Feb 3, 2017, 4:10 pm
Last edit by: paul00
Official link showing the maximum number of points needed to redeem a standard room award after the changes: http://pointsandmoney.hilton.com/
How will standard room rewards be affected by the changes?
Will I earn bonus points on the cash portion of Points & Money bookings?
Although the HonorsRepresentative stated in Feb 2017 that 'you can rest assured about the value of your Points. As we make this transition on Standard Room Rewards, each hotel's maximum Points price is NOT increasing', in June 2017 the maximum number of points needed to redeem standard room rewards at four properties were raised. Furthermore, the HonorsRepresentative stated that:
List of properties which have seen increases in the maximum number of points needed to redeem standard room awards since the changes:
How will standard room rewards be affected by the changes?
Our Points prices will also become more flexible. When demand and room rates are lower, Points prices will flex and go lower than before. As we launch this new benefit, we’re also saying farewell to hotel categories - which will allow prices to go lower than the previous ranges. But you can rest assured about the value of your Points. As we make this transition on Standard Room Rewards, each hotel's maximum Points price is NOT increasing.
For example, today a Standard Room at Category 10 hotels maxes out at 95,000 Points per night. Once the new Points & Money program launches, those hotels will continue to top out at 95,000 Points, and may sometimes be priced lower than the previous category range.
For example, today a Standard Room at Category 10 hotels maxes out at 95,000 Points per night. Once the new Points & Money program launches, those hotels will continue to top out at 95,000 Points, and may sometimes be priced lower than the previous category range.
If you book a Points & Money rate when the new functionality goes live later this month [Feb 2017], the money portion will qualify to earn Hilton Honors Base Points. You'll also qualify to earn Bonus Points through eligible promotions, including the 2K Every Day promotion (note: I posted this update in the promotion thread, as well).
Points & Money stays booked under the current system are subject to the current Terms & Conditions of the program - therefore, you would not be eligible to earn Points on the cash portion of the stay.
Points & Money stays booked under the current system are subject to the current Terms & Conditions of the program - therefore, you would not be eligible to earn Points on the cash portion of the stay.
- Hampton Inn closest to Universal Orlando, US: Cat 3 (max 20,000 points) to Cat 4 (max 30,000 points)
- DoubleTree by Hilton Hotel Hangzhou East, China: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- DoubleTree by Hilton Hotel Jiaxing, China: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- DoubleTree by Hilton Hotel Wuhu, China: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- DoubleTree by Hilton Hotel Shenzhen Longhua, China: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Doubletree by Hilton Xiamen-Haicang, China: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Hilton Garden Inn Fuzhou Cangshan, China: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- DoubleTree by Hilton Hotel Suzhou, China: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Hilton Garden Inn Ningbo, China: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hampton Inn and Suites Chicago/Hoffman Estates, US: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Hampton Inn Lincoln, US: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Hampton Inn and Suites Las Vegas Airport, US: Cat 3 (max 20,000 points) to max 25,000 points
- DoubleTree by Hilton Ningbo Beilun, China: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hilton Garden Inn Shenzhen Bao'an, China: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hilton Garden Inn Dandong, China: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hampton by Hilton Krakow, Poland, Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hampton Inn and Suites Oxford/Anniston, US: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Hilton Garden Inn Oxford/Anniston, US: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Hilton Kota Kinabalu, Malaysia: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Conrad Macao Cotai Central: Cat 5 (max 40,000 points) to Cat 6 (max 50,000 points)
- Hampton Inn LaGrange near Callaway Gardens, US: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Hampton Inn Cartersville, US: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Hampton Inn Fall River/Westport, US: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to Cat 3 (max 20,000 points)
- Hampton by Hilton Minsk City Centre, Belarus: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- DoubleTree by Hilton Hotel Ningbo - Chunxiao, China: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hilton Garden Inn Foshan, China: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hilton Alexandria Corniche, Egypt: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hilton Alexandria Green Plaza, Egypt: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- DoubleTree by Hilton Melaka, Malaysia: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hampton by Hilton Swinoujscie, Poland: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to max 15,000 points
- Hampton by Hilton Nizhny Novgorod, Russia: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hampton by Hilton Samara, Russia: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hilton Garden Inn Ulyanovsk, Russia: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- Hilton Garden Inn Volgograd, Russia: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
- DoubleTree by Hilton Hotel Trabzon (previously Hilton Garden Inn Trabzon), Turkey: Cat 2 (max 10,000 points) to max 25,000 points
- Hilton Salalah Resort, Oman: Cat 1 (max 5,000 points) to Cat 2 (max 10,000 points)
Announcing Four New Hilton Honors Perks
Jan 31, 2017, 8:32 pm
#61
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 171
Low season reward at same hotel is 50k points per night. Rack rate can range from $250-$690. Clearly 50k points per night when the rack rate is still north of $500 is a relative bargain.
