exbayern

If OP doesn't believe the many, many posts we have made here and on companion threads warning him about travel during the Olympics, BBCOne just had a report on the news program about travel during the games.

Ancien Maestro

I haven't yet started booking hotels for the 8 day flex trip in the Benz.. but spending a couple of hours in a vehicle with the kids, I do that here at home everyday. When we drive to the farm its 5 hours each way with a few stops, so I don't see the problem with the itinerary.. but shall keep flexible on the routes in case the kids get tired.. There is lots to see along the way, so the breaks should help us out as we traverse lightly through the terrain.

As for the Olympics, we've got an extra day ahead of the events to settle and navigate to the pavilions for a trial run. Each day is one event, so we'll get to the venues right after morning rush hour.. typically each event starts 4 pm, or 6 pm.. so shall give us plenty of time to stop and take in the Olympic excitement.

I'm happy to say that we've stayed within budget for most of the trip, and decided to splurge at the Savoy and Montreux Palace, as we received about 50% to 79% off of the room/suites. My golfing buddy booked this up for me, and has been a Fairmont employee for 12 years. A low lying fruit is the Fairmont in Hamburg where I can get a lake front suite about 75 to 85 sq meters (retailing 700 euros per night) using a suite upgrade for $199 euro per night.. likely isn't in the cards this trip, but sure would have been nice. Typically when scoring a deal like this, I like to stay at the hotel for 4 or 5 nights.

With the 5 nights in Montreux, there is a few family friendly excursions on the Gondola, and sightseeing. I imagine we'll take the vehicle around and explore. On the lake, we'll probably kick back and relax. The friends and family rate includes breakfast and spa.. so we'll hit the Willowstream a few times and get spa treatments/massage I imagine. A nice well needed break after Disneyland Paris, and before the Austria/Italy/southern France road trip.

exbayern

I've tried to nicely tell you over and over why your plans are not viable, and many others have tried the same. You really don't seem to understand what we have to say. We really are not teasing you. Your driving plan is not going to work, and will be miserable. You not only have an impossible plan with all these places, but your posts indicate that you are a novice at travel. You will be spending the entire day in the car, then finding the hotel, having a quick meal, and the next morning packing up again to spend the entire day on the road going to the next location.

Adding Hamburg? Comparing a 45 commute to school in Calgary to driving 5-8 hours a day every day between and around Rome/Nice/Florence and all the other places you list? Forget Hamburg. There is no way you could add it to your itinerary, and it isn't worth adding.

This doesn't sound like a holiday, but rather an attempt to collect as many places and labels as possible on a list, for whatever reason. Again, look at a map. Use viamichelin.com to calculate the times, distances, and costs. Then add about 30% more on to the time to account for summer travel, and then add more time driving around an unfamiliar city trying to find the hotel.

choijw

Is the OP doing Provence along the way to Nice? The lavender and sunflower fields are amazing. I did a nice 4 day trip to Avignon and Arles (with detours to Sault, etc) from Suisse Romande last year. I cannot imagine having done it quicker (0.5 day each way back/forth with 1.5 days in Avignon; lavender in Sault, etc 1 day; sunflowers along the way to Arles and visiting Arles 1 day; Le Pont du Gard 0.5 day).

I expect a future post from OP complaining about traffic... what should take 5 hours will really take 6-7 hours if not 8 at the worst times. Travel early morning/late at night.

exbayern

Adding yet another thing to the plan?!

The only way that OP will even do part of their plan is to use the highways and tollroads. From Nice to Antibes is beautiful by water, but in July/August will take well over an hour if not significantly more to travel the few kilometres. By péage (toll road) the same route is ugly, with no sea view, and some very spectacularly ugly buildings along the way. (There was a FTer who lived outside St-Paul de Vence for over two decades; ask his opinion of how the area has sadly changed in recent years)

The plan which OP proposes will miss everything of any interest, and only end up on dreary highways and tollroads, with stops for fast food along the way at the rest stops. There will be no time to actually experience much at all, at the pace proposed.

