Marathon Man

The trip we took that started out in Roma was great.

1) Alitalia out of BOS at 10:40pm was nice because you essentially go to sleep. They had newly outfitted the plane and hey, every seat even in econ had a USB plug positioned on the seat back in front of you. They also served a pretty decent chicken and veg dinner about midnight EST. BUT those new seats that look so nice are lighter and thinner material so they were hard and firm. That stunk! Couldn't get comfy no matter how many pillows we used.

AND, this part I cannot figure out WHY someone would design it this way: The arm rests do not go all the way up! Huh? They only go up to about a 45 degree angle so you cant hardly sprawl out anyway. There were open seats and rows all over the back of the plane but that hardly helped. Next time... Business Class for everyone. We are now at the point where the kiddos can get on with their own comfy seats. No more trying to cuddle up with mommy. Well we got a bit of rest and touched down in a sunny Rome at 12;40pm anyway.

2) The airport... the line to check through passport control was long and wide. they have a bathroom right there so that was nice. We were close to the back of this line and so we estimated at least 45 mins to get through. Again, if you have seats in C, you are up front. My wife and kids are dual Dutch/US citizens. So my wife noticed the EU entry line was empty and she ran up there to ask them something. She came back and waved to us to follow. She got them to let me through--just US passport WITH my EU family. This was nice. We got our luggage and were now walking through, yeah, quite a dodgy looking place.

but it had a little play area that the kids wanted to use for 10 minutes while I spotted a bank ATM and got out 500 Euros using my State Farm checking debit card which has a 05 fee and covers any and all fees when using ANY ATMs anywhere. For those wanting to know about this, PM me.

We saw an AlItalia lounge and tried to go in but yeah, it didn't work. We would have had to have used the Priority Club ones that are air-side so we didn't bother. We had a snack on the plane when we were near landing and had brought some with us so we were set.

We exited the airport and saw white taxis lined up. A taxi man said these would go to Rome for 48 Euros. The driver was nice and professional and the Mercedes taxi was good. He chatted to us about World Cup stuff and raced us through to our Westin Excelsior hotel. We got there in 45 mins tops.

When we left Roma to the airport again, they had these same types of taxis out front waiting for guests like us, who they knew were checking out early in the am. 50 Euros and he raced us through the streets (I wished I filmed it because it was like The Bourne Identity the way this guy drove) and we got to the airport on time. We were flying to Mykonos, Greece...

I will post a trip report on my entire travels sometime...

Thanks!

MM

PWMTrav

Glad you had a good time, MM. You've filled in the travel details, but you went to Italy - what did you do, what did you eat?

Did you book these as award tickets or revenue? If revenue, were you at any point offered an upgrade to Premium Economy or Business? Just wondering if AZ does it.

Marathon Man

Whilst on our trip, and mainly during long relaxing hours on my beach chair in Greece, I began writing my trip report--or at least the long, overly detailed and unedited version. I wrote up til getting to Mykonos, Geece so you will have to wait for that and the rest, and I wrote this in my iphone notes app...

We flew AZ using DL miles for econ:

Trip report - July 2014

First, a little background on our previous travels since it plays into this trip.

Because our now 6&8 year old children were babies, we have flown overseas to AMS and traveled north to where my wife's family lives.

From BOS, this trip is non-stop on Delta and so I have made it my never ending task to earn countless DL miles. This is a normal part of my "job" as a MSer and the good part about SkyTeam partners is that you can find award seats and they don't always take up all your miles.

Historically we have found that flying on the earlier of the two BOS-AMS flights provides us with the 4 seat across configuration as the flight is on an A-300/330. The later (and consistently more full) flight has been on a 767 and often times we would end up in a 3 across with one adult seated in the aisle seat of the 2 seats to either side of the plane. In some planes these 2 seat sections don't even line up with the sections in the middle.

A lot of this matters when you fly with little kiddos--they NEED to cling to or rest on mommy and daddy and each parent continually needs the other. Therefore, the 4 seats across configuration--not the 3--is essential for a family of four such as ours.

