Best program for upgrading to first using credit card miles?
Sep 2, 2015, 6:19 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Software
Posts: 4
Best program for upgrading to first using credit card miles?
LOOOONG time lurker here.
Okay, so, I have a nice bucket of Amex and Chase Sapphire miles and an upcoming trip from Denver to Santiago, Chile. Naturally, I want the comfort and convenience of flying first. I have no particularly useful status with any airline.
So the question is, how do I convert these miles into a first class upgrade? I can compare outright cost on Kayak easily, but as far as I can tell, the best/only way to figure out what a mileage upgrade would cost is actually calling each airline's frequent flyer program and outright asking.
Is there a shortcut I should know about?
Which airline has the best redemption in terms of points for an upgrade and how do I figure this out?
Thanks you crazy kids!
Okay, so, I have a nice bucket of Amex and Chase Sapphire miles and an upcoming trip from Denver to Santiago, Chile. Naturally, I want the comfort and convenience of flying first. I have no particularly useful status with any airline.
So the question is, how do I convert these miles into a first class upgrade? I can compare outright cost on Kayak easily, but as far as I can tell, the best/only way to figure out what a mileage upgrade would cost is actually calling each airline's frequent flyer program and outright asking.
Is there a shortcut I should know about?
Which airline has the best redemption in terms of points for an upgrade and how do I figure this out?Thanks you crazy kids!
Sep 2, 2015, 6:50 pm
#2
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: New York, NY
Programs: AA ExPl, DL PM, UA Silver, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott Titanium, probably some others
Posts: 4,075
Why don't you just use the miles to buy a ticket in first in lieu of buying an economy ticket and using the miles to upgrade?
Sep 2, 2015, 10:47 pm
#3
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: MEL CHC
Posts: 20,987
For most airlines & ffp's upgrades are not guaranteed. FFP status can be very important
Frequent flying is not the same as frequent spending (a miles to a ffp)
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/infor...help-here.html
Frequent flying is not the same as frequent spending (a miles to a ffp)
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/infor...help-here.html
Sep 3, 2015, 1:34 am
#4
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Canada, USA, Europe
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 31,452
You can't upgrade flights using Amex/Chase miles on their own. You will generally need to transfer these into the FFP programme of the airline that you'll be flying (who issued your ticket) and then upgrade using your new airline miles. There are some pitfalls, however, including the need for upgrade space to be available, and being able to upgrade the particular economy fare you bought (not are upgradable). As mentioned above, you may be better off just redeeming for a business class ticket in the first place.
One additional point: You say 'first' but I think you mean business class. Domestic US first class is very different from international premium cabins, which generally offer economy/business/first, or a combined business-first concept.
One additional point: You say 'first' but I think you mean business class. Domestic US first class is very different from international premium cabins, which generally offer economy/business/first, or a combined business-first concept.
Sep 3, 2015, 1:39 am
#5
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: MEL CHC
Posts: 20,987
Most US domestic first class would be considered poor business class at best on many non USA airlines flying long haul international routes.
Sep 3, 2015, 8:57 am
#6
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: CLT
Programs: AA, UA, BA, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Gold, IHG Platinum
Posts: 2,074
Is there a reason you want to use miles to upgrade rather than just redeeming miles for a premium class ticket? Upgrading is more difficult and more costly than just redeeming for a premium award outright, but if another entity is paying for economy, it can make sense.
Sep 3, 2015, 9:30 am
#7
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Software
Posts: 4
You can't upgrade flights using Amex/Chase miles on their own. You will generally need to transfer these into the FFP programme of the airline that you'll be flying (who issued your ticket) and then upgrade using your new airline miles. There are some pitfalls, however, including the need for upgrade space to be available, and being able to upgrade the particular economy fare you bought (not are upgradable). As mentioned above, you may be better off just redeeming for a business class ticket in the first place.
One additional point: You say 'first' but I think you mean business class. Domestic US first class is very different from international premium cabins, which generally offer economy/business/first, or a combined business-first concept.
One additional point: You say 'first' but I think you mean business class. Domestic US first class is very different from international premium cabins, which generally offer economy/business/first, or a combined business-first concept.
I'd be happy with either upgrade. Even Air France's international "premium economy" is pretty good -- comparable to US Domestic first.
Thanks for the tips on the upgrade. I was planning to figure out what my best bet was, transfer my miles, and try to get the upgrade, but I hadn't figured in that it might not be available at all.
Any thoughts on what the best airline to approach this is for South America? American Airlines? Delta?
Sep 3, 2015, 9:33 am
#8
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Software
Posts: 4
The reason being it seemed cheaper, but unreliable and hard to plan. For example, American claims that for a South American trip, I can upgrade to Business for 15,000 miles from a refundable economy. That's only about $150 worth of miles.
Whereas buying it outright seems like a lot more.
