Delta > Virgin OR United?
Nov 18, 2015, 6:27 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Programs: DL
Posts: 16
Delta > Virgin OR United?
I happily fly on Delta SFO-JFK about 120K/yr (a few trips to both Asia and Europe. One to Africa in '16) & regular to PIT (everyone sucks to PIT).
What changed: For CY16, I very likely need to fly weekly (pretty much commuting, roughly being in DC M-F) SFO->IAD (or DCA, of course). Delta (highest ranked in customer service) requires I go through LAX or JFK each way. Virgin (which I like, 2nd in customer service) appears to offer directs (at least no red-eyes) 9 of 12 months of the year (connecting through LAX for the others). United (last in customer service) offers frequent directs to IAD, and while we are at it, to EWR and even 1x/day to PIT.
Besides the surveys putting United last, I have not had a good experience with them; my wife as not had a good experience with them; I have heard from friends in Global Services that even at that level, they are mediocre.
There is a lot to like about Delta as their highest (Diamond) status. (My wife and I separately have their amex reserve card; she is platinum w/Delta mostly through that card).
First-to-board.
*much* better phone support
Generally, I find delta to be very good.
good planes w/decent wifi and, when I want it, entertainment options.
Good, and improving, lounges.
occasional upgrades (though not JFK/SFO), but economy + is almost always fine for me. Straight-up economy in any airline is tough as I can recall.
Will I regret doing a status match with United? Or is Virgin the better choice OR just sucking it up with Delta and its connections best?
What changed: For CY16, I very likely need to fly weekly (pretty much commuting, roughly being in DC M-F) SFO->IAD (or DCA, of course). Delta (highest ranked in customer service) requires I go through LAX or JFK each way. Virgin (which I like, 2nd in customer service) appears to offer directs (at least no red-eyes) 9 of 12 months of the year (connecting through LAX for the others). United (last in customer service) offers frequent directs to IAD, and while we are at it, to EWR and even 1x/day to PIT.
Besides the surveys putting United last, I have not had a good experience with them; my wife as not had a good experience with them; I have heard from friends in Global Services that even at that level, they are mediocre.
There is a lot to like about Delta as their highest (Diamond) status. (My wife and I separately have their amex reserve card; she is platinum w/Delta mostly through that card).
First-to-board.
*much* better phone support
Generally, I find delta to be very good.
good planes w/decent wifi and, when I want it, entertainment options.
Good, and improving, lounges.
occasional upgrades (though not JFK/SFO), but economy + is almost always fine for me. Straight-up economy in any airline is tough as I can recall.
Will I regret doing a status match with United? Or is Virgin the better choice OR just sucking it up with Delta and its connections best?
Nov 18, 2015, 6:57 am
#2
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: BOS, BWI, DCA, IAD
Programs: American, Delta, JetBlue, United
Posts: 2,049
UA also offers non-stops SFO-DCA and SFO-BWI, though these flights are less frequent than those from SFO to IAD. Depending on what part of the Washington area you will be travelling to and from, you may find that the ability to fly to DCA or BWI is an important factor to take into consideration. Public transportation to Dulles has improved with the opening of the Silver Line, but Metro still doesn't reach the airport. DCA is very convenient to many places by Metro, and BWI has become more readily accessible in the past couple of years with the introduction of weekend service from the airport to Union Station/Washington on the MARC Penn Line.
Nov 18, 2015, 12:36 pm
#4
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If you've been happy with DL, I'd try to stick with DL initially and see how it goes with connecting to get to DCA. UA seems to still be an operational mess, so their nonstops could be unreliable hassles for you. Virgin (America?) doesn't have a big network, although I assume they have some international partners.
Nov 24, 2015, 12:43 pm
#5
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Programs: DL
Posts: 16
Nov 24, 2015, 12:45 pm
#6
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Posts: 8,460
My base is ORD so unfortunately I don't get to fly Virgin too often but whenever I go to LA or SF, I book Virgin without hesitation.
Nov 24, 2015, 12:50 pm
#7
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Programs: DL
Posts: 16
UA also offers non-stops SFO-DCA and SFO-BWI, though these flights are less frequent than those from SFO to IAD. Depending on what part of the Washington area you will be travelling to and from, you may find that the ability to fly to DCA or BWI is an important factor to take into consideration. Public transportation to Dulles has improved with the opening of the Silver Line, but Metro still doesn't reach the airport. DCA is very convenient to many places by Metro, and BWI has become more readily accessible in the past couple of years with the introduction of weekend service from the airport to Union Station/Washington on the MARC Penn Line.
It looks like the public options all require some transfers. I have done this out of Manhattan to JFK taking air train and E-line, but only when my office was two blocks from an E-line stop.