The flight is, on average, about 7 hours and well, with little kids there can even be room enough and time enough to catch a little sleep. The good news about flying to see relatives is that you'll have a nice bed to sleep in and they'll likely come pick you up--at least in the beginning years of such annual travel.

As the kiddos get older and bigger and as mommy and daddy, having found ways and means to get a little needed space, now crave it even more, the 4 across can seem a little more cramped than it once was. After all a small 2 year old who can curl up on the seat and actually get some sleep in relative comfort can provide solace at times. When he or she is 6 or 8, it begins to get harder. No room, not enough blankies, no comfort and longer legs, etc.

This finally showed its full potential for pain on this year's summer trip, as we had elected to travel some of Europe first with the kiddos and then see family in Holland later. Besides we wanted to give the Dutch a little space after they had lost World Cup play to Argentina...

When we first boarded Alitalia flight 915, which left BOS at 10:40pm, we imagined we would all sleep right away and wake up a bit before its 12:40pm landing at FCO. The kiddos wouldn't even need their trusty iPad Minis, which despite all comments coming from naysayer parents about devices and children, have been a Godsend during lengthy travel. We normally only allow them to use them on long drives or flights and during vacations or some weekend nights depending on the situation. And neither child is addicted to MindCraft. And so we though this flight would bring us non-stop to Rome, which would be our first destination, without issue.

My hopes of this were dashed as my 6 year old son, boarding first, looked to the left and pointed..."there!"

I had to inform him that no, we were to proceed to the back of the large plane and go to row 38.

The interior was seemingly newly fitted however and looked comfortable enough. Maybe on this flight, this one more time, we could do the economy thing before having to fork over sometimes double the miles to sit in C. The last time we had tried C with the kiddos on a return flight AMS-BOS it was a failure because, as from the past, they wanted to cling to mommy. And you cant do that in those big comfy single seats up front that have space between them. As well, you spend your time trying to adjust their tray tables or TV screen clickers and hoping they can sleep as the enticing desert trays pass by on what seems the entire journey. Compound this with the feeling of embarrassment as other Business Class passengers appear to look over and snarl as your whole family disturbs their slumber the whole way.

People without kids have NO concept of anything I am talking about here. Many with kids would deny they ever have had any of these issues if you talked with them in public but are secretly nodding in shame as they read this and relate it to their own version and experience.

Nonetheless we settled in and the kids did dose off since this is way past their normal bed time anyway.

But soon, we all felt the pains. For one, those arm rests between each seat did not go up. They raised to maybe a 30 degree angle and that's it. Who designed that feature and why did they do this?

Next, the flight announcements weren't just at take off, no, they seemed to come and go all night. This was loud fast speaking Italian, which always seems to take longer to explain, doubled by having to repeat it in English.

They served a dinner at about midnight and it was quite good in fact. Chicken and vegetables. I don't think I needed to eat but I did anyway. Drink service even for water was a bit lacking but if you asked a passing flight attendant you would get some.

But the seats--I mean benches. Horrid! Made of stone in fact, with a bit of new fabric on them.

I last experienced this phenomenon on a domestic United flight from DCA-BOS and wondered why I hadn't chosen to fly Jet Blue or even Delta, both of which actually have decent padding on the seats!

Anyway it seems to me that as with most "updates" being done on things these days, the newly updated product was worse. These Alitalia seats were horrible. I could never get comfortable despite how many extra pillows I grabbed from some of the empty seats throughout the plane to stuff under me bum. Oh I had ample sitting room and all, but I'd have been better off laying on a wooden park bench than sitting in this seat.

I'll not fly long haul economy again. Big mistake. I admit it. And screw the 4 across cling to mommy thing. The kiddos are older now and we should be in bitness class! I should lose points just for admitting to you all that I was still turning right upon entry. I'm a bad daddy.

But, we made it alive and well to Rome just the same. We had packed quite light for our multi-week Euro trip--just a rolling carry suitcase for each of us and a backpack for me and my wife, so no checked luggage to collect in Rome.