Under the new structure, I'd imagine one could kiss these low season discounts goodbye. I imagine the concept of "hard date cutoff" low season awards will be gone and in the above example the said hotel would remain at 80k points/night when rates are above, say $300.
Considering there are no more hotel categories and redemption rates are primarily rate driven, one might guess they could be (just a guess) normalizing dollar to point ratios across all properties, or perhaps types/categories of properties. This will make finding the sweet spot redemption a pointless effort. I'm ok with being wrong here!
Jan 31, 2017, 8:32 pm
#62
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,963
EDIT: according to OMaaT http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.c...ogram-changes/
the points & money will be a fixed rate of 1 point for 0.46 US cents off a cash rate. POOR
the points & money will be a fixed rate of 1 point for 0.46 US cents off a cash rate. POOR
Jan 31, 2017, 8:38 pm
#63
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 46
First: points pooling sounds useful and convenient. Shopping with points on Amazon sounds okay, presumably at an unimpressive redemption rate. A one-time diamond status extension for some people is good too.
However: with the removal of hotel categories, transparency and predictability disappear. Hotels can and will increase points prices at will. Tying redemption rates to hotel pricing means that former low season point redemptions are devalued. If the cash price of a room is high, the points price will probably be high, so it becomes harder to get better-than-average value from points.
While each hotel's maximum points price will not increase "as we make this transition," minimum and maximum prices can increase without notice at any time later. Hilton can do anything, literally anything that they want with their points prices without warning.
With the change to points and money, while the new system adds flexibility in using points, the good values from the old points and money system are gone. The best points value you get from paying partially with points for a redemption is the same value you get from paying entirely with points.
Hilton should commit to giving advance notice of changes in point price ranges for hotels, but they gave themselves complete freedom to make changes behind our backs, and they spun the elimination of categories as a positive change. Don't be fooled, and don't count on being treated with that kind of respect.
However: with the removal of hotel categories, transparency and predictability disappear. Hotels can and will increase points prices at will. Tying redemption rates to hotel pricing means that former low season point redemptions are devalued. If the cash price of a room is high, the points price will probably be high, so it becomes harder to get better-than-average value from points.
While each hotel's maximum points price will not increase "as we make this transition," minimum and maximum prices can increase without notice at any time later. Hilton can do anything, literally anything that they want with their points prices without warning.
With the change to points and money, while the new system adds flexibility in using points, the good values from the old points and money system are gone. The best points value you get from paying partially with points for a redemption is the same value you get from paying entirely with points.
Hilton should commit to giving advance notice of changes in point price ranges for hotels, but they gave themselves complete freedom to make changes behind our backs, and they spun the elimination of categories as a positive change. Don't be fooled, and don't count on being treated with that kind of respect.
Jan 31, 2017, 9:13 pm
#65
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: NW London and NW Sydney
Programs: BA Diamond, Hilton Bronze, A3 Diamond, IHG *G
Posts: 6,343
Sure sounds good on paper, but it could potentially go the other way.
I like this, a lot. Thanks Lauren!
Also, Base Points are earned on the money portion spent on a stay.
Points & Money will be "always on" at any hotel with room availability, any time.
Slider will be available on Premium room redemptions as well, the way those rewards are priced will not change from today.
Points & Money will be "always on" at any hotel with room availability, any time.
Slider will be available on Premium room redemptions as well, the way those rewards are priced will not change from today.
The new version is that you can redeem 1 point to get 0.46 cents off a cash rate. That's why you will now be able to earn points on the "money" portion - it will no longer be a true redemption
Jan 31, 2017, 9:23 pm
#66
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: NW London and NW Sydney
Programs: BA Diamond, Hilton Bronze, A3 Diamond, IHG *G
Posts: 6,343
When a hotel has no standard redemption availability, you can already see this in action.
If a premium room is $100, then it will also be available to redeem for 20000 points, which is 0.5c per point. But usually there will be a HHonors discount which reduces the price a little.
With the new version, for a $100 room, you might be able to pay 10000 points plus $52.50.
You will now earn 525 points on the $52.50, so it's actually spend 9475 points to save $47.50 off the cash rate (according to my conjecture based on the examples provided by Lucky in his blog), so the headline value per point is around 0.46c.
Previously, the points and money cost would depend on the category of the hotel and not be related to the cash rates at all.
I might be completely wrong about all of the above, but I am just reading between the lines from the limited information that has been released so far.
Jan 31, 2017, 10:32 pm
#68
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: IAH
Programs: DL DM, Hyatt Ist-iest, Stariott Platinum, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 12,781
Nope. I emailed the Diamond desk earlier today asking about my lifetime nights and got this thoroughly useless response:
Hi krazykanuck,
Thank you for your inquiry regarding your Lifetime Diamond status. We appreciate you taking the time to contact us.
