Just returned from my holiday vacation. Booked on a single ticket DEN-LAX-ITO on UA and KOA-HNL-DEN on the return, with KOA-HNL on HA and HNL-DEN on UA. All UA legs were upgraded to F far in advance.
Get to the check-in counter in KOA and the agent did spend a good 15 minutes trying to avoid charging me $25 per bag (interlined all the way through to DEN).
I even cited the language on HA's web site that says (at least in my interpretation, that I should not be charged--all the way at the bottom of that enormous page):
"For reservations connecting with other airlines, the baggage fees and rules of the first marketing carrier applies throughout the itinerary. For example, if you are traveling roundtrip from Honolulu, Hawaii to Austin, Texas, and connecting from Hawaiian Airlines to United Airlines, Hawaiian Airlines baggage fees and rules would apply both ways."
The agent was unable to figure out how to exempt me from the fees and I had a plane to catch, so I caved in and paid indicating it was under duress and I would dispute the charge. The agent happily handed me a slip of paper with where to file my DoT complaint, so clearly I'm not the first customer to engage with them on this topic.
My argument, in my letter to HA's CEO with a copy to the DoT was that they aren't even following their own policy. UA was the marketing carrier and first carrier on my itinerary. Ignoring my UA status or UA credit cards, being in UA First (which the HA agent could clearly see) should have exempted me from any bag charges (for the number of bags I was checking and number of seats in my reservation).
In the event HA does not refund my fees, I'll be disputing the charge on my credit card.
I'll return with a resolution once it has been reached.
Just returned from my holiday vacation. Booked on a single ticket DEN-LAX-ITO on UA and KOA-HNL-DEN on the return, with KOA-HNL on HA and HNL-DEN on UA. All UA legs were upgraded to F far in advance.
Get to the check-in counter in KOA and the agent did spend a good 15 minutes trying to avoid charging me $25 per bag (interlined all the way through to DEN).
I even cited the language on HA's web site that says (at least in my interpretation, that I should not be charged--all the way at the bottom of that enormous page):
"For reservations connecting with other airlines, the baggage fees and rules of the first marketing carrier applies throughout the itinerary. For example, if you are traveling roundtrip from Honolulu, Hawaii to Austin, Texas, and connecting from Hawaiian Airlines to United Airlines, Hawaiian Airlines baggage fees and rules would apply both ways."
The agent was unable to figure out how to exempt me from the fees and I had a plane to catch, so I caved in and paid indicating it was under duress and I would dispute the charge. The agent happily handed me a slip of paper with where to file my DoT complaint, so clearly I'm not the first customer to engage with them on this topic.
My argument, in my letter to HA's CEO with a copy to the DoT was that they aren't even following their own policy. UA was the marketing carrier and first carrier on my itinerary. Ignoring my UA status or UA credit cards, being in UA First (which the HA agent could clearly see) should have exempted me from any bag charges (for the number of bags I was checking and number of seats in my reservation).
In the event HA does not refund my fees, I'll be disputing the charge on my credit card.
I'll return with a resolution once it has been reached.
Your first "marketing carrier" is Hawaiian Airlines - therefore Hawaiian Airlines rules apply - and even in your sample it says that.
You are confusing marketing carrier with who sold you the flight - the first marketing carrier is who flew you first regardless of who sold you the flight. That is the airline lingo.
Your first "marketing carrier" is Hawaiian Airlines - therefore Hawaiian Airlines rules apply - and even in your sample it says that.
the example is the reverse itinerary. (starting on the islands).
So if Hawaiian is the first marketing carrier on that example itinerary in both directions, then on an itinerary starting on the mainland, r/t, then returning from the islands, the mainland airline would be the first marketing carrier according to their own example.
Your first "marketing carrier" is Hawaiian Airlines - therefore Hawaiian Airlines rules apply - and even in your sample it says that.
You are confusing marketing carrier with who sold you the flight - the first marketing carrier is who flew you first regardless of who sold you the flight. That is the airline lingo.
I don't think so. The first two legs were on UA. Hawaiian was third. It's exactly the reverse of HA's example.
I guess I'm confused, in your post you said you were in Kona traveling back to Denver.
Just returned from my holiday vacation. Booked on a single ticket DEN-LAX-ITO on UA and KOA-HNL-DEN on the return, with KOA-HNL on HA and HNL-DEN on UA. All UA legs were upgraded to F far in advance.
Get to the check-in counter in KOA and the agent did spend a good 15 minutes trying to avoid charging me $25 per bag (interlined all the way through to DEN).