The arrival hall there, however, was very crowded indeed. The line looked at least an hour long and they must have purposely disabled the air conditioner. After freshening up in a conveniently located bathroom my wife brought out her Dutch passport and those of our dual citizen children as well as my US passport and went to an empty lane to ask questions. She returned to wave us along explaining that the EU only entrance guard would let me though with my family who all hold EU passports! This bonus got us out of there in no time.

Case and point: Hold a EU passport or sit up front and be among the first off the plane to make it to these lanes.

We walked through the dank and somewhat boring terminal (just as were told FCO would be like) and I found an ATM. My State Farm debit card gave us Euros--having a basic no minimum balance checking account with them with direct deposit enables one to obtain cash at any ATM worldwide and they cover or reimburse all fees! We then exited and, as we had been told by others who have traveled here, white taxis were readily available to take us into Rome for €48 flat rate. The trip to our hotel took just over 30 minutes. It was a nice Mercedes sedan and the driver talked about the world cup with us. Very Euro. He drove like a racer and we enjoyed that in fact.

The Westin Excelsior.

This hotel is top notch. A giant ornate corner building adorned with statues and Italian styled atone work. We entered and were greeted with open arms. They needed just ten minutes to make sure our room was ready so we relaxed in the beautiful chandelier clad hall and sitting area. Then my wife took the kiddos to the lower level where the pool was located. It was a very nicely decorated and tiled spa area and the pool was small and unheated but refreshing. She had their bathing suits so they went for a quick dip whilst I went out to look for a small shop to buy some waters and snacks. We then met again by the lobby. A porter took us up to room 516 which was over the top. They then brought our four bags.

If any of you have seen the short video of the Miles Professor's recent hotel stay, this room was similar except in our case the kiddos quickly took over before I had a chance to make a video of my own but this short description should suffice...

With tiled and marble flooring, wood paneled and drapery on the walls and stylish wall covering, this room looked like something out of the Gilded Age--a suite on the Titanic. The furnishings appeared Victorian in style but of course were newer. The room was more of an apartment with a master king bedroom with seating area and huge wooden closet. A huge draped curtain swayed from above the bed and my daughter thought it was the princess bed and so she wanted to sleep in it.

The room opened up to a large pillared balcony that extended down to the other half of our "property." I only have Gold status with SPG right now but they treated us better than that.

The bathroom was a full bath with both a large tiled stand up shower and a large tub on the other side. There was a double sink and even a bidet. Everything was updated and solid state.

Down the hall was a large living room and tv with an ornate sofa, reading chairs, a table with more chairs and a large wooden desk. Here was also where my daughter found the mini bar with costly snacks in it but we promised the kiddos snacks later on so they refrained.

We settled in, plugged in our devices (I tend to bring many chargers and charge heads, and even extension chords and in this hotel room I was happy to have done so because outlets were few and not so lets say snapping solid. They seemed older and less secure.

The staff soon entered with two cots and made the beds nicely. Everything was very plush. They moved some living room furniture and this also well air-conditioned room became the kids room. More reason to no longer be able to film the premises.

When booking I had requested cots and they obliged--in our case, somehow, at no extra charge.

We took a very short rest and shower and by 4pm we went out for a walk.

We walked the eclectic streets of Rome to the Trevi Fountain which was under renovation and not really worth seeing. The kiddos did not mind--there was Gelato there.

We then found a small restaurant in a more local looking alley that had a special: pasta or pizza plus a soft drink or water and a coffee or cappuccino for €12. They even had free wifi. Perfect for our family. Such deals can be found anywhere for between €9-15 if you go early, as most people do a "real" dinner much later here and most kiddos cant wait that long.

We then trekked through the streets to find the Spanish Steps and checking maps or asking people was all we needed to navigate. It's fun to do things without Google Maps!

The kiddos liked watching people and climbing the steps. We taught them to avoid the gypsies trying to push roses for euros.

We debated a horse carriage ride, which my wife and I had taken before on a trip years ago before we had children, but we didn't need to spend the €150-200 to do it. We had an issue with a belief that these horses arent treated very well by their owners anyway.

We ventured up the steps and headed through more streets and alleyways back to our hotel. Everyone passed out and while we woke in the middle of the night for a bit (jet lag--shoulda flown in C!) we slept again and woke up at 11 am.