To me a bigger issue is the OP trying to drive from the highway to the hotel in places like Rome, Paris, Venice (!), or even Nice. OP has no experience driving outside North America, and doesn't seem to understand that things are very different indeed. He for instance proposes not travelling with cash, and the péage machine at the Antibes exit only takes coin (Euro coin), local toll card, or certain credit cards (local ones, gas ones, and not Visa, Mastercard, or American Express)

Even then, the rules of the road vary from country to country, and things are not always or even often written in English. Street signs are not on a pole like in Canada; they may be a plaque on a wall, or writing on a wall, or not marked at all.

My suggestion is that he cancels that entire plan, and flies or better takes the train to 1-2 places. If he really wants to drive (I don't understand the need to have a Mercedes, which is just an ordinary local car as a Ford is to Americans, but he seems to be focussed on that, so perhaps driving one is some sort of dream for him?), then I would drive to 1-2 places not in a city, and not in the peak of summer traffic.

choijw

I don't find OPs plan to go to 4-5 cities realistic. I completely agree that OP should limit to 2 cities. I would limit myself to just southern France with a tour of the French and Italian Riviera.

I'm proposing a more acceptable plan that involves driving 5 hours a day where having a car would actually be useful (as opposed to any city where the car is a hindrance rather than of any use). As you suggest, it would be better to go to places not in the city... the lavender and sunflower fields in Provence seems to be a perfect candidate for this as it is only available in June-August and public transport is not as convenient.

Afterwards, if the OP wants to speed around and get to every city in Europe, they can do as they please.

For me, the biggest difference is the marked lanes with separate lights for left/straight/right turns. Otherwise, driving is not a very big hassle. French should not be a problem for Canadians.

exbayern

Per the OP, he speaks no French. A few pages ago he refers to 'Nord de Gare' or something similar. He isn't in fact Québécois as a few of us thought, and he has posted in past about his lack of French. I agree that most Canadian children do/did have to learn French in school.

I've had a non-French speaker with me the last few days, and frankly I never noticed how even in a major tourist destination, not much is in English. The same when an American came to visit me in Paris.

Driving isn't the same. The merge lanes are far shorter than in Canada. France has priorité à droite, and more roundabouts. The rules are different for some things in different countries even along his route. There is a giant thread about driving on the Autobahn for instance here on FT, and resident expert Mamb0 would certainly say that there are differences, often significant. For those of us used to driving in western Europe and in the US and in Canada, we may be more used to things, but it is quite different. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/germa...-autobahn.html

Then add in the narrower driving lanes, very narrow parking spaces, the fact that one usually backs into a stall, the differences in street parking, and the very different signage (usually with no words) and it can be quite complex. THEN add in not speaking the language, and not knowing the city, and looking for a destination, and it is a recipe for an accident or a ticket.

jerseygirl

OP, PLEASE take advice about not driving to heart. Driving in city traffic and autobahn for long days will be uncomfortable and potentially dangerous for your precious children And you

If you are intent on driving for some of vacation please consider in one country and not in a city. The countryside is lovely in most European countries and staying at a small hotel with a pool will be restful and enjoyable for the children
The kids will love the train and you can also relax and see the country without stress

rankourabu

Why do all French speaking people in Europe think that we all speak French?
I've ran into this belief in France, Belgium and even New Caledonia!

Yes, true we are taught basic French in school - but its a have to not a want to. Its not taken seriously, like anything that children are forced to do, and noone actually learns anything. By age 13, after 5 years of basic French for half an hour a day, we stop, and very few remember anything apart from a few basic words.

Despite what people in French-speaking Europe think or are told - most Canadians do not speak French, and could care less.

exbayern

My taxi driver this morning told me that he had 'strangers' in the car last week, and he was trying to figure out which language they spoke, and where they were from.

He finally asked - they were Canadian, and Québécois! The accent completely confused him, as did the vocabulary. He didn't realise that they were actually speaking French at first. Watch a Québécois film on television in France, and chances are that it will be subtitled. Same with watching Radio Canada in Canada; the Parisians are often subtitled. And don't bother wishing someone 'Bonne Fin de Semaine!' in France. And they will laugh themselves silly if you order a crème glacée.

So even knowing more than the basics may not always come in handy. Then there are the stop signs, which are actually not the same word in Quebec as in France...

choijw

I never said one has to speak... one just has to know the basic words for the rules of the road. However, this sentiment you describe is prevalent in schooling in general due to a lack of motivation: math, English, sciences, humanities....

