Dec 11, 2017, 1:13 am
Last edit by: MaldivesFreak
Here is a link to Hilton T & C on pooling:
http://hiltonhonors3.hilton.com/en/p...money/faq.html
1. What is Points Pooling?
Points Pooling will allow Hilton Honors Members to combine their Points with family and friends to book a stay. With this perk, a Member (and up to 10 others) will now be able to combine their Points. For example, if a group of friends are taking a trip together and individually don’t have enough Points to cover their entire stay, they will now be able to combine their Points, free of charge, into one account to unlock new redemption opportunities.
2. Is there a fee to participate in the Points Pooling program?
No, there is no fee to participate in Points Pooling.
3. How many people can contribute to Points Pooling?
A total of 11 Hilton Honors Members can pool their Points together. One Member initiates the pooling and up to 10 other Members can contribute.
4. Do I need to create a new "pooled" account?
No. Members can use their existing account.
5. How many Points Pools can I be in?
There is no limit on the number of pools a member can be in at a given time.
6. Can you use Pooled Points for just room rates or can it be used for non-room rewards including shopping and experiences?
Yes, once Points are pooled, they can be used for any room or non-room reward product, including the experiences available on the Hilton Honors auction platform, Hilton Honors Shopping Mall and any other non-room reward products.
7. Can you combine Pooled Points with money?
Once Points are pooled they can be used for any room reward product, including a Points & Money Rewards™ reward reservation.
8. What is the minimum/maximum number of Points that can be pooled?
A Member can transfer a minimum of 1,000 Points and a maximum of 500,000 Points into a pool in a calendar year. A Member can receive up to 2 million Points in a calendar year.
9. Are there particular qualifications you must meet to be able to pool Points?
To use Points Pooling, you must be an active Member, be in the program for 30 days, and have a minimum Points balance of 1,000 Points.
10. When will Points Pooling be available?
Points Pooling is now available. Start pooling your Hilton Honors Points here.
11. When will the Points be shown in the other Member’s account and be ready for use?
The transferred or pooled Points will be available for use at the time of transfer, but please allow up to 24 hours for pooled Points to show up when you log in to your account.
12. Where and how do I Points Pool once I have a group of Members that want to combine Points?
All Points Pooling activities will be transacted online via HiltonHonors.com.
13. Where do I go to transfer my Points to the Points Pool initiator?
The Points contributor must access the transfer page through the Points Pool invitation email sent on behalf ot the Points Pool initiator.
14. What’s the difference between Points Pooling and Points Transfer?
Points Transfer is a 1:1 transaction, while Points Pooling allows for combining Hilton Honors Points with up to 10 other people (11 including yourself).
15. After I send Points to a friend for Pooling, what happens if he/she cancels the trip? How can I get my Points back?
If your friend has to cancel his/her trip, he/she can simply transfer the Points back to your account for free.
http://hiltonhonors3.hilton.com/en/p...money/faq.html
1. What is Points Pooling?
Points Pooling will allow Hilton Honors Members to combine their Points with family and friends to book a stay. With this perk, a Member (and up to 10 others) will now be able to combine their Points. For example, if a group of friends are taking a trip together and individually don’t have enough Points to cover their entire stay, they will now be able to combine their Points, free of charge, into one account to unlock new redemption opportunities.
2. Is there a fee to participate in the Points Pooling program?
No, there is no fee to participate in Points Pooling.
3. How many people can contribute to Points Pooling?
A total of 11 Hilton Honors Members can pool their Points together. One Member initiates the pooling and up to 10 other Members can contribute.
4. Do I need to create a new "pooled" account?
No. Members can use their existing account.
5. How many Points Pools can I be in?
There is no limit on the number of pools a member can be in at a given time.
6. Can you use Pooled Points for just room rates or can it be used for non-room rewards including shopping and experiences?
Yes, once Points are pooled, they can be used for any room or non-room reward product, including the experiences available on the Hilton Honors auction platform, Hilton Honors Shopping Mall and any other non-room reward products.
