remyontheroad

Hello,

Does anyone know anything about either the Roma Pass or the Omnia?

Friends are looking at a pretty short stopover in Rome and willing to pay a bit to get fast track access to St Peters, the Sistine Chapel, Colliseum, Forum, etc.

I searched for the Omnia pass here on FT and nothing at all comes up, which makes me immediately suspicious!

Anyone have any experience/thoughts about Omnia, or whether Roma Pass will be useful?
(Omnia is here - https://www.romeandvaticanpass.com/w...save-time.html)

Thanks in advance,

ROTR.

Perche

Would need to know more to give any specific advice.

The Roma pass is a valid thing that is sold by the city. It does give you a discount for the first two museums that you go to on a certain list, and you can go to a shorter line. But it's not that much of a solution. For example, you show up to St. Peters, and you have your card. There are barriers everywhere you can see just getting into the Piazza, making people walk round and round through barricades, forever, just to get through security, then you have to find the short line window.

Good luck asking the Swiss Guards that in the summer heat, in the midst of the throngs of tourists, because they won't talk to you, and neither will the workers. At the most, they will point, and you will still be lost. It would be like looking for help with directions to your seat from someone in the parking lot during the Super Bowl. You can wave your card all you want, if there are nothing but crowds and queues and you are not able to find the window, it won't help.

As for Omnia, I wouldn't touch it with a 100 foot pole. They are based in the UK. There are a myriad of reputable places in Rome that do the same thing, they give you a pass card. If you have trouble, lose your card, you can go to their office. You can call them on the phone. Your hotel can call them. If you are in Rome and have trouble using your card, do you really want to call a group with a +44 0 20 phone number, which means they are based in London, and may just be a guy with a fancy website working out of his apartment, who cannot call someone and help you?

In the crowds of the summer, it is so hectic. If your friends really want to make their way through things, unless they are fluent in Italian crowds, customs, language, they don't just need a card. They need a guide. A guide who will say, "here, let's go over here, let's cut over there, I know the guy over here, let's cut to the front of this line, let me take you in," who will then explain what you are seeing, take you to the high points of the Vatican Museum or St. Peters, and other sites in Rome.

Just showing up at Piazza San Pietro in Vatican City in a crowd of 15,000 people, you can wave around your card all you want, unless you know how to deal with things, it will be like trying to go from the parking lot to your seat at the Super Bowl, but in a foreign language.

I've lived and attended school in Rome, just moved back in January, go back in two weeks. In January when I was still living there a friend from the USA came over. I made arrangements for her to do the Schavi tour, St. Peters, have a Papal audience, etc. It was shortly after the incident in Paris. Although it was mid-January, the security was immense, and there were hardly any people there. Yet, it took a while for me to find the Schavi window, even though I've been to St. Peters many times. The security alone made me dizzy. Your friends just showing up with a card for a few euro discount will not make their trip go well.

The Roma pass for a somewhat seasoned Italian traveler going in March or April, November-January, might save a few dozen euros. In the summer in Rome if they want to be more efficient, they will need far more help than that. They need an honest guide.

As for Omnia, ALWAYS check the area code, and the IP address. There is no reason to choose a website with a London IP address and phone number for a tour in Rome.

If your friends are really pressed for time and want to maximize efficiency, they need a guide, not just a pass. During the summer a pass is for people who already know their way around, speak at least intermediate Italian, and know how to use it. During down season when there are smaller crowds, it can also be used. But at this time of the year, I would suggest that they find a guide, and not buy a pass.

Non-NonRev

This.

In addition to the logistics, a good guide will put what the friends are seeing in context. The guide can tailor the level of specificity from very general to detailed, so that they get the most from their visit.

remyontheroad

Thanks very much for the detailed information!

I'll pass it on.

Yllanes

I actually disagree with Perche.

First of all, Roma Pass does not include the Vatican at all. It gives you free entry (and shorter lines) at the first two museums you visit. This is worth it if they use for Colosseum+Forum (can help a lot with the line) and Musei Capitolini, since those are the most expensive visits. But it also has a very good feature, which is free public transportation on the metro, buses and trams. This makes it very worth it.

For the Vatican Museums (including the Sistine Chapel) they just have to buy a timed entry ticket online on the museum's website and they will skip the line (I recommend booking for the opening time, they will actually let them enter a few minutes before the official opening time, which lets them get oriented before all the crowds come in).

Another great visit in Rome is the Galleria Borghese, a fantastic museum (in a very nice park), which requires advanced booking for everybody, thus eliminating the queues and making for a hassle-free visit. It's in the Roma Pass circuit.