Nov 24, 2015, 5:46 pm
#8
Join Date: Jul 2009
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UA also offers non-stops SFO-DCA and SFO-BWI, though these flights are less frequent than those from SFO to IAD. Depending on what part of the Washington area you will be travelling to and from, you may find that the ability to fly to DCA or BWI is an important factor to take into consideration. Public transportation to Dulles has improved with the opening of the Silver Line, but Metro still doesn't reach the airport. DCA is very convenient to many places by Metro, and BWI has become more readily accessible in the past couple of years with the introduction of weekend service from the airport to Union Station/Washington on the MARC Penn Line.
It looks like the public options all require some transfers. I have done this out of Manhattan to JFK taking air train and E-line, but only when my office was two blocks from an E-line s
top.
Nov 24, 2015, 10:14 pm
#9
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Programs: DL
Posts: 16
The DCA schedules are less convenient to SFO (i.e., I want a red-eye East-Bound and late West-Bound) than IAD.
If I were to tolerate one-stop, isn't it also reasonable to think of a LAX stop being more resistant to (mostly weather) delays than other major hubs?
Nov 25, 2015, 1:42 am
#10
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I will be on Pennsylvania & 16th, so BWI looks to be a ways out. Public options look to make this painful commenting situation worse, so I looked at Uber rates, which themselves took to be 1/2 of taxi rates.
It looks like the public options all require some transfers. I have done this out of Manhattan to JFK taking air train and E-line, but only when my office was two blocks from an E-line stop.
It looks like the public options all require some transfers. I have done this out of Manhattan to JFK taking air train and E-line, but only when my office was two blocks from an E-line stop.
Virgin and UA have one nonstop in each direction daily. The VX flight leaves SFO at 8AM and burns through an entire day arriving at 4 PM. The UA flight leaves at 2 and gets in at 10 PM. The return on VX is an evening departure and the UA return is a morning departure. If those times work, you might be better off picking one or both and using them If not, you're into having to connect, and there I'd give Delta an edge based on better hubs that tend not to be delay prone and which also tend to be less crowded than the usual ordeal one would have at ORD on AA or UA. Generally speaking, I'd give AA and DL an edge over UA for reliability.
I haven't flown Virgin enough to offer an opinion.
I would avoid using JFK for connections on DL. JFK is just too prone to delays when there are far better options in DTW, MSP or SLC. I hate to say that, because the JFK-SFO Delta One product is a very nice ride.
Anything you choose will have pros and cons. One thing to bear in mind is that 50 trips a year between DCA/IAD and SFO is enough to hold down top tier status on two airlines. (50x5000=250K) Splitting your loyalty might not be a bad option here.
Nov 26, 2015, 7:05 pm
#11
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Programs: DL
Posts: 16
Just forget about wanting to use IAD or BWI. Banish the thought from your mind. DCA is minutes from 16th and Pennsylvania. Cabs, Uber and even the Metro are convenient, fast and cheap. Schlepping out to IAD weekly will get very tired very fast.
Virgin and UA have one nonstop in each direction daily. The VX flight leaves SFO at 8AM and burns through an entire day arriving at 4 PM. The UA flight leaves at 2 and gets in at 10 PM. The return on VX is an evening departure and the UA return is a morning departure. If those times work, you might be better off picking one or both and using them If not, you're into having to connect, and there I'd give Delta an edge based on better hubs that tend not to be delay prone and which also tend to be less crowded than the usual ordeal one would have at ORD on AA or UA. Generally speaking, I'd give AA and DL an edge over UA for reliability.
I haven't flown Virgin enough to offer an opinion.
I would avoid using JFK for connections on DL. JFK is just too prone to delays when there are far better options in DTW, MSP or SLC. I hate to say that, because the JFK-SFO Delta One product is a very nice ride.
Anything you choose will have pros and cons. One thing to bear in mind is that 50 trips a year between DCA/IAD and SFO is enough to hold down top tier status on two airlines. (50x5000=250K) Splitting your loyalty might not be a bad option here.
Virgin and UA have one nonstop in each direction daily. The VX flight leaves SFO at 8AM and burns through an entire day arriving at 4 PM. The UA flight leaves at 2 and gets in at 10 PM. The return on VX is an evening departure and the UA return is a morning departure. If those times work, you might be better off picking one or both and using them If not, you're into having to connect, and there I'd give Delta an edge based on better hubs that tend not to be delay prone and which also tend to be less crowded than the usual ordeal one would have at ORD on AA or UA. Generally speaking, I'd give AA and DL an edge over UA for reliability.
I haven't flown Virgin enough to offer an opinion.
I would avoid using JFK for connections on DL. JFK is just too prone to delays when there are far better options in DTW, MSP or SLC. I hate to say that, because the JFK-SFO Delta One product is a very nice ride.