7. Can you combine Pooled Points with money?
Once Points are pooled they can be used for any room reward product, including a Points & Money Rewards™ reward reservation.
8. What is the minimum/maximum number of Points that can be pooled?
A Member can transfer a minimum of 1,000 Points and a maximum of 500,000 Points into a pool in a calendar year. A Member can receive up to 2 million Points in a calendar year.
9. Are there particular qualifications you must meet to be able to pool Points?
To use Points Pooling, you must be an active Member, be in the program for 30 days, and have a minimum Points balance of 1,000 Points.
10. When will Points Pooling be available?
Points Pooling is now available. Start pooling your Hilton Honors Points here.
11. When will the Points be shown in the other Member’s account and be ready for use?
The transferred or pooled Points will be available for use at the time of transfer, but please allow up to 24 hours for pooled Points to show up when you log in to your account.
12. Where and how do I Points Pool once I have a group of Members that want to combine Points?
All Points Pooling activities will be transacted online via HiltonHonors.com.
13. Where do I go to transfer my Points to the Points Pool initiator?
The Points contributor must access the transfer page through the Points Pool invitation email sent on behalf ot the Points Pool initiator.
14. What’s the difference between Points Pooling and Points Transfer?
Points Transfer is a 1:1 transaction, while Points Pooling allows for combining Hilton Honors Points with up to 10 other people (11 including yourself).
15. After I send Points to a friend for Pooling, what happens if he/she cancels the trip? How can I get my Points back?
If your friend has to cancel his/her trip, he/she can simply transfer the Points back to your account for free.
Hilton Points Pooling - Account Closed. Beware !!
Sep 19, 2017, 6:21 am
#106
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: BA/AA/AS/B6/WN/ UA/HH/MR and more like 'em but most felicitously & importantly MUCCI
Posts: 19,718
Originally Posted by thbe
The OP doesn't want her points back. She wants compensation for the value of the points. Do you understand the difference?
Sep 19, 2017, 6:30 am
#107
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,262
That is because:
#1 Points are not your property no matter how you acquire them.
#2 Points are not your property no matter how you acquire them.
#3 Points are not your property no matter how you acquire them
Sep 19, 2017, 6:45 am
#108
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 24
your posts proffer sufficient proof that HH was totally within their rights per -
9.Hilton Honors reserves the right to suspend or discontinue Hilton Honors membership, including any Elite Tier status (including Silver Elite Member, Gold Elite Member,and Diamond Elite Member status), for any Member who appears to be using the Program in a manner inconsistent with the Terms and Conditions or intent of the Program or any portion of the Program, including, but not limited to, Reward redemption or Certificate use. Hilton Honors also reserves the right to discontinue membership for any Member who Hilton Honors believes, or if there are reasonable grounds for suspecting, in its sole discretion, has:
d.engaged in any abusive, fraudulent, disruptive, inappropriate, offensive or hostile conduct, whether it be physical, verbal or written in nature, towards any hotel within the Hilton Portfolio or their guests or employees, or towards Hilton or any of its employees or contractors
Such discontinued membership may result in the loss of all accumulated Points and the cancellation of Hilton Honors Certificates, benefits and privileges, including the loss of any associated Elite Tier status. In addition to discontinuance of Hilton Honors membership, Hilton Honors shall have the right to take appropriate administrative and/or legal action, including, without limitation, criminal prosecution, as it deems necessary in its sole discretion.
9.Hilton Honors reserves the right to suspend or discontinue Hilton Honors membership, including any Elite Tier status (including Silver Elite Member, Gold Elite Member,and Diamond Elite Member status), for any Member who appears to be using the Program in a manner inconsistent with the Terms and Conditions or intent of the Program or any portion of the Program, including, but not limited to, Reward redemption or Certificate use. Hilton Honors also reserves the right to discontinue membership for any Member who Hilton Honors believes, or if there are reasonable grounds for suspecting, in its sole discretion, has:
d.engaged in any abusive, fraudulent, disruptive, inappropriate, offensive or hostile conduct, whether it be physical, verbal or written in nature, towards any hotel within the Hilton Portfolio or their guests or employees, or towards Hilton or any of its employees or contractors
Such discontinued membership may result in the loss of all accumulated Points and the cancellation of Hilton Honors Certificates, benefits and privileges, including the loss of any associated Elite Tier status. In addition to discontinuance of Hilton Honors membership, Hilton Honors shall have the right to take appropriate administrative and/or legal action, including, without limitation, criminal prosecution, as it deems necessary in its sole discretion.
