maxwell109

Please be easy on me; this is my first post. I've tried to find an answer to my particular question in the forums but have been unsuccessful. I also thought other newbie MRs might benefit from my experience and question, so here goes....

Did the SFO->DFW->HKG MR on AA a month ago with an 19 hour layover in HKG (from 6:30pm to 1:30pm the next day. Because of the flight length and crossing the International Date Line, I could not check in for my return HKG before leaving the US. And, upon landing in HKG, I learned the AA desk there is staffed only a few hours a day (like 9:30am-1:30pm). I found a transit desk where I received a slip of paper allowing me to take the elevator to the Departures level and telling me to report to the W1 desk the next morning. Once on the Departures level, I was denied access to the CP lounges even though I am a OW Emerald (USAirways CP, thus AA EP) because I didn't have a boarding pass for my return flight. With the Priority Pass access associated with my AmEx Platinum card, I got into the 24 hour pay-in lounge. When I attempted to go down one level to the W1 desk to get my return boarding passes the next day, I had a very difficult time doing so. Finally, after convincing a transit desk employee to accompany me down using the employee elevator, I got my boarding passes, went through security and made my way to The Wing.

What could/should I have done differently? I'm asking because I'm doing this exact same MR again in a few weeks.

SFO777

I love airports but not 19 hours worth. Why not spend the night in Hong Kong?
Perhaps take the train into the city, explore, have dinner and get a proper night's sleep in a hotel.
Then return to the airport the next morning and check in as you normally would, rested for your return.
And welcome to FT!

CDKing

For more information on what to do see the HKG forum. No need to stay at the airport. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/hong-kong-macau-436/

maxwell109

Thanks for the suggestions were I to leave the airport. Perhaps I'm a "purist" (or maybe a masochist), but I was/am trying to maximize the CPM by using my lounge access for meals (and even a catnap) instead of adding costs for such a short layover without my wife. So the real thrust of my question had to do with the mechanics of navigating the airport and getting my return boarding pass given the schedule of my MR and the hours the AA desk is staffed in HKG. I was afraid to exit the secure area since if I couldn't print my onward boarding pass at a kiosk, I'd be stuck outside the lounge area.

aBroadAbroad

Welcome to FlyerTalk… since discussion of a specific airport typically belongs in the associated destination forum, you'll probably get more knowledgable responses here in the dedicated Hong Kong forum. Good luck!

~Moderator, Information Desk

maxwell109

I read each post in the "...turnarounds...", HKG area and didn't find an answer to my specific question. I'm truly sorry if I didn't post to the right place so may I ask the appropriate moderator to move my question (and experience) to a more appropriate forum? Again, apologies and thank you for your helpful suggestions. I appreciate everything you "veterans" do for us "newbies" (whose questions probably seem pretty mundane).

JDiver

No worries; the move has been done.

It's tricky when you are in an airport on an extended turn and contract employees staff the desk for a very few hours prior to departure. I suspect most with nineteen hours to spend would take the train to Hongkers and engage in some rest and recreation prior to returning to Chep Lap Kok; I und.erstand your wish not to do so.

Many airport lounges can't actually print out boarding passes for other airlines' passengers. I'd ask an employee on arrival at or near the gate what I should do next.

beep88

There is Plaza Premium arrival lounge land side which is available to Canadian AMEX Platinum members (but not Priority Pass). Maybe it is available to US members.

For me, I'll just call up some friends and all my meals - and even accommodation - would be taken care of

maxwell109

Thanks. since I am an AmEx Platinum card holder, too (US), I will check whether it gets me into the airside Plaza Premium arrival lounge, but I'd really prefer not to go airside unless I am forced to do so. And I wish I had friends on whom I could call for meals and lodging, but I don't. Was I just lucky that it all worked out in the end for me on my last MR to HKG, or did I end up accidentally doing the right things, or is there some better, more proactive action I can take to get to the departures level lounges while staying airside and then getting "downstairs" to get my boarding pass the next morning?

dsgtc0408

I've gone through HKG quite a few times both as a transit point as well as a destination. I tip my hat to you, your last mileage run you've done something really quite extraordinary. As far as I'm concerned, you've been incredibly lucky.