A few blocks from our hotel were many hop on hop off busses. We booked for €18 and €12 for adults and kids accordingly and the four of us got to see many sites from the outside upper deck. While Rome can be hot in July we found the weather to be pleasant with a slight breeze. It was around 27c or about 81 f.

We stopped at the Colosseum and as I explained some light history, the kiddos enjoyed looking around and checking out stone work. They each posed holding swords with the Gladiator actors out front and then we decided to book a tour to go inside.

The line looked about 45 mins long and what we found was that booking the tours outside doesn't really save you much time at all. A runner solicits people like us and then sets you up with a guide. People join the tour as the guide's group swells to at least 25 people before we head in. The guide had a book to show some history and told stories and jokes as we circled around him. They advertise their craft as no line and no waiting. This is actually not so true since the pseudo guide merely yapped with us for the same 45 minutes we could have waited. At the end we were quickly asked to bring all children to the entry and they were likely counted. It seems another runner of sorts would have been in line to wait himself and now pay, factoring in the discounted children rate. For our family we had paid €70 for this service, which included the guide and entry fee for all four of us.

But after 45+ minutes of waiting and hardly enjoying or understanding any of it (the guide had been speaking in broken English and his joke telling hardly made sense to even some of the multinational adults) my kiddos kinda had enough. The now hotter mid morning sun beating down on tourists and ancient stone made for a perfect recipe of "daddy put me on your shoulders" syndrome. Maybe it was the bit about how 45,000 slaves who worked and died very hard here oh so many ages ago to build this thing that got my very keen and sensitive 6 year old son thinking, but it was clear we really should not be here.

My kiddos, 6&8, were by far the youngest in the growing group and nothing about this "tour" that was to last at least another hour once inside would be appealing to them. We found we should have just walked to the ancient temple ruins right up the street that we passed as the bus had slowed to a stop at our current concrete prison.

Nevertheless the tour suddenly jolted to a hastened group frenzied pace as we quickly made our way inside to be slaughtered by lions just for the enjoyment of others.

I'll admit that as a parent trying to look out for the best interests of a child, I would do most anything to save the day. We played the "my son is very sick" card and while the guide himself initially would have none of it, the main runner guy--the one with the money--was sympathetic and did in fact offer all our money back. We even would have taken less at this point but we were very grateful and promised him we would return one day. I think he was smart enough to realize that our kids, like any of their young age in this situation, would have become miserable and thus may have dampened the experience for his other customers. We had signed up but hey, they should better gauge their customers too...or is it just about the money?

Anyway, we'd like to think that maybe the lead money guy believed in good will, which until now we had been skeptical about at such a tourist trap as this one. Either way, I am pleased at whatever it was that empowered him to refund us and it gives me a renewed faith in people and in how things are in places like Rome. That to me is a sign of good quality and so yes, someday we shall return. The kiddos just have to be older and yes we pretty much knew that anyway going into this trip. But even this slight exposure to culture is going to give them a leg up especially around some of the provincial types I know back home--some of whom don't even have a passport. Therefore, we have little regret.

We had another gelato and boarded the next bus of our hop on hop off company. We took it back to the hotel and went for another swim. Remember, the kiddos are 6&8. And for our kids, water is fun. Little else matters and guess what: That's fine with us. My kids absorbed the sights and sounds and dress and such. They were fully aware of their surroundings so forcing them to stare at a painting or a bunch of old monuments wasn't as needed as it is for all you art history buffs out there.

One of the kiddos even asked me why the bus tour tape didn't mention all the statues we passed but only some of them. Surely these unnamed figures were important too but who were they? I did manage to explain to my son that this country and this very place is where the real dudes whose names are had by the Ninja Turtles come from. He smiled.

You see my friends? You need a lifetime to see all of Rome. My kiddos started in grade school.

We ate more pasta and pizza on a small pretty street by the Spanish Steps with outside cafes and scooters putting by and also had more gelato.

We later made it back to the hotel on foot and the kiddos used their ipads as my wife and I watched some of the world cup. By the half I predicted this game would end in penalty kicks and sadly I was correct as the Dutch lost after we all fell asleep.

