Programs: CX, OZ, KE (+AY, JL), Shangri-La, Hilton
Posts: 3,721
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I've been using the AY non-schengen lounge (long-haul/emerald section) several times over the last two years. I think it's average in comparison to other European lounges, including in BA in LHR/LGW and IB in MAD T4S. In my view food is much better at AY/HEL than elsewhere. I agree, the only one shower is pretty ridiculous for an airline advertising their long-haul connections. Lounge staff is average, usually friendly but unable to help with more difficult issues.
The little food that can be found is not bad. Especially at breakfast time you can skip the food onboard if on a shorthaul connection.
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The major downside of HEL in my view is the airport operation itself. Waiting times at transit security are always (!) much longer than on a bad day at LHR, not to mention MAD ... and then the buses: They are either not there when pax disembark, unable to locate the bus gate at the terminal (it was really a tragedy, fortunately a local pax could give directions!), unheated at minus 10 degrees, driving you to the wrong plane. Unfortunately none (!) of about four or five bus transfers went as supposed. That's extremely poor.
The airport is operated by an entity called Finavia, some sort of government agency probably enjoying healthy profits due to the Asian transit pax. If they are not willing or able to hire competent personel then that's a shame.
They have started an enlargement project which will be finished in the autumn of 2009. Then there will be eight gates for longhauls as opposed to the present three. The other major improvements are a new automated baggage handling complex and supposedly a new longhaul lounge.
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So if I avoid HEL certainly not because of AY or their lounge, but because of the highly incompetent and always chaotic terminal operation.
My personal major dislike are the moronic paramilitary border guards doing the passport checks. I have witnessed too many times when these blokes enjoy harassing Asian pax for no reason at all. It would be a major improvement if they are replaced by normal police officers.
The major downside of HEL in my view is the airport operation itself. Waiting times at transit security are always (!) much longer than on a bad day at LHR, not to mention MAD ... and then the buses: They are either not there when pax disembark, unable to locate the bus gate at the terminal (it was really a tragedy, fortunately a local pax could give directions!), unheated at minus 10 degrees, driving you to the wrong plane. Unfortunately none (!) of about four or five bus transfers went as supposed. That's extremely poor.
So if I avoid HEL certainly not because of AY or their lounge, but because of the highly incompetent and always chaotic terminal operations.
This sounds shocking! I used to fly through HEL quite a lot and when bussed, buses were always on time, heated and efficient. Things must have changed rapidly during the last half year or so. Still in May I was going to the non-Schengen zone and there was absolutely no queue at all! Also in October when staying in the Schengen zone everything was efficient although each year the airport seems more crowded than before.
I use the non-shengen long-haul/Emerald lounge quite frequently, and have to say I really like it. It is clean, bright, the staff are delightful and the small selection of food is adequate (not as a replacement for an in-flight meal, but for a quick snack it's perfectly decent). I like the coffee, and the soda on tap is nice too. The salad selections and bread are nice, as are the cakes/pasrties. There are usually a few English papers lying around, but the 3 pcs offering internet are useless, it's SO slow. The wireless (pay by credit card) for your laptop is fine though.
It does get crowded when the Asian wave of flights comes in the afternoon, and certainly needs to be extended to fit the greater volumes of people in. Nevertheless it's a very pleasant place to sit, compared with many European ariport lounges.
As for the OP's reference to MA's and RJ's home airport lounges, neither are particularly nice. AMM has 2 identical lounges on either side of the terminal. Both are very dated with worn leather furniture, are very smoky, have a limited selection of food/drink (cellophane-wrapped cake slices and nuts), and the toilets are really really scary.
MA's lounges are BUD are pretty awful. Two lounges (SkyClub and DunaClub) in 2A/2B, both of which are small, have cafeteria type tables and chairs, are very dark, and have drinks, crisps and nasty packaged crisps. Very basic. Nowhere near as nice as the AY Emerald lounge at HEL.
As for transferring at HEL, I still find this very efficient despite the frequent bus trips to/from the aircraft. This does add 10 minutes onto the transfer time, but you can still count on being off the plane, bussed to the transfer area, through security, and back up to the non-Shengen area, within 10-15 minutes of landing.