Sep 3, 2015, 9:40 am
#9
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2012
Programs: BA Gold, QF WP
Posts: 12,551
The reason being it seemed cheaper, but unreliable and hard to plan. For example, American claims that for a South American trip, I can upgrade to Business for 15,000 miles from a refundable economy. That's only about $150 worth of miles.
Whereas buying it outright seems like a lot more.
Whereas buying it outright seems like a lot more.
If you have a 'bucket' of points/miles, booking a guaranteed outright award in the class you want to travel in seems like the best option.
Sep 3, 2015, 3:19 pm
#10
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: CLT
Programs: AA, UA, BA, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Gold, IHG Platinum
Posts: 2,074
The reason being it seemed cheaper, but unreliable and hard to plan. For example, American claims that for a South American trip, I can upgrade to Business for 15,000 miles from a refundable economy. That's only about $150 worth of miles.
Whereas buying it outright seems like a lot more.
Whereas buying it outright seems like a lot more.
You could upgrade the discount fare ($914) for 25k + $350 each way for a total cost of 50k miles + $1,614, pending upgrade availability. Or you can book an award flight for 100k miles round trip, pending award availability. So, the question is, would you pay $1,500 (I'm allowing for some taxes & fees on the award) for 50k miles? AA will sell you 62k for $1,500 right now, and that's after all the taxes and their junk fee.
Sep 3, 2015, 4:17 pm
#11
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: MEL CHC
Posts: 20,987
You are being unrealistically optimistic in hoping to get upgrades. More so with no ffp status
From http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/infor...help-here.html
Award flights with your airline, and its FFP partners (alliance airlines and non-alliance) are subject to availability & the rules of your airlines FFP. Alliance airline FFP's do not have the same non-alliance airline partners. Award flights are not free. Some can have very high cash co-payments.
Some airlines have better earning/redemption charts for your pattern. For example, if you fly on cheap fares on a certain airline often, Airline ABC might give you miles for it, while Airline XYZ might not or give fewer miles. However Airline ABC might charge much more miles and/or cash surcharges for the redemption that you want than does Airline XYZ. Earn to burn is what matters.
It's better to have status with the airline you fly with most - it just works better, and you should get preference for any upgrades or during service issues. Airlines tend to give members of their own frequent flyer program better service, than members of other frequent flyer programs. The airline you fly with the most will often have inherent home scheme advantages. If you fly one of these airlines, it is recommended that you choose that airline. As a very general rule, it's best to maintain status on the airline you mostly fly, other things being equal. Often status on the carrier being flown gets you access to special seats or even eligibility for upgrades. It will matter more than alliance status during IROPs and might give you higher priority for OPUPs.
<snip>
For upgrades the general rule is you can only upgrade a flight marketed (flight number) and operated (metal) by the airline of your frequent flyer programme (no codeshares) with your airlines upgrade instrument (e.g. SWU, miles) or complementary with status (if applicable). All subject to the t&c's of your FFP and your paid ticket. Low cost tickets are often not eligible for upgrades.
However as is the way with FFP's there are some upgrade exceptions
- on AA/BA/IB with higher priced economy fares using AA/BA/IB upgrade instruments
- on some BA tickets with Asia Miles
- on some Star Alliance airlines with higher priced Y & B fare as Star upgrade awards and Star How to upgrade
- on some Skyteam airlines as this blue link
- SkyTeam Mileage Upgrade Program
<snip>
Some airlines have better earning/redemption charts for your pattern. For example, if you fly on cheap fares on a certain airline often, Airline ABC might give you miles for it, while Airline XYZ might not or give fewer miles. However Airline ABC might charge much more miles and/or cash surcharges for the redemption that you want than does Airline XYZ. Earn to burn is what matters.
It's better to have status with the airline you fly with most - it just works better, and you should get preference for any upgrades or during service issues. Airlines tend to give members of their own frequent flyer program better service, than members of other frequent flyer programs. The airline you fly with the most will often have inherent home scheme advantages. If you fly one of these airlines, it is recommended that you choose that airline. As a very general rule, it's best to maintain status on the airline you mostly fly, other things being equal. Often status on the carrier being flown gets you access to special seats or even eligibility for upgrades. It will matter more than alliance status during IROPs and might give you higher priority for OPUPs.
<snip>
For upgrades the general rule is you can only upgrade a flight marketed (flight number) and operated (metal) by the airline of your frequent flyer programme (no codeshares) with your airlines upgrade instrument (e.g. SWU, miles) or complementary with status (if applicable). All subject to the t&c's of your FFP and your paid ticket. Low cost tickets are often not eligible for upgrades.