We woke early to have the hotel staff get us into a readied Mercedes car and our driver buzzed us away through many neat backroads and skinny hilly streets that once again gave us that unique European driving feeling. I would to own that car and to be able to drive like that!

Everything in Rome had been great. We all liked it very much and of course we now had no jet lag (I have been on trips to Europe where it lasts many days). We arrived at FCO, the Rome airport at 7:15am, well in advance of our next flight onto Mykonos, Greece... Or so we thought...

PWMTrav

An entertaining read, thanks for sharing! I can relate to the story about disturbing other passengers, but I do think it's mostly in our heads. We flew my 18 month old in AF J (BOS-CDG-FLR) this year and it went pretty well. However, they still have the 2-3-2 angle flat on the 772, which flies the route in off-peak season, so we could sit close together. I probably wouldn't do it in the suite-style herringbone or staggered newer business products.

Our next trip is going to be in economy, I think. My daughter is just too young to sit apart from us and the trend in business class is privacy, so as soon as AF removes that old product, there's no option to sit together. US still flies the 767 PHL-FCO in the off season, which is 2-2-2 in J, but staggered. I don't mind angle flats, so we might give that a shot.

Do I take that you were only in Rome for 1 day/1 night? I hope you go back!

By the time our next trip happens, hopefully two of us will be holding EU passports. My parents made the mistake of not registering me at the Italian consulate when I was born/before I turned 18, so I need to take the long road through jure sanguinis citizenship. Thankfully, my daughter will acquire her passport automatically and my wife can apply with just a law enforcement check once I get mine done.

Marathon Man

when my son was 2 or 3 he kicked the seat in front of him for an entire 8 hr flight. We had to restrain him with all our might at times. The people in front of us were NOT happy.

I thought up my idea about having a kids section on planes with nannies to help out. Now Richard Branson has this idea too. I should talk to the bloke!

We will do biz from now on I think. He wont kick anymore but space in long hauls is needed.

We were in Rome for the night of the 9th and 10th and we left Rome on the am of the 11th.

I cannot really get Dutch citizenship without renouncing my US as far as I can tell. So I wont go for it. My wife has both--born dutch and has US too, and kiddos have both.

One big thing that did happen though was that when we came into Rome, they let us thru that EU line but neglected to stamp my passport. Leaving AMS on the 24th, AMS officials were not too keen on this. I had to be brought aside. Then I explained it and they let me through. They wanted to see my itinerary printout which I did have with me, and that showed my entry into Rome and leaving from AMS.

PWMTrav

Is that a Dutch thing? The US is legislatively indifferent to dual citizens, and there's no real policy that weighs in on it either. At least, that's my knowledge of the matter - I'm not an immigration lawyer.

Marathon Man

No idea. I just know the US did not want it and everything seemed like more of a PITA than when I did all the paperwork myself for my wife to get her original residency status years ago. I will leave this alone for a while and maybe the world will change for the better some day.

Nanook

We were in Rome last year and stayed at the Westin Excelsior. They have a car service desk in their lobby. Before we arrived, we emailed the hotel, who then passed the email on to the car service. We were picked up on time and delivered to the hotel without problem. Don't remember the price -- 120 Euros or so, but we would do it again. It was painless and we arrived at the hotel in fine form, not having to figure things out (which we don't do in other places). The charge was added to our hotel bill and of course, we got extra starpoints for this.

That said, we were picked up in a smallish Mercedes. When we left the hotel for Civitavecchia a few days later, they sent a larger car. So if you do this, ask for the larger vehicle, which is usually based at the Eden.

dillard8

So sorry as I am sure this has been asked before, but I've looked and haven't seen an answer to my specific questions. I will be traveling to Rome in a few weeks for a couple of days, arriving at FCO at 8:30 a.m. on a weekday. I'll have a small rollaboard and a shoulder bag, and am trying to figure out the best way to get to my hotel (Hotel Eden). I've researched this and it appears I have the following options, but I would appreciate any feedback on what might be the best at that time of day, as its been about 15 years since I was last in Rome:

(1) Leonardo Express from FCO to Termini + cab to hotel. This probably would be my preferred option, but...in researching I came across several articles and blog posts warning about being scammed and overcharged by the cab drivers at Termini - i.e., 6-8 Euro trips turning into 30-40 Euro trips...though most seem to be a few years old. Is this really a widespread problem? I'm a petite female going to a relatively expensive hotel and speak only a few words of Italian, so I'm concerned I'd be seen as "easy pickings" if so. Alternatively, I could take the regionale train to Tiburtina and a cab to the hotel from there, if this happens mostly just at the Termini taxi stand.