My personal major dislike are the moronic paramilitary border guards doing the passport checks. I have witnessed too many times when these blokes enjoy harassing Asian pax for no reason at all. It would be a major improvement if they are replaced by normal police officers.
It's not only Asians. I look like a Finn.
I am still vexed about what happened to me a couple of years ago. I was queueing as usual in the Foreign Devils' line for pass control. When I got to the counter, the young chappie there told me that because I have a pysyvä oleskelulupa in my non-EU passport, I could go through the shorter, faster line with the Finns and other EU people. Great! Next time I came through, that's exactly what I did. As I approached the counter, I opened my passport to the page with the sticker and handed it to the guard. He glanced at it briefly, then without a word he threw it back at me and pointed to the 'Non-EU' queue.
I still don't know if the first guard, who told me I could do it, was just having a laugh or if the second bloke didn't know ( / didn't care) that I was allowed to use his counter. In any case, it was an annoying experience and I don't see any reason for that sort of conduct.
As a Finn, it is sad to hear that people have been having problems with our border control. Of course they need to be careful as our border is the outer border of EU and we have had some problems with that but anyway that is not an excuse to provide bad service to people who are not doing anything illegal.
I will be interested to see how it goes next Monday when I will be returning to Finland with my fiancée - we will be taking the non-EU queue because she needs to take it, I will try to observe how they will handle it. So far I have heard only good things about our service in the borders, it is not the friendliest but then again, it is rarely very friendly in the immigration anywhere. Border control should always remember that they are usually the first thing the visitor will see about Finland, my fiancée will also experience the Finland for the first time in her life in HEL immigration (okay, first experience will be Finnair).
Programs: CX, OZ, KE (+AY, JL), Shangri-La, Hilton
Posts: 3,721
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Originally Posted by miikka
As a Finn, it is sad to hear that people have been having problems with our border control. Of course they need to be careful as our border is the outer border of EU and we have had some problems with that but anyway that is not an excuse to provide bad service to people who are not doing anything illegal.
I think it's a collision of different cultures as the border guards are usually "redneck" boys with a rather basic education from a small village/town origin and not used to any other cultures as their own, AFAIK. Very much at home in the Finnish woods but not that much at an international airport.
My experience with them has been that all Schengen visas issued to Asians are seen as fake/suspicious and checks normally last up to 30 minutes or more. With some talk and eventual namedropping they usually relent and let through but the basic attitude is very negative towards alls Chinese, Indian and SE Asian pax.
Another problem of course is that these countryside blokes have a lower command of any foreign language including English than the average Finnish person so misunderstandings are bound to happen frequently.
Last edited by mosburger; Jan 9, 08 at 5:33 pm.
Reason: addition
I think it's a collision of different cultures as the border guards are usually "redneck" boys with a rather basic education from a small village/town origin and not used to any other cultures as their own, AFAIK. Very much at home in the Finnish woods but not that much at an international airport.
True. I wonder was it different for example in TMP when the local police took care of that before the beautiful time of Schengen. Hmmm, I think local police has been taking care of that even now in the old terminal for Ryanair as they fly to Riga. Of course now Schengen is expanding so we will see less and less local police for immigration purposes in TMP unless someone starts flying from here to outside of Schengen.
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Originally Posted by mosburger
My experience with them has been that all Schengen visas issued to Asians are seen as fake/suspicious and checks normally last up to 30 minutes or more. With some talk and eventual namedropping they usually relent and let through but the basic attitude is very negative towards alls Chinese, Indian and SE Asian pax.
I haven't actually seen or heard about this before. A lot of my friends seem to think that it is okay to deal with Finnish immigration but of course many nowadays already know that Finns do not smile. I will try to observe this next Monday when my fiancée will go through the immigration. Previous time I have chatted with someone coming from China, she specifically said that it was very easy to go through the immigration.