However as is the way with FFP's there are some upgrade exceptions
- on AA/BA/IB with higher priced economy fares using AA/BA/IB upgrade instruments
- on some BA tickets with Asia Miles
- on some Star Alliance airlines with higher priced Y & B fare as Star upgrade awards and Star How to upgrade
- on some Skyteam airlines as this blue link
- SkyTeam Mileage Upgrade Program
<snip>
Sep 3, 2015, 5:38 pm
#12
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: New York, NY
Programs: AA ExPl, DL PM, UA Silver, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott Titanium, probably some others
Posts: 4,075
Upgraded cabin either way. For example recently from Paris to Toronto, Air Canada's only upgrade was business, with a lay-flat seat. They had no "first" option.
I'd be happy with either upgrade. Even Air France's international "premium economy" is pretty good -- comparable to US Domestic first.
Thanks for the tips on the upgrade. I was planning to figure out what my best bet was, transfer my miles, and try to get the upgrade, but I hadn't figured in that it might not be available at all.
Any thoughts on what the best airline to approach this is for South America? American Airlines? Delta?
I'd be happy with either upgrade. Even Air France's international "premium economy" is pretty good -- comparable to US Domestic first.
Thanks for the tips on the upgrade. I was planning to figure out what my best bet was, transfer my miles, and try to get the upgrade, but I hadn't figured in that it might not be available at all.
Any thoughts on what the best airline to approach this is for South America? American Airlines? Delta?
Sep 3, 2015, 7:24 pm
#13
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: home = LAX
Posts: 25,932
LOOOONG time lurker here.
Okay, so, I have a nice bucket of Amex and Chase Sapphire miles and an upcoming trip from Denver to Santiago, Chile. Naturally, I want the comfort and convenience of flying first. I have no particularly useful status with any airline.
So the question is, how do I convert these miles into a first class upgrade? I can compare outright cost on Kayak easily, but as far as I can tell, the best/only way to figure out what a mileage upgrade would cost is actually calling each airline's frequent flyer program and outright asking.
Is there a shortcut I should know about? Which airline has the best redemption in terms of points for an upgrade and how do I figure this out?
Thanks you crazy kids!
Okay, so, I have a nice bucket of Amex and Chase Sapphire miles and an upcoming trip from Denver to Santiago, Chile. Naturally, I want the comfort and convenience of flying first. I have no particularly useful status with any airline.
So the question is, how do I convert these miles into a first class upgrade? I can compare outright cost on Kayak easily, but as far as I can tell, the best/only way to figure out what a mileage upgrade would cost is actually calling each airline's frequent flyer program and outright asking.
Is there a shortcut I should know about?
Which airline has the best redemption in terms of points for an upgrade and how do I figure this out?Thanks you crazy kids!
AA charges a co-pay, so you need a combination of miles and some money, not just miles. (For example, a domestic one-way upgrade from coach to the next class up is 15k AA miles + $75. But the co-pay goes up faster than the number of miles needed when you get to longhaul flights!)
Some other airlines that don't charge a co-pay don't allow upgrades with miles at all from the cheapest fares, so you have to pay a more expensive fare to be able to upgrade! And forget about finding those upgrade-compatible fares on Kayak... (AA allows you to upgrade from most any fare, in exchange for having to pay that co-pay.)
And, of course, upgrades are far from guaranteed. Unless you're booking well ahead, and know how to look for flights that have "instantly confirmable" upgrades, and only take those flights and no others, you may spend a lot of time (right up until boarding) on a "waitlist" to see if you can get upgraded. (And how to look for those "instantly confirmable" upgrades varies from airline to airline, and I only know how to do it on AA, and you can't use either Amex MR or Chase UR for AA miles, so I don't see how more AA-specific info will help you.)
Originally Posted by pantsman
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Software
Posts: 4
Location: Software
Posts: 4
Last edited by sdsearch; Sep 3, 2015 at 7:35 pm
Sep 4, 2015, 3:28 am
#14
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: South Park, Metropolis
Programs: AA LT PLT 3MM, Hilton/Marriott/SPG/Club Carlson GLD, IHG PLT
Posts: 4,606
Best program for upgrading to first using credit card miles?
Upgrades to premium cabin, either economy, business, or first is a product that airlines offer to reward its members of their frequent flyer program or those that pay for it. No status + not willing to pay = no upgrade. Its a simple formula. Try to concentrate your flying with a particular carrier, achieve status, and you will start seeing different service. The higher the status, the better the service overall.
There are others that do not have a preference of airlines, free agents so to speak. They buy tickets based on convenience to them and pay for what they want.
There are others that do not have a preference of airlines, free agents so to speak. They buy tickets based on convenience to them and pay for what they want.
Sep 4, 2015, 7:57 am
#15
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: BWI
Posts: 1,782
I can't vouch for the accuracy, but I found this just yesterday. Might be a good read for the OP.
http://thepointsguy.com/2015/01/how-...iers-part-one/
http://thepointsguy.com/2015/01/how-...iers-part-one/