(2) Leonardo Express from FCO to Termini; Metro A line two stops to Barberini, then short walk (8 mins) to hotel. This also seems to be pretty straightforward, but I'm a little concerned about whether the metro will be too crowded during the tail end of the morning rush to try to schlep on luggage. It's been a long time since I was last in Rome, but I remember the metro being crazy crowded at times. This will be the week of the Ferragosto holiday though and it seems like a lot is shut down that week, so maybe that will thin the normal rush hour crowds?

(3) Leonardo Express from FCO to Termini; walk (20+ mins. or so, assuming I don't get lost) to hotel. This seems not ideal, and I remember some of the areas around Termini being not the greatest though that may have changed.

(4) Cab or shuttle direct from airport. This seems unnecessarily expensive for one person with limited luggage, but it's an option.

PWMTrav

120 euro is high - was that round trip? The hotel to the airport was 50 euro using the St. Regis' car service. The last time we did that was 3 years ago, so I'm sure it's gone up, but at the time it was 5-10 euro more than the cab fare.

Honestly, of all the things I can't stand about FCO, the taxi situation doesn't bear any complaints. In fact, it might be the highlight of the airport. You literally just walk out the door past customs and get into a cab. Fares to any point within the city walls are a flat 48 euro, same for the return ride.

Marathon Man

Gladly, this was our experience. In fact no issues took place at all in this area. I would likely use those same outside cabs again.

bdemaria

"Best" is very subjective. Do you mean easiest? Fastest? Least expensive? I personally would take the Leonardo Express and then take a taxi. Are there lousy taxi drivers? Sure, but that's going to be true of almost any large city, and a taxi is a far easier - and nicer - option than the Metro. Get in the cab and state, Hotel Eden, Via Ludovisi (loo-dough-vee- see) Grazie.

I would also add that you should not expect your room to be ready until much later in the afternoon.

dillard8

I thought I was pretty clear, but I guess not. I am looking for the "best" option given the time I'm arriving and amount of luggage I'll have. Cost is not the most important thing but I don't want to waste a ton of money either. As I said, I was leaning toward the Leonardo Express + taxi, but the numerous complaints I'd read specifically regarding taxis from the Termini taxi stand gave me pause. I'm not concerned about figuring out metro lines/tickets either, just about whether it will be too crowded for me to fight my way in with luggage at that time of morning. I was hoping someone with recent experience on these could weigh in.

And yes, of course I will be arriving before the 2 p.m. check-in time as usual given the overnight flights from the States to Europe - if the room's not ready I'll drop my bag and head out into the city, no big deal.

Perche

In your position I'd take the cab. The cab is 48 euros, flat fee, no tip expected. If you take the LE and then a cab, that's going to be 22 euros, give or take, or almost half of what it would take to just get a cab. It's not worth it after a long flight.

The taxis from FCO to downtown do not rip you off. It's a flat fee, period. When you get in just ask and confirm 48 euros, right? In the city it's pretty unusual to get ripped off, but you will definitely not get ripped off coming from the airport if you have your wits about you since it's a flat fee to anywhere downtown.

I wouldn't take the Metro A at that hour after a long flight. The A train is air conditioned, but the subway is not. The Metro can be crowded and nasty in August. Forget about the option of walking from Termini to Piazza Barberini. It's a long, hilly walk. Pulling a rollaboard on regular streets for a mile is one thing; pulling it a mile on cobblestone streets is something else.

Perche

I don't mean to be rude, but I believe you were very seriously ripped off. These are the type of shenanigans that they pull on tourists that give Italy a bad name.