We sincerely apologize for any inconvenience as we have limited information regarding Lifetime Diamond. We appreciate your long term membership to Hilton as a Diamond member. I have created case in regards to your inquiry to Lifetime Diamond Status. Should you need to follow up on this request, please reference # XXXXXXXX. Again, we sincerely apologize for any inconvenience this has caused and appreciate your patience and understanding.
Like... what? I'm probably just going to re-send the inquiry to Lauren and ask her to route it because the Diamond desk has been completely useless with every question I've had in the past few months.
Hi krazykanuck,
Thank you for your inquiry regarding your Lifetime Diamond status. We appreciate you taking the time to contact us.
We sincerely apologize for any inconvenience as we have limited information regarding Lifetime Diamond. We appreciate your long term membership to Hilton as a Diamond member. I have created case in regards to your inquiry to Lifetime Diamond Status. Should you need to follow up on this request, please reference # XXXXXXXX. Again, we sincerely apologize for any inconvenience this has caused and appreciate your patience and understanding.
Like... what? I'm probably just going to re-send the inquiry to Lauren and ask her to route it because the Diamond desk has been completely useless with every question I've had in the past few months.
Jan 31, 2017, 10:34 pm
#69
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: SJC/SFO
Programs: WN A+ CP, UA 1MM/*A Gold, Mar LT Tit, IHG Plat, HH Dia
Posts: 6,284
Starting in March, current eligible Diamond members can choose to extend their status for a year, one-time, for any reason when a light travel period doesn’t allow them to requalify. Diamond members are eligible if they meet either criteria below:
• 3+ years as a Diamond Elite with at least 250 nights (paid or reward) since joining the program; or
• 3+ years as a Diamond Elite with at least 500,000 Base Points since joining the program.
To check your lifetime years, nights or Base Points, please contact the Diamond Desk.
• 3+ years as a Diamond Elite with at least 500,000 Base Points since joining the program.
Jan 31, 2017, 11:07 pm
#70
Join Date: Oct 2008
Programs: AA/HH/SPG Gold
Posts: 308
I am absolutely amazed at the number of people lapping up this change in the program. There is no way they will not devalue the points with this change. None. I would expect an overall 20-30% devaluation right away. Somebody has already reported a four times higher price for booking with points in Maui, as of today.
Jan 31, 2017, 11:49 pm
#74
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 164
Jan 31, 2017, 11:58 pm
#75
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 11,539
My understanding from a conversation this morning with management at a lower category hotel is that they are happy about this change because they will be able to charge more points after a short-time. I was surprised because I thought for points-only reservations that the reimbursement makes no difference, its about the occupancy etc. However moving to this points & money revenue booking is the real benefit to properties who will see a big increase in the money they receive especially for low demand dates. However a Category 1-3 property is often not very expensive so asking for so many points on a low rate doesn't make any sense and is the reason the categories are configured the way they are anyway.
Hence, at first Egypt, Turkey, Eastern Europe etc might see a short continuation of the sweetspots but how long can the Hampton Minsk continue at 5000 per night when the property has no incentive to do so because its occupancy is barely high enough to see a good reimbursement.
I am surprised to see the likes of HFP think this is great, because abandoning room categories is a crap idea given they can charge what they like and categories by stealth. They won't stay at those levels beyond a few months because at the moment they change all the time. I wouldn't bash HFP with the Lucky brush, but the positive changes he might see are more like all the suckers who will be helping him book those aspirational properties with card clicks.
The maximum will be 95,000 but there is no reason this won't be 100k or more over time, with inflation. I thought the categories broadly made sense given they were based on demand and average rates which is why Egypt is the way it is. The Hilton Alexandria going to 30k is no incentive to visit when safer places are fewer points.
The property I am staying at is brand new and has all the "new" signs, well they were new until last night. HHonors is EVERYWHERE
.
Hence, at first Egypt, Turkey, Eastern Europe etc might see a short continuation of the sweetspots but how long can the Hampton Minsk continue at 5000 per night when the property has no incentive to do so because its occupancy is barely high enough to see a good reimbursement.
I am surprised to see the likes of HFP think this is great, because abandoning room categories is a crap idea given they can charge what they like and categories by stealth. They won't stay at those levels beyond a few months because at the moment they change all the time. I wouldn't bash HFP with the Lucky brush, but the positive changes he might see are more like all the suckers who will be helping him book those aspirational properties with card clicks.
The maximum will be 95,000 but there is no reason this won't be 100k or more over time, with inflation. I thought the categories broadly made sense given they were based on demand and average rates which is why Egypt is the way it is. The Hilton Alexandria going to 30k is no incentive to visit when safer places are fewer points.
The property I am staying at is brand new and has all the "new" signs, well they were new until last night. HHonors is EVERYWHERE
.
