obscure2k

Twice this past November and will return this coming November

OliverB

Thanks, perhaps we'll give it a shot after all.

OliverB

Perche, I have one more question for you which is a bit more specific --

We're planning to see Rigoletto at the Palazzo Barbarigo Minotto. It plays every Friday night as part of their weekly Musica a Palazzo series. I'm really looking forward to it! The performance begins at 8:30 PM and the Palazzo opens its doors to the public at 8:00 PM.

Do you have any nearby pre-show dinner suggestions for a quick but satisfying meal?

While it's not in the immediate vicinity, I was thinking that Rosticceria Gislon / San Bartolome might work, since it's an all-hours counter place that looks to dish out quality working class meals. It reminds me of a sort of Italian interpretation of a mid-century American diner. Of course, if you have any suggestions that are more conveniently situated to the Palazzo or to our hotel (which appears to be right next door) and preferably something more fitting for a pre-opera meal, that would be really helpful! I suppose we could always just eat at the Gritti as a last resort...

OliverB

And lastly (I know I say this every time I post!) -- Any experience with da Ignazio?

It's featured on the Associazione dei Ristoranti della Buona Accoglienza site that you linked to earlier and is the most appealing to me as it's been in operation since 1951 and supposedly among a dying breed of classic candlelit white tablecloth restaurants that seem to be disappearing in Venice. I can't seem to dig up any recent reviews though. Have you ever been or heard good things about it, Perche?


Other options incl. Osteria Oliva Nera, Osteria La Zucca Con Cucina, Fiaschetteria Toscana, Al Casin dei Noboli, Vini da Giggio, Osteria Alla Frasca, Enoteca Mascaretta, Al Bacco (?), Trattoria Casa Mia, Trattoria Corte Sconta, etc. I'm leaning towards Trattoria da Ignazio but would love to get some recent feedback before deciding.


PS: Regarding Cantina, this is what Elizabeth Minchili had to say:

"There are certainly lots of places to enjoy a glass of wine or a spritz, along with ciccheti. But rarely do the small nibbles come prepared with such care as they do at La Cantina. Working with top ingredients like organic quail eggs, artisanally cured meats and perfectly aged cheeses, each hand crafted crostini becomes a work of art. They have nothing in common with the pre-made crostini you see in every other bar. The place is usually crowded, and if you'd like to get a plate of the crostini, make sure you get there before dinner service starts, arounf 7:30 or 8. They also brew their own beer - Morgana - which pairs perfectly with a few thickly cut slices of mortadella."

I remember seeing this place highlighted on some travel show and I remember that the bar was filled with locals at the time. No English menus. I won't bother going for dinner since it's obviously known for its cicchetti, but I just thought I'd mention this as I believe you have a misconception of the place based on its location. It seems to be one of the few safe havens in the Strada Nuova.

Perche

No reason at al to go to Rosticceria, even if you were right there. It is the definition of venetian fast food. Not as in cicchetti, but as in pasta and other things in tin pans like in a school cafeteria. It has menus in 7 languages, with pictures of the food. Everything a tourist should avoid, plus it's fairly far from the Palazzo. It would be a 15-20 minute walk, and since in Venice you are always more likely than not to get lost, you could get really behind, and for nothing. And you want to get there early, because unlike an opera house, there are no assigned seats. You have to get in, and put your program or jacket on the seat you want to hold it.

At that hour, that neighborhood, choices are fairly limited. You could eat at the Gritti, as you said. I don't know what the hours are, but at least it's very close. Another option, one of the few really good restaurants in the neighborhood, is La Caravella. It's part of the Hotel Saturnia. Really, really good, and just a few minutes from the Palazzo. The restaurant is separated from the hotel, so you won't be eating in a hotel, and it might be nice to get out of your hotel. They open at 7, so you'd have to tell them, and get done by 7:50. Not exactly the way to eat, but it's another possibility. There really aren't many good restaurants that open before 7.