Perche

I agree with you. I think we are saying the same thing, but maybe I wasn't clear. The Roma pass is a valid thing[/B] that saves time and money getting you into two museums. Getting a pass that enables you to cut the line is not really the solution to crowding in Rome. OP mentioned a short "stopover," not really a trip to Rome. I made the assumption, perhaps false, that this stopover will be sometime in the next few months, during high season.

If time is of the essence because it's just a short stopover, a guide is the best way to maximize your time, in my opinion. I don't know when you were in the Vatican last, but with the terrorism that has gone on in Europe things have changed. In January, taking a friend there, just to get into Piazza San Pietro there were hundreds of yards of barricades that you had to walk around. It was completely disorienting. Then, once you get into the Piazza it is set up as one-way walkways. These are changes from the past. Perhaps they were temporary, but I doubt it. I'll find out when I go back next week.

In the past you could just walk into the Piazza. This was in January, when there were about 200 people in there. During the summer there are between 15,000-25,000 visiting the Piazza per day. It's not like having a timed ticket to the Vatican, you can just walk to the front of the line. For first time visitors, in the summer, it can take a good part of a day to get through it.

The Roma pass allowing use of public transportation is a benefit, but I don't think it's that much of a benefit to first timers on a brief stopover, because they should probably not rely too much on figuring out how to use the buses. Getting on a crowded bus in the summer, they are not going to find a seat, and if they have not been to Rome before, taking the time to learn the transportation system in a foreign city where they don't speak the language can be daunting.

If they really have only a short stopover, which to me means one day, and they need to get from place to place to maximize their time, I think to be more efficient at maximizing the hours in the day they should rely on a guide who can navigate the transportation system and crowds more efficiently than they could. It's different for someone who is there for 3-5 days who can learn to use buses, and who doesn't mind getting lost in crowds.

They are not cutting to the front of this line, but a guide could help them strategize how to best beat the crowds.

Yllanes

Well, I was thinking more about the museums than about the basilica (since you can, or could, access St. Peter from the Sistine Chapel). Personally, if the access to St. Peter's from the Sistine Chapel is closed and the crowds are this bad I would rather go visit St. John Lateran instead of St. Peter's.

No first-time visitor on a short time should attempt to ride Rome's badly organised buses, but the Roma Pass is useful for the metro since all these sites (Vatican, Colosseum, St. John) and things like the Piazza di Spagna are all close to a metro station. The only bus I would recommend is the one that takes them up to Villa Borghese from Piazza del Popolo, to see the Galleria Borghese.

I also agree with you that if they really are in Rome for one day a guide could be worth it, I guess I was thinking of a longer visit. I will also say that, being Spanish, I'm naturally well equipped to deal with Italian crowds and queues so maybe I underestimate their effect on travellers from other cultures!

So, to sum up, I still recommend Roma Pass if they want to go the Colosseum-Forum (counts as one visit) and Galleria Borghese or Musei Capitolini. These two visits make up for the cost of the pass and you get free metro rides as well as a priority access for the Colosseum. For the Vatican, I would buy the online ticket for the museums and Sistine Chapel and maybe pass on St Peter's in favour of some other church (St. John is my recommendation) if the crowds are too crazy. If it is really only a one-day visit a guide could be a good idea.

P.S.: As always, the best way to mitigate the crowds is getting up early. St Peter's opens at 7.00 and I doubt there will be a big queue at that hour.

Perche

Agree, but depends somewhat on the Pope. He has an audience most Wednesday's when he is in town. They open up the security gates at 7, and you have to sit until he comes out at around nine. At 7AM, rain, shine, sleet, or hail, there are thousands and thousands of people waiting for the security barricades to open. Then, the mad dash for the seats starts. If you are from Spain, then the running of the bulls in Pamplona looks tame compared to all of the nuns running and trampling people over to get to the seats as closest to the Pope as possible. And that's at 7AM. People are line up at 5AM. There are interesting videos of it on YouTube. I can't find them right now, just this one, and for this, only a guide can help you.

Yllanes

Sure, but my point was that, unless there is an audience, there should not be a crazy crowd early in the morning. If there is such a crowd for any reason in the day of their visit, then I would recommend skipping St Peter's entirely and going elsewhere because, unless you are interested in the actual papal audience, it will not be a very pleasant sightseeing experience. There is no good reason to spend hours in a line.