Anything you choose will have pros and cons. One thing to bear in mind is that 50 trips a year between DCA/IAD and SFO is enough to hold down top tier status on two airlines. (50x5000=250K) Splitting your loyalty might not be a bad option here.
I'll need to see about the burn-a-Monday-in-the-air on Virgin or the connection issue on Delta. Maybe those are good options schedule-wise. The advice to consider two airlines for elite status is also well taken. I am not sure Diamond gets me much v. Platinum on Delta and on Virgin I recall the threshold of top-tier is less. OH, and yes, that Delta one product SFO-JFK is fantastic.
Nov 26, 2015, 7:11 pm
#12
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Washington, DC
Programs: DL PM; IHG PlatAmb; Hilton Dia; Marriott Plat; Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 7,320
Just forget about wanting to use IAD or BWI. Banish the thought from your mind. DCA is minutes from 16th and Pennsylvania. Cabs, Uber and even the Metro are convenient, fast and cheap. Schlepping out to IAD weekly will get very tired very fast.
Virgin and UA have one nonstop in each direction daily. The VX flight leaves SFO at 8AM and burns through an entire day arriving at 4 PM. The UA flight leaves at 2 and gets in at 10 PM. The return on VX is an evening departure and the UA return is a morning departure. If those times work, you might be better off picking one or both and using them If not, you're into having to connect, and there I'd give Delta an edge based on better hubs that tend not to be delay prone and which also tend to be less crowded than the usual ordeal one would have at ORD on AA or UA. Generally speaking, I'd give AA and DL an edge over UA for reliability.
I haven't flown Virgin enough to offer an opinion.
I would avoid using JFK for connections on DL. JFK is just too prone to delays when there are far better options in DTW, MSP or SLC. I hate to say that, because the JFK-SFO Delta One product is a very nice ride.
Anything you choose will have pros and cons. One thing to bear in mind is that 50 trips a year between DCA/IAD and SFO is enough to hold down top tier status on two airlines. (50x5000=250K) Splitting your loyalty might not be a bad option here.
Virgin and UA have one nonstop in each direction daily. The VX flight leaves SFO at 8AM and burns through an entire day arriving at 4 PM. The UA flight leaves at 2 and gets in at 10 PM. The return on VX is an evening departure and the UA return is a morning departure. If those times work, you might be better off picking one or both and using them If not, you're into having to connect, and there I'd give Delta an edge based on better hubs that tend not to be delay prone and which also tend to be less crowded than the usual ordeal one would have at ORD on AA or UA. Generally speaking, I'd give AA and DL an edge over UA for reliability.
I haven't flown Virgin enough to offer an opinion.
I would avoid using JFK for connections on DL. JFK is just too prone to delays when there are far better options in DTW, MSP or SLC. I hate to say that, because the JFK-SFO Delta One product is a very nice ride.
Anything you choose will have pros and cons. One thing to bear in mind is that 50 trips a year between DCA/IAD and SFO is enough to hold down top tier status on two airlines. (50x5000=250K) Splitting your loyalty might not be a bad option here.
I'll need to see about the burn-a-Monday-in-the-air on Virgin or the connection issue on Delta. Maybe those are good options schedule-wise. The advice to consider two airlines for elite status is also well taken. I am not sure Diamond gets me much v. Platinum on Delta and on Virgin I recall the threshold of top-tier is less. OH, and yes, that Delta one product SFO-JFK is fantastic.
Midtown to JFK is 18 miles. DC to Dulles is 26 miles. So yes, it can be a lot worse.
Nov 26, 2015, 7:12 pm
#13
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Programs: DL
Posts: 16
Just to compare geographies, how bad do you compare IAD to, say, JFK to Midtown East? I was thinking that DCA is analogous to LGA, but what I get from these responses is that IAD is worse than JFK or DIA or SEA (for those in, say, Redmond), even if the distances are roughly comparable.
Nov 26, 2015, 8:44 pm
#14
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Washington, DC
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Posts: 7,320
Just to compare geographies, how bad do you compare IAD to, say, JFK to Midtown East? I was thinking that DCA is analogous to LGA, but what I get from these responses is that IAD is worse than JFK or DIA or SEA (for those in, say, Redmond), even if the distances are roughly comparable.
Comparisons are hard, but as someone who lived in Midtown Manhattan for many years and has been in DC for 2 years, I avoid Dulles a lot more than I avoided JFK. Midtown East to JFK isn't so bad- e train to Jamaica and then the air train is pretty easy. Downtown DC to Dulles would require either the 5a bus or a bus to an extremely long train ride.
By car, midtown east to JFK is extremely variable timewise. But Dulles has an overpriced taxi monopoly when you land there, and If you're getting off a redeye, you are stuck in rush hour traffic for 30 miles on a road that is a major transit issue in the region.