But of course these vary a lot - it depends so much about who you are dealing with. Hehe ... even I have experienced these officers without any kind of smile who just grunt something, I think they hate me (I am not so typical Finnish guy as I tend to be too happy). But then again, the situation isn't any kind of frightening for me as I know that they cannot basically do anything else than show unhappy face for me as long as I am not a criminal. For a visitor it might be very unfriendly situation when someone grunts something you cannot even understand and they do not smile at all. Looks like they are going to arrest you.
Oh, btw, I am not trying to polish their shields. If they do not act properly then I personally think that all the money I pay for the taxes are going wasted. In my opinion they need to do their jobs efficiently and prevent all the unwanted people from entering Schengen but at the same time they need to be friendly as they are typically the first faces a visitor will experience from Finland. Maybe it would be better to have police officers in there instead of soldiers but that is how it goes now with the current setting.
Many of the border guards at HEL airport have been transfered there from the Helsinki harbours, now that Estonia is in Schengen and passport controls are no longer done there.
I have had to deal once with the border guards at HEL airport when my company had guests from China. My guests were continuing their visit to Spain and only staying less than 24 hours in Finland. The border guards are told to be suspicious to people who have a Finnish issued visa but will continue almost immediately to another Schengen country.
Estonia is in Schengen, but the passport control for flights will dissappear only at the end of March.
This is quite interesting as Schengen area will cover the most of Europe, what will they do with all bus gates downstairs after that...many, many remote stand operated flights will be transferred to Schengen side at HEL in April..
This also means even worse lounge options for many destinations.
...I think local police has been taking care of that even now in the old terminal for Ryanair as they fly to Riga. Of course now Schengen is expanding so we will see less and less local police for immigration purposes in TMP unless someone starts flying from here to outside of Schengen.
Don't forget that Ryanair also flies TMP-DUB, and as far as I know there are no signs that Ireland intends to join Schengen any time soon. So even after March, Terminal 2 will continue to need immigration inspectors of some kind.
Don't forget that Ryanair also flies TMP-DUB, and as far as I know there are no signs that Ireland intends to join Schengen any time soon. So even after March, Terminal 2 will continue to need immigration inspectors of some kind.
Oh right. I forgot that one. I think in TMP they always have local police officers doing the immigration.
I am bored, I am flying HEL-PEK and it is delayed badly, also Osaka is delayed and Bangkok. According to Transfer desk they are exchanging an engine to Beijing aircraft, according to local Finnish aviation forum the Beijing aircraft (another one) is currently flying to HEL with center landing gear locked inside. And the Gateway Fresh lounge is really bad today, half of the electricity plugs are out of order (at least which I tried). It was much better in Schengen area (Gateway Tower lounge?) where I spent some time before coming here. And they had sparkling wine there ...
Oh well, got a small snack on behalf of Finnair (17 EUR) because of the delay. And now I am going to eat everything possible in this lounge.
You should have seen yesterday the A-Talk program where a packet tour passenger was giving hard time for Finnair CEO Hienonen for the recent delays on their planes. They also mentioned the gear problem on the flight PEK-HEL - don't know if it was supposed to go back HEL-PEK as well.
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Originally Posted by miikka
I am bored, I am flying HEL-PEK and it is delayed badly
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They got rid off Ted - now it's time for BOB to go too!
Don't forget that Ryanair also flies TMP-DUB, and as far as I know there are no signs that Ireland intends to join Schengen any time soon. So even after March, Terminal 2 will continue to need immigration inspectors of some kind.
And do not forget the route that started it all (or was it NYO?): TMP-STN. UK & Ireland share a common immigration area - thus if they will ever join Schengen it will happen hand in hand.
Although this has changed a bit recently. It used to be that on flights between the two, you just walked through with no checking at all, like a domestic flight. Now you have to show ID (at least, going from the UK to Ireland; I haven't done it in the other direction lately.)
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Originally Posted by FlyingFinn
... thus if they will ever join Schengen it will happen hand in hand.
I will try to observe this next Monday when my fiancée will go through the immigration. Previous time I have chatted with someone coming from China, she specifically said that it was very easy to go through the immigration.