In fact, "if there are reasonable grounds for suspecting" ... I need this grounds only.
Sep 19, 2017, 7:34 am
#109
Join Date: Feb 2013
Programs: Hilton Diamond
Posts: 4,243
Sep 19, 2017, 8:28 am
#110
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,481
There is no difference. The points were not her property. She neither gets the points back nor "compensated" for them.
That is because:
#1 Points are not your property no matter how you acquire them.
#2 Points are not your property no matter how you acquire them.
#3 Points are not your property no matter how you acquire them
That is because:
#1 Points are not your property no matter how you acquire them.
#2 Points are not your property no matter how you acquire them.
#3 Points are not your property no matter how you acquire them
But jurisdiction is not based on your understanding.
Sep 19, 2017, 8:58 am
#111
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: SEA, but up and down the coast a lot
Programs: Oceanic Airlines Gold Elite
Posts: 20,378
But if YOU are collecting a rebate that someone else pays for (in the case of work travel)... that's income. Unless of course it's not your property. Which is why loyalty programs are set up that way.
I agree in not make this taxable for the IRS and tax authorities, which is why I don't particularly feel the need to upset the applecart to rewrite all the program rules when someone gets expelled from a loyalty program for violating program rules. Generally speaking, when we get the Paul Harvey "rest of the story" after the first anguished post on FT in threads like this one:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/ameri...arter-etc.html
It's often not "I'm the poor innocent consumer being manhandled by the large corporation".
I agree in not make this taxable for the IRS and tax authorities, which is why I don't particularly feel the need to upset the applecart to rewrite all the program rules when someone gets expelled from a loyalty program for violating program rules. Generally speaking, when we get the Paul Harvey "rest of the story" after the first anguished post on FT in threads like this one:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/ameri...arter-etc.html
It's often not "I'm the poor innocent consumer being manhandled by the large corporation".
Sep 19, 2017, 11:18 am
#112
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: LAX
Posts: 10,906
points earned as rebate/reward for stays or issued as compensation is a diffetent story
this whole concept of selling points really mushroomed over the last couple years - this really needs to be regulated as misleading claims really hurt consumers...
Sep 19, 2017, 11:29 am
#113
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: LAX
Posts: 10,906
If not, you best option is to write a letter/email requesting a refund due to involuntary closure of your account.
Serial complaining will not generate much sympathy here as you probably realized...
Sep 19, 2017, 1:16 pm
#114
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: BA/AA/AS/B6/WN/ UA/HH/MR and more like 'em but most felicitously & importantly MUCCI
Posts: 19,718
If I rack up Hilton points with the sole goal of spending two weeks in the Maldives, but Hilton closes that property down, the points are now of zero value to me, but I have no recourse. Ditto if I accumulate miles on an airline that pulls out of my home city, etc.
It is cynical genius to get customers to plunk down real, hard, useful currency to buy miles, points, etc. with vague, theoretical value only.
Sep 19, 2017, 2:54 pm
#115
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: SEA, but up and down the coast a lot
Programs: Oceanic Airlines Gold Elite
Posts: 20,378
Trying to be an advantage player in a loyalty program feels very much like gambling in a casino for an advantage, and just like a casino, the loyalty program has all the leverage, has the ability to change the rules ("I'm sorry, sir, but your play is too good, we're not going to let you play blackjack here any longer"), and will slam loopholes and windows of opportunity shut if they figure out they're costing them money.
Sep 19, 2017, 7:03 pm
#116
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Ewa Beach, Hawaii
Posts: 10,907
Hotel programs have been devaluing points for a long time. So the points you "buy" today will most likely be worth less if you hold onto them long enough. You will never get a refund for the amounts of the devaluations. In the event of account closure and points confiscation they just got devalued to 0.