Most airports are geared towards moving people through them quickly. They're not set up for folks whose plan is that the airport itself is the destination (a la Tom Hanks 'The Terminal'). What you accomplished during your last MR didn't exactly short circuit any existing process. Otherwise you would have never gotten the little slip of paper you got from the Transit Desk on the arrivals level that allowed you to go to the departures level with no accompanying boarding pass. Yet it was unorthodox, otherwise how is it that you ended up the next morning being escorted by transit desk staff and taking the staff elevator going between levels? Don't forget that you're in an international airport where not only is airside sterile, but departure and arrivals is sterile from each other reflecting specific decisions by HK Immigration policies regarding inbound and outbound passengers. In other words, don't take what you achieved for granted; some security protocols might have been set aside here. As much as I can appreciate your desire to economize, I suspect different airport staff bent rules for you to do what you did. There's no guarantee that your next MR will be equally "smooth" or that other airport staff will be just as cooperative. For all you know, you might attract the wrong sort of scrutiny by airport security the next time since you're doing something unexpected in a part of the airport where you may be physically but not legally in Hong Kong and considered a high security area. Also, a security crackdown instigated by some event such as what just happened in Sydney might put the kibosh on being able to do a second time what you just did.

If you do proceed with this plan in a few weeks anyway, I would suggest you take J.Diver's advice in post #7 to speak to the first AA staff member you see anywhere from the moment you step on the jetway to where the jetway ends and the terminal building begins. Ideally AA staff can issue you the boarding passes for your return flight so you can transit normally (after they make sure everyone has deplaned with no issues). If not, see what other ideas they have. But just in case, figure out what hotels you can stay in Hong Kong and make some no deposit reservations that you can cancel without penalty in case you get sent groundside. There's a hotel on the HKG grounds.

BTW be glad your turnaround is Hong Kong because it's visa free for Americans (you are, right?). If you did the same thing at PEK or PVG or anyplace else in China and couldn't stay airside, your issues would be a lot bigger than just not having boarding passes if you were forced to go groundside without a valid PR China visa or China status.

Good luck - let us know how your next MR turns out or whatever you decide.

maxwell109

Thanks bunches...lots of good information to glean from your response and ideas! I'm pursuing this line of inquiry as much for the sake of other MRs who might take advantage of the SFO->DFW->HKG opportunity as for myself. What seemed "odd" was that no one with whom I spoke in the airport seemed to find my questions unorthodox; the help they offered just seemed to lead to yet another question/challenge. Just off the plane I was directed to a transit desk who looked at my printed itinerary (showing I had onward flights booked...but no onward BPs) and gave me the transit pass to get upstairs to the departures level along with directions to return to W1 (downstairs) the next morning. It wasn't until I tried to do the latter that I ran into difficulty. The elevator I had been directed (the night before by the folks at the transit desk nearby on the departures level) to use was "roped off." The morning staff at the same transit desk told me to use the employee elevator on the other side of the concourse which I was hesitant to do for fear of getting into some sort of trouble. Eventually, a staff member accompanied me down the employee elevator and told the staff there (in her native tongue so I couldn't understand what she was saying) what I needed and, from there, everything went smoothly.

I appreciate the idea about talking to AA staff as soon as I step off the plane. I wish I could remember if I actually saw anyone since I was in the second row of Economy Plus seating and didn't see the jet bridge operator. Do you (or does anyone reading this chain of events) know if an AA contract employee is stationed at the gate desk or if an onward BP could even be printed from there? My modus operandi is to look dumb (not hard, in my case!), be courteous, ask for help and be very appreciative. I guess it may have worked last time when perhaps it shouldn't have. I'll have a better "Plan B" this time around...and I'll be sure to report on my experiences.

Please keep the helpful suggestions coming...

dsgtc0408

This is Hong Kong we're talking about. Folks there are really strong problem solvers and can be both efficient and proactive. However yours is a multifaceted problem. So the people there helped you deal with each issue within the scope of their authority and expertise. But at the end of the day, it was only AA staff that gave you the final resolution: boarding passes. In other words, the problem got kicked down the road, and you were the can. Moreover, you had no idea whether or not you were going to get the BP's until you actually got them.

You'll be better off researching this question on responses in the AA forum. Or else ask the specific question there referencing the thread here being clear you aren't crossposting, and update this thread when you get the answer (or maybe a moderator can/should move this thread back to the AA forum). What I was thinking when I wrote my original comment was that if there was AA staff meeting the flight was that if they could help, that you accompany them possibly back to the check in counters to generate the boarding passes. However you might not be able to re-enter airside if check in is not open at that time.

Not a good idea to push your luck like this. It's not good to be in situations that affect you where you have no idea what's being discussed. Happy outcomes happen in large part because you're actively a part of the solution. You got lucky because Hong Kong people are generally honest and were working in your interest. This is not necessarily going to be the case elsewhere. Just sayin...