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I thought that you receipt was supposed to show what the baggage charges would be. My receipts always seem to. If that says $0 then isn't that supposed to be the committed charge. When you book one of these trips with UA but an inter island HA leg on return what does the receipt say for the HA leg?
I guess I'm confused, in your post you said you were in Kona traveling back to Denver.
Just returned from my holiday vacation. Booked on a single ticket DEN-LAX-ITO on UA and KOA-HNL-DEN on the return, with KOA-HNL on HA and HNL-DEN on UA. All UA legs were upgraded to F far in advance.
Get to the check-in counter in KOA and the agent did spend a good 15 minutes trying to avoid charging me $25 per bag (interlined all the way through to DEN).
I don't see the confusion. bmr12 bought a ticket DEN-ITO, KOA-DEN. The first marketing carrier is UA, since they marketed/sold DEN-ITO. Then bmr12 was having issues with HA when he checked in at KOA for the return. Not seeing the disconnect?
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It's funny, because I would guess the example on HA's website is far less common. I would think more HI round trips originate in the 48 than in HI.
I wonder, though, is anyone really enforcing the first marketing carrier rules here as stated on the HA website? For example, suppose your ticket was OGG-HNL-ORD and return ORD-HNL-OGG. Interisland legs on HA and overseas legs on UA. Let's say you are a 1K and the UA legs are in F. Is the UA counter in ORD really going to tell a 1K in F to pony up baggage fees because the journey began on HA? Is that really happening?
Similarly, is HA collecting fees from its own elites or those flying in F on HA legs where their journies began in the US on carriers other than HA? Is this actually happening?
I don't see the confusion. bmr12 bought a ticket DEN-ITO, KOA-DEN. The first marketing carrier is UA, since they marketed/sold DEN-ITO. Then bmr12 was having issues with HA when he checked in at KOA for the return. Not seeing the disconnect?
See, that is the issue, the marketing carrier isn't who sold you the ticket - it is who flies you.
Baggage fees are determied by who flies you first - not who sold you the ticket.
The first marketing carrier is the first airline to fly you - not who sold you the ticket. That is consistent with DOT rules.
Airline A cant circumvent Airline B policies even if Airline A sold the ticket. Airline B policies prevail if that is the first carrier.
And the return of the trip starts on Hawaiian - therefore, Hawaiian bag fees applies. They become the first marketing carrier on the return of the round trip.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billxmeredith
And the return of the trip starts on Hawaiian - therefore, Hawaiian bag fees applies. They become the first marketing carrier on the return of the round trip.
There is no such thing as a "first marketing carrier on the return of a round trip." That's the whole point. This is where you're getting confused.
The first marketing carrier is the first carrier on an itinerary. A round trip ticket is a single itinerary, which means that the first marketing carrier is the carrier on the first segment of the outbound. The return is merely a continuation of the itinerary.
You are treating the situation as though it were two one-way trips/itineraries on separate PNRs and thus missing the point of the discussion.
And the return of the trip starts on Hawaiian - therefore, Hawaiian bag fees applies. They become the first marketing carrier on the return of the round trip.
People are referring to HA's own published example of how they compute bag fees they collect.
Not to what one persons idea of what the rule is or should be. (right or wrong, and you may very well be right, but I don't think any of it is that clear. That's why people are referring back to HA's own published example of how they collect/assess bag fees.)
Ok, I had some bad info in my posts - I'll suck it up and admit it.
I talked to a friend of mine tonight who is fairly senior at Hawaiian. This is what he told me:
Yes, First Marketing Carrier is the first plane you board - and the baggage allowances apply for the entire itinerary. So I got that wrong.
What he did say and where it gets confusing:
The baggage allowances don't include frequent flier status, upgrades, or things like credit cards. So, you show up at Hawaiian to check in, you'll get charged as if you are a non-elite run of the mill flier if you check a bag.
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That's rather bizarre. But it still doesn't answer why HA would ignore a committed receipt for the ticket that actually specifies a 0 baggage charge from the original carrier. This is the part I don't understand. I know that when I purchase a ticket from UA their receipt shows the baggage charge on the email I get back. If that shows 0 because UA has waived my fee for whatever reason, that would seem to be a committment to that being the charge (i.e., 0). I thought the DOT regs were specific in saying that baggage charges had to be disclosed to the purchaser and then not altered and that would seem to be what the UA receipt is - a disclosure. So if that receipt says I pay 0 because I am an elite or whatever, then how does HA legally claim to collect a charge?