I have seen similar sentiments by certain people in Europe with regards to speaking English (the French) or speaking German (Swiss Romandes), etc. But to drive, one only needs to understand basic written commands, not actually have to comprehend or speak.

I think we all agree: Quebec people speak funny. And Swiss people are dumb (because they speak slowly).

exbayern

Sorry, I don't agree.

The road signs are vastly different between Canada and western Europe. The yellow diamond surrounded by white, with or without black lines, isn't seen commonly in North America. Nor is the two cars (or car and truck) side by side, or the X on a triangle. I don't believe that even the red circle is used.

Those may be second nature to us, but they really are not to North American drivers, and thus it is good to learn what the most common mean in advance to avoid an accident or a ticket, or entering a road in the wrong direction, or not yielding when one must. That doesn't even begin to cover the myriad of parking signs.

While road signs may lack words and thus seem easier, if the pictures are unfamiliar, then the lack of words isn't really very useful either. So many people don't fail their road test the first (or second) time in Germany due to lack of basic skills, but rather because it is so complex and requires school as well as a lot of practice.

Pointing the car, pressing the gas, and hoping for the best may work, but it may also be very dangerous.

rankourabu

Not to mention, you Europeans use your hands to fiddle with a stick and use both feet to drive!!!!

exbayern

OP, another thing to consider besides the folly of driving in most of the cities you list is the cost of parking.

Just looking at parking fees at some of my usual hotels:
- London 42-65 GBP plus the 8 GBP congestion charge
- Rome 35 Euro
- Venice (Piazzale Roma) 30 Euro plus you will need to determine the logistics and the cost of transporting all your luggage and children to the hotel
- Firenze 15-20 Euro
- Nice 25-35 Euro
- Munich 22 Euro

Those prices are just samples and some may well be near the low end, and are not valet parking. I definitely recommend that you valet park if you truly are going to consider driving these places.

My VW Golf had no cup longer, long after the North American models had them. Coffee 'to go' is still somewhat of a novelty because eating and drinking whilst driving is just too scary to comtemplate much of the time!

Ancien Maestro

Calgary has the highest parking rates in North America where I live, so these parking rates do not phase me. On advice of my father, I'm bringing a GPS Tom Tom preloaded with Euro maps in our baggage to Europe.

I'm writing from NY having already spent two nights at the Plaza in NY. Located beside Central Park its quite convenient. We paid an extra $100 per night to book a Deluxe Rose Suite.. a bit more space for the kids. We're actually quite impressed with the hotel rooms.. our suite is 730 sq ft.

This is the first trip we're taking without a vehicle, so we packed minimal suitcases. We decided to take a transfer shuttle to the front doors of the Plaza.. $17 pp so not a bad deal considering we avoided using the Subway and had to walk 4 blocks from the nearest station. Its manageable to stroll the suitecases through the airports, so I think it shall be manageable during our stint in Europe

We're doing the hop on and hop off tours with grayline.. so quite convenient. First night we visited Times Square and had a perfect window view of the action from the windows of Bubba Gump. I guess now we can say is that we visited Time Square. We visited Central Park at length yesterday and we are amazed of the expanse of the park considering how many high rises there are in Manhattan.

I surprised my wife for her Birthday here at the Plaza with Category A Olympic Closing Ceremony Tickets.. She prefers taking the kids with us, so I had to purchase 4 tickets. Cost $1,880 US per ticket, or $1,350 Euros. I don't buy from scalpers, so this was directly from an authorized IOC ticket seller. The Closing Ceremony Tickets were never available and always showed sold out. But appeared on the www.cosport.com website, and I was able to purchase the tickets. Good thing I checked, it seems if the tickets from their unsold Olympic Packages don't sell, they simply detach the tickets and sell the tickets individually. Thats a guess though. Or perhaps the IOC release additional tickets last second. Anyways, the way the Olympic lotteries for tickets went, I may have lucked out.. certainly the demand for opening and closing ceremony tickets far outweighed the demand at the time.

Lots to do.. so I'll keep an update here as our trip continues