Let's be clear: your maneuver is moderate/high risk and is not the sort of thing to be encouraged among casual mileage runners, or at least needs to recognize what might go wrong. Not everyone (including FT'ers) is in a position to deal with hiccups or IRROPS in domestic US flying, never mind overseas. When this happens in an overseas location the various things that can go unhinged if things go sideways aren't just harder to deal with (note your comment on discussions affecting you that you couldn't understand because it was in some form of Chinese), but can be unpredictable because they're unique to the specific situation/person/day etc. You had someone willing to help quite possibly in spite of themselves because you stayed humble, thus you had staff going down the employee elevator and explaining your request to whoever it was you needed to get the BP's from. This might not be the case next time or for the next person. Also, keep in mind things going sideways includes possible scenarios of unintentionally breaking laws yet getting arrested (ok, maybe not high risk but it's not impossible either). So it's not a good idea to create the impression that this SFO/DFW/HKG opportunity that you scored is straightforward, or can be consistently duplicated by others, or that it should be.

My main point is that any air travel (including MRs) works no matter how complicated provided everything follows the airline's/airport's/other service providers' SOPs. The moment the travel requires the goodwill of people along the way in order to work is just asking for trouble.

maxwell109

I would be more than happy to do so...but I would probably be better off if a moderator could/would facilitate moving this particular sub-question to the best location since the last thing I want to do is offend any of the veteran FTers by appearing as if I am cross-posting. Also, can anyone confirm whether there are AA kiosks I could use if I passed through immigration to landside? And would they solve my dilemma (since by the time I landed I would be well within the 24 hour check-in period)?


I will certainly keep my out for AA staff meeting the flight but the impression I received was that the only regular AA employees are those on the plane; those at the airport seemed to be contract staff.


I hope I haven't left the wrong impression. I have no intentions of encouraging risky behaviors, nor of intentionally engaging in such behaviors myself. I had read accounts of others who had spent the night in the Hong Kong airport, specifically in the 24-hour Premier Pass Lounge (which is what I ended up doing). I just didn't know how to go about providing proper documentation to HKG staff when (a) there is a 19 hour lag between arrival and departure and (b) the flight preceding arrival was 16 hours long, making the total time between departing DFW and arriving HKG 35 hours and (c) the AA desk is staffed only 3-4 hours/day by contract employees. Believe me, I want to do everything "by the book" -- that's why I'm asking all these questions.

craz

usually folks consider CPM solely on the tkt. And I cant see how taking the bus or train into the city and getting a hotel room (using pts) will drastically raise the CPM, maybe if you were flying HKG-SGN but when the flights are apx 15k in miles spending a few extra bucks wont change the CPM by much if at all.


Im sort of in the same boat I will be in HK for a weekend then flying to Cambodia back to HK for the night arriving at 4pm with a a connecting flight the next day @ 12:30pm. Orginally I booked the Mariott on pts at HKG, then I decided no sense sitting in that room all the time. I switched to a HIX for 20K on HKI and will either grab the Star over to Kowloon and walk around or walk around on HKI. Roundtrip bus tkt is apx $60HKD = $7.74

If theres enough time for me to hit the city I flew into before my departing flight Im going, did so at Milan with a 6 1/2 hr layver Walked around and it was alot better then staying at the airport, @ FRA I grabbed the train and walked around Mainz , booked a late connection in order to do so.

Beyond me why anyone would stay in an airport when theres so much to see in the city itself and its cheap to get there. There have been places where I stayed in the airport since there was a Visa fee of $20+ so for the apx 4 hrs I lounged it. Some Countrys have a $150 Visa fee so I can understand staying in the airport and some of those you have to jump thru various hoops to get the Visa even before flying there

Other times arriving late after the public transpot has shut down except for expensive taxis, I can also understand staying put in the airport, but none of this applies to HK.

maxwell109

You are, of course, correct...and I have Hilton points as well as MR and UR points I could transfer for use at any number of properties. But when I go on these MRs (as long as they remain viable...which they still are, for the time being, on AA/US), I do so for only 2 reasons: (1) to absolutely maximize future enjoyment for my wife...and she, of course, won't be along to enjoy the evening in HK with me, so it wouldn't be nearly as much fun and (2) because I just find flying and airports FUN! I really don't mind staying in the airport and plan to bring my wife back at some later time on the miles and status I accumulate. I'm just trying to understand how best to navigate the Hong Kong airport.