Third possibility is go to Campo Santo Stefano. It's just a couple of blocks away from the Palazzo, not likely to get you lost either, because it's a fairly straight shot. It is a very beautiful campo worth visiting in its own right. It is ringed by restaurants. Because it is a very popular campo, you may find a restaurant that is continually open. May not be the greatest restaurant, but at least you'd be eating in a beautiful traditional square. You can go there the day before in the afternoon and see if they are open. If not, all around the campo are smaller bacari where you can get cicchetti, tremezzini, and other snacks that will be better than rosticceria. Even on the way to Santo Stefano you will be passing some restaurants and bacari, so these are options to be able to get something to eat without worrying about being late, that would not force you to eat where you are staying. Alternatively, if you just snack, you can go to La Caravella afterward, because they close at 11. I hope you are making reservations at all of your restaurants. Do so 2-3 weeks before. Otherwise, it will be almost impossible to get in, except maybe just for lunch.

Perche

Da Ignazio is excellent. The only thing I could raise as a question is the long time proprietess Ada Vanin just died yesterday. She was famous for maintaining the art of true traditional venetian cooking. I doubt that would change the quality though. She was 88, and probably didn't have much to do anymore with what goes on in the kitchen.

Corte Sconta is one of my favorite restaurants. Downhill maybe a little since the owner died 6-7 years ago, but his wife is still there, and it's still great. I like to go there for lunch. It may take you two hours to find it if you don't get very specific directions, even though it is a 3 minute walk from Arsenale. It is down an alley.

Given what you seem to like, Vini da Gigio might be a good one for you. It's in a quiet, out of the way, very traditional neighborhood. It's right waterside on an intimate canal, so reserve a table by the window. You'll have to walk down Strada Nuova to get there, but it is not on Strada Nuova, and you'll see what I mean about how commercial it is.

I know you have your heart set on Alla Vedova. I was going through some things for a friend and did find a review on it. Not on Chowhound, but an italian review for venetians which tend to be more accurate. It was actually a positive review of a bacaro called Osteria Ai Osti, but it mentioned Alla Vedova.

OSTERIA AI OSTI

Corte dei Pali Testori 3489, Cannaregio. Chiuso domenica.

A Venezia griderebbero allo scandalo: il Guardian č passato accanto all’Osteria Ca’ D’oro, da tutti conosciuta come “Alla Vedova” (Cannareggio, 3912), e ha preferito andare altrove.
In Venice they should scream at the scandal. The British Newspaper the Guardian passed by all"Osteria Ca' D'oro, know by everyone as Alla Vedova, and preferred to go elsewhere.

Certe cose non dovrebbero essere permesse ai turisti, che noi veneziani siamo deboli di cuore. E’ vero, Ai Osti c’č il menu operaio, ma Alla Vedova ci sono le polpette.
There are certain things tourists shouldn't be permitted to do because we venezians have weak hearts. It's true, Ai Osti has a menu with food for typical working people, but Alla Vedova has meatballs.

E nel cambio, credo, ci si guadagna.
In making the change, you profit.

So, if you go to Alla Vedova, make sure you ask for the meatballs.

Perche

True, but you were talking about having dinner there. Minchilli is saying the same thing. They serve crostini. That's not cicchetti. Imagine you take a loaf of long skinny bread, cut it thin, and bake or fry it so that it's crisp. You now have a piece of toast, which in italian is crostini. La Cantina may make small pieces of toast and top them with good cheese or cold cuts. Crostini is sort of an alternative to cicchetti, but is not specific to Venice. They are sold everywhere.

An alternative way of thinking about it is to call crostini by the name that everyone knows; bruschetta. When instead of topping the toast with cheese, cold cuts, eggs, a piece of fish, etc, and calling it crostini, if you just rub the toast with a piece of garlic, paint it with olive oil, and put some diced tomato on it, it is called bruschetta, which you can even get in the USA. The only difference between true crostini and bruschetta is that they use thinner bread, and slice it thinner for crostini, so that it is almost like a cracker. So, La Cantina is a bar with good beer, and instead of peanuts or pretzels, in Italy you sometimes get toast. I'm sure it's a good place for a beer. The blog from the expat in Rome, and Minchilli both said they like the crostini and the beer. I just didn't want to recommend that you waste a dinner night on a place that specializes in toast as an accompaniment to beer, in an undesirable neighborhood.