Perche

It's not this bad, you can visit the Vatican, but in the summer, it's tough with the new security. Do what Yllanes said, check the schedule to make sure nothing is going on, and go early, or go late and just try to get into the Basilica. Unless your target is the museum, and that's a one day thing. I've taken people who just want to see the Sistine Chapel straight in there, but in the off season, late in the day. These are the things where a guide could be helpful on such a short trip, unless your friends are frequent travelers, and will come back again and again.

explorer84

Perche do you have the inside track on a guide you don't mind recommending?

JBD

This thread is relevant (where Perche and others have already made some recommendations):
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/italy...ons-tours.html

And another suggestion would be for Agnes Crawford. Like Gina Tringali, Eleonora Baldwin and Elizabeth Janus who were recommended in that other thread through their independent tour companies, they also still do Context tours. (Katie Parla started off with Context too). All these expats know each other - I follow their twitter feeds is how I know. But with Context you're not guaranteed a particular docent where as booking with these women privately you obviously are - which of course is preferrable, as Perche points out in that linked thread.

Here's Agnes Crawford's website:
http://www.understandingrome.com/

I've only taken Context tours, since I am price conscious, but I plan on one day taking tours from Agnes. I read her blog and twitter (linked on her site), and I'm very impressed with her.

Perche

Perche

This is good advice. I'd go with Context Tours. You can ask for a specific person, but you might not get him or her. People like Katie Parla, Tringali, Baldwin, Janus, are generally booked way in advance. Especially Katie Parla.

I just got back from Rome. Having been guided around with Katie in the past, who was great, I asked a month in advance if she could take me around on a wine tasting tour around the city. I don't really need a guide for Rome, having lived and studied there, but people like these guides can make an evening special, and you get to meet interesting people. Unfortunately, the answer was:

Dear "Perche,"

Unfortunately Katie is fully booked during your stay in Rome. However, she highly recommends the services of Context Travel for historical tours and Vino Roma for wine tastings and food tours...."

I don't need tours in Rome, I know the local bars in different neighborhoods, where to eat, etc, , but you can never know too much and if you can go out with a really knowledgeable person, you can catch up because I'm only in Rome 2-3 times per year, and am not a local. I hadn't been to Rome since January, so I wanted to do a wine tour with Katie, but since she wasn't available, I did the Vino Roma wine tasting, and it was an evening well spent.

I'd go to their individual websites. Katie has her own business. Tringalli, Baldwin, and Janus had their own businesses, but recently joined together to start their own company called Casa Mia Italian Food and Wine. When not getting a booking from their own new company, they accept bookings from Context Travel.

So I'd email these names individually, such as Katie, and if she is not available, try to book Tringalli, Baldwin or Janus, from their new company. If they are not available, I'd go with Context Travel, and who knows, the person who shows up for your tour may be Gina Tringalli.

I don't know Agnes Crawford, but if she got a spot with Context Travel, Context Travel is a good endorsement. Anyone can set themselves up as a tour guide. Context Travel requires that a guide have at least a Masters Degree in what they are going to give a tour on, e.g., roman history, architecture, viticulture, etc.

JBD

explorer84, based on the quote you posted from Perche, it seems you're interested in a guide for the Vatican. If that's the case then Gina Tringali, Eleonora Baldwin and Elizabeth Janus wouldn't be appropriate for that as their expertise is in culinary matters. (I had mentioned these women, who were endorsed by Perche in that other thread, because like them, Agnes Crawford also has a private tour business as well as being a guide through Context. I didn't mean to confuse the issue).

I don't see on Katie Parla's site an option for a Vatican Tour, but maybe I'm just missing it. She has a wider focus than Tringali/Baldwin/Janus, in terms of her educational background, and has truly made a name for herself as a leading culinary Rome expert. I took a tour from her when she was still with Context Rome, on Ancient Rome, and it was fine.

For a Context Rome tour of the Vatican check out this link to see its Vatican options (the default dates show as the current ones - there maybe different tours offered for your exact dates): https://www.contexttravel.com/search...ty=rome&page=1

Click on a specific tour, scroll down and you'll see who leads it (Agnes Crawford is among them), then click on their names to see their bio.

(So unless you're booking a Context Rome culinary tour, Gina Tringali wouldn't be a possibility as Perche mentioned above).

Back to Agnes Crawford, I don't know what her rates are for a private tour, you'd have to email her for that (see her link I posted upthread), but you can see Context's rates on its site.

These are the threads that I first read about Agnes Crawford, and they have useful Vatican tour and related info:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/italy...years-old.html

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/italy...ites-rome.html

And do an advanced search on this forum with Vatican as the search word, select Search Titles Only, and you'll see alot of more recent Vatican tour specific threads.