and make day trips from there. We really liked walking around Siena and driving the countryside in Chianti and other regions around Siena. We did do one day in Florence - it's a definitely busier than the rest of Tuscany (well - except for the perpetual carnival around the Tower of Pisa). If you are into villages and countrysides more than museums, you might think about basing in Siena instead of Florence.
Either way - it will be great and you will be glad you went!
Good idea on using Siena as a base. However, I'm trying to use hotel points for cheap stay. If points don't work out I'll be looking at all options.
jeff3380, thanks for the good ideas. I'll be using C&P (cash & points) if they are available.
I'm planning virtually the same trip for the same timeframe, but also including 2 days in Cinque Terre. Probably not a good idea for you with lots of steps. As far as hotels, it seems that every good SPG has blocked C/P for that period, although I managed to get the Grand in Florence before they blocked it. If you don't want to spend 20k points per night (12K at the Westin in Venice), the best options I found from a location/price/review perspective were Suites Trastevere in Rome (about 135E per night), and Campiello Zen in Venice (about 125E). Both seem to be new, in great areas and very highly rated in TA. We're splitting things up 3-1/2 days in Rome, 2 in CT, 5 in Florence (including at least 2 day trips) and 2 in Venice.
Good luck with your planning and feel free to compare notes.