I suspect the local clientele are all the clerks who work in the businesses lining Strada Nuova, taking a break for a beer and a smoke and a snack. Nothing wrong with that, but not for dinner.

Katie Parla also reviewed it:
On a trip to Venice last week, I had lunch at La Cantina on Strada Nuova. This little enoteca on Cannaregio’s main street is a meeting point for locals who stop by throughout the day to throw back a glass of prosecco with a couple of oysters. They also serve a few hot dishes, cheeses and cured meats. I may never have had such an awful bowl of pasta e fagioli in my life as what I was served at La Cantina (aren’t the beans supposed to be rehydrated for this dish?), but the follow up, 1lb. of meat and cheese, was much more satisfying. Next time I’ll follow the crowd and go for the oysters, though.

OliverB

Thanks so much, as always!!

I think we might try Ignazio although you're selling me on Vini da Gigio as well... I'll have to give a bit more consideration to both and maybe let the missus have the final say. Eitherway, we're down to two solid options, so I think we've done really well. ^

And with our combined efforts, I'm uploading the (hopefully) final version of our itinerary - a masterpiece in itself! After all of this research, I feel like I've already eaten in half the restaurants in Venice, haha.

The only thing yet to be determined is where we'll eat dinner on the Friday night of the opera, although I think it might be more fun to just play it by ear and see how we feel. We could always have a snack in a bar beforehand and then maybe eat a late night dinner around 10:30 pm - I assume like most cities, there are probably more late-night options on Friday nights and weekends.

I can't thank you enough for all of your feedback and input into our planning, Perche. You rule!

OliverB

I somehow missed this post when I was commenting earlier in the week and wanted to respond. I've heard that management at Madonna recently changed hands and the level of quality took a fast nosedive; they're supposedly now exploiting the same tourist driven market as every other place in the area, serving frozen and microwaved dishes. This makes me sad as it seemed to be one of the few long-standing trattorias in the area that was not only reliable, but transported you back to a pre-cruise ship Venice of old. I was really looking forward to visiting for the white jacket service and nostalgic ambiance, but all recent reviews (by discerning folks) suggest otherwise. Perhaps one of you would like to "take one for the team" and give it a shot and then report back. I figured I might as well post this as a warning, since it's such a well known institution - and for good reason, until recently.

Concerto

I'm not sure you'll be out by 10.30, Rigoletto is a pretty long piece. If it's done without cuts don't expect to get out until just before 11.30pm.

OliverB

Thanks, there's at least one intermission that I know of, so we'll definitely eat beforehand. I presume the only kitchens open after midnight would be at the hotels and likely only on request.

slawecki

buy a copy of venezia ostiary & dintorni by michela Scibilia. only about 100 pages. cost about $20 in venice. cost $65-80. this little book is wonderful. most book stores should have it. the latest is the third(or 4th) edition. your hotel may have a copy.

if you do find and buy a copy, i will buy it from you upon return(at $20, not $65).

Clint Bint

I haven't ploughed all the way through all the above restaurants but if this one isn't on it it really should be.

My absolute favourite Venice restaurant.

www.gattonero.com

PWMTrav

You should probably offer a little bit of a premium if someone went all the way to Venice to get it

Also, it's not very hard to find if you want the English edition. Search for ISBN 8872004462 and make sure it's the 2015 edition. You can get it for roughly $30 shipped to the US.

OliverB

It's indeed on my list though I'm admittedly trying to get a read on how it compares with Romano. I understand it's considered the superior, but then Romano is the draw for its history and artwork - any restaurant that's been around since 1947 and was frequented by the likes of Matisse and Miro, Le Corbusier, De Pisis, Chaplin, Fellini, Hepburn, Hemingway and Ezra Pound, is automatically of significant interest in my book! I realize this might not be the most progressive stance and may even contrast other positions in this thread, but I'm willing to go for "the second best" or even the "pretty good" option, for the added sense of history and context. Right now we have reservations at Da Romano and unless someone explicitly tells me that the food is terrible and we're making a huge mistake, I think that's where we'll end up. Again, I realize that this is a very subjective point of view, but sometimes it's not always about the food alone. That said, Gato Nero looks very good as well and is a strong second on my list.