Sep 19, 2017, 8:08 pm
#117
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,262
Points don't get devalued. Things simply cost more. Just like cash. Try putting away enough cash for a given room in a cookie jar and come back in a few years and see if you can still get the room for the same price.
Sep 19, 2017, 10:48 pm
#118
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Ewa Beach, Hawaii
Posts: 10,907
You're saying the same thing. A point gets you less over time because things cost more, thus the value of a point goes down thus it is devalued.
Sep 20, 2017, 12:26 am
#119
Suspended
Join Date: Apr 2017
Programs: HH-D; MR-P/LTP; SPG-P
Posts: 849
NOT REQUIRED BY HH
9.Hilton Honors reserves the right to suspend or discontinue Hilton Honors membership, including any Elite Tier status (including Silver Elite Member, Gold Elite Member,and Diamond Elite Member status), for any Member who appears to be using the Program in a manner inconsistent with the Terms and Conditions or intent of the Program or any portion of the Program, including, but not limited to, Reward redemption or Certificate use. Hilton Honors also reserves the right to discontinue membership for any Member who Hilton Honors believes, or if there are reasonable grounds for suspecting, in its sole discretion, has:
9.Hilton Honors reserves the right to suspend or discontinue Hilton Honors membership, including any Elite Tier status (including Silver Elite Member, Gold Elite Member,and Diamond Elite Member status), for any Member who appears to be using the Program in a manner inconsistent with the Terms and Conditions or intent of the Program or any portion of the Program, including, but not limited to, Reward redemption or Certificate use. Hilton Honors also reserves the right to discontinue membership for any Member who Hilton Honors believes, or if there are reasonable grounds for suspecting, in its sole discretion, has:
Sep 20, 2017, 9:44 am
#120
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Amsterdam, Asia, UK
Programs: IHG RA (Spire), HH Diamond, MR Platinum, SQ Gold, KLM Gold, BAEC Gold
Posts: 5,072
How about both OPs having new accounts opened in April2017, so they could both status match a second time for HH-Diamond, having already matched and not stayed enough to keep HH-Diamond
OP please confirm when/why you opened new Apr2017 HH accounts
(Very suspicious timing ...as Apr 1st 2017 is when HH Elite (Diamond/Gold) status is reset/lost if too few nights stayed in 2016 year by both OPS)
AND IF
a)You status Matched (challenged) these new Apr2017 accounts to HH-Gold/Diamond
Also If
b)You previously had other older HH accounts before opening Apr2017 accts
c)If you status matched/challenged the earlier older account
d)If you lost HH Status from 1st April ,, SO opened new accts to status match again
Basically my thought is that the HH Fraud relates purely to creation of NEW APR2017 accounts by OPS, and obvious issue is OP creating new accounts to status match/challenge to have another 24months HH-Diamond
If OPS played this game, to create new accts to match as HH-Diamonmd, then it is fraudulent ant HH are correct to close ALL of OPS HH accounts with forfeiture of unused points and unused booked points nights.
OP please confirm when/why you opened new Apr2017 HH accounts
(Very suspicious timing ...as Apr 1st 2017 is when HH Elite (Diamond/Gold) status is reset/lost if too few nights stayed in 2016 year by both OPS)
AND IF
a)You status Matched (challenged) these new Apr2017 accounts to HH-Gold/Diamond
Also If
b)You previously had other older HH accounts before opening Apr2017 accts
c)If you status matched/challenged the earlier older account
d)If you lost HH Status from 1st April ,, SO opened new accts to status match again
Basically my thought is that the HH Fraud relates purely to creation of NEW APR2017 accounts by OPS, and obvious issue is OP creating new accounts to status match/challenge to have another 24months HH-Diamond
If OPS played this game, to create new accts to match as HH-Diamonmd, then it is fraudulent ant HH are correct to close ALL of OPS HH accounts with forfeiture of unused points and unused booked points nights.