No airline promises that the bag (or passenger) will be accommodated on a specific flight or that a certain schedule will be met. You're contracting for transportation from Point A to Point B. Schedules are published for reference and the convenience of passengers and are not legally binding.
Oh, that's good to know. Next time I want to change my flights from A to B to another flight or another date/time, I'll be sure to bring up your post.
I don't think it is at all clear to the passenger that is checking a bag and receiving a claim tag clearly showing a specific flight number and today's date that the deal is that the the bag might go days later on some other flight.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xibalba
It would be interesting to see the statistics on how more luggage is moved into the overhead bins and if there is any increase in boarding time. The GA agent in SFO on a recent trip was offering people to gate check for free the "bags they brought through security so they could avoid the checked bag fee." He said he wanted to turn the plane as quick as possible and he expected to run out of bin space. No one took him up on his offer so he kept repeating it. It was strange to hear the GA agent over the intercom touting his "free baggage checking service" as a win-win for everyone.
Thats the good thing about DL Connection Carriers as there are no bins to worry about (that are big enough to count)!
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Oh, that's good to know. Next time I want to change my flights from A to B to another flight or another date/time, I'll be sure to bring up your post.
I don't think it is at all clear to the passenger that is checking a bag and receiving a claim tag clearly showing a specific flight number and today's date that the deal is that the the bag might go days later on some other flight.
Unfortunately, sxf24 is correct. From the CoCs
Quote:
Delta will use its best efforts to carry the passenger and baggage with reasonable dispatch. Times shown in timetables or elsewhere are not guaranteed and form no part of this contract. Delta may without notice substitute alternate carriers or aircraft, and may alter or omit stopping
places shown on the ticket in case of necessity. Schedules are subject to change without notice. Delta is not responsible or liable for making connections, or for failing to operate any flight according to schedule, or for changing the schedule or any flight.
Quote:
Baggage will be carried in the same aircraft as the passenger unless Delta determines in its sole discretion that such carriage is impracticable, in which case Delta will carry the baggage on the next preceding or subsequent flight on which space is available.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbatl
As horribly confusing as that page is, anyone reading this page would still have to assume they get two free checked baggage on international flights.
To borrow a bit of rhetoric from GUWonder ... Welcome to the new Delta Air Lines, where we love to change the rules without telling you and it shows.
Whats so confusing that people won't understand that after July 1 they have to pay $50? Delta is giving people a 2 month notice of this charge....shoud they put out billboards for this or something. Not to mention the news channels are all over this.
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It's not ridiculous if consistency counts. Not everyone on a flight uses a toilet or the water on board the flight yet everyone pays for it -- so it's part of your add-on fees-are-ok- classification system for passenger "needs", "wants" and "use".
If you want consistency to count, then you need to apply consistency in th comparison. Toilet use is not the same as checking a bag. Failure to check a bag because you don't want to pay the fee affects you. Failure to use the toilet because you don't want to pay the fee affects you and the passengers near you.
Availability of water is a bit closer to checked baggage, but one would still argue that there are general health benefits to people washing their hands.
Anyway, toilets and water cross over from added passenger benefit to basic sanitation.
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You're both mistaken. DL can't have it both ways. They unbundled the baggage check from the airfare, so contract of carriage is irrelevant, as the $15 charge is a separate transaction. You go to the counter, the ticketing agent tells you it is $15 to check a bag, you pay the $15. Lacking any written agreement regarding this transaction, reasonable consumer expectation governs, and reasonable expectation is that your bag arrives when you do. This, if it doesn't, you shouldn't be charged for it an a refund is appropriate - whether willingly given by the airline or clawed back through your credit card company.
Now, if the airline checks your baggage for FREE under the airline ticket you purchased, THEN they are not liable if they don't get your bag there on time, but they lost that protection when they "unbundled" the one service from the other.
All that said, I don't have a problem with charging for bags. You know what the pricing model is in advance, so either pay it or don't.
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They are losing money. They have to generate revenue from somewhere.
It's too bad that DL and every other USA carrier refuses to try a wiser approach: Your "somewhere" where much more revenue will come from is to do things that cause, or perhaps even force, people to WANT to fly. In other words, make flying one of the best experiences that people can spend money on.
In order to get out of the hole that most carriers have dug for themselves, they all need to first and foremost just stop digging.
Nickels and dimes makes them less money than what it costs them.
You're both mistaken. Contract of carriage is irrelevant, as the $15 charge is a separate transaction. You go to the counter, the ticketing agent tells you it is $15 to check a bag, you pay the $15. Lacking any written agreement regarding this transaction, reasonable consumer expectation governs, and reasonable expectation is that your bag arrives when you do. This, if it doesn't, you shouldn't be charged for it an a refund is appropriate - whether willingly given by the airline or clawed back through your credit card company.
Regarding "unbundling" this term is an oxymoron as nothing has truly been unbundled. I did NOT see an announcement that all fares would drop $15 (or whatever) when they started adding fees, nor did I see any mention of it this time. I did not see fares drop by $10 when they stopped serving food on many/most domestic trips, etc. I have also seen fuel added as a surcharge, which is much like a restaurant adding charges for giving you cutlery, if they could only have been honest and tacked the charges onto the fares and their corporate agreements which is really what it was/is all about. Furthermore I have not seen YQ's meaningfully reduced on flights originatingfrom Europe (which seems kind of collusional with AF).
My biggest problem with this sort of thing, and among many carriers and not just DL is that when I fly a carrier 60 times in a year, travelling 98% of the time with carry-on luggage only, I would appreciate it greatly if they did not try to nickle and dime me the one time that I am taking a long trip with the family and may need to check-in a large amount of baggage (especially on the return). Generally DL has been the LEAST bad in this area (especially as my wife and son have status again), however, talking about undundling, wouldn't it be great if the airlines gave you a baggage "credit(s)' everytime you flew, and you could in effect use one on a later flight during the year?
This is an interesting idea. Probably a bit too bureaucratic to be viable but interesting. I presume that ironically the times you travel with carry-on only you are maybe in a more expensive fare? So it really sucks to be charged more on other occasions.
If this is about saving costs of processing bags, perhaps DL or other carriers should reward/ incentivise people who don't check bags at all, instead of punishing people who check a 2nd bag. Say give you more miles if they can't afford a $$ credit. Otherwise it just simply looks like another rather pathetic attempt to hide a fare hike.
Whats so confusing that people won't understand that after July 1 they have to pay $50? Delta is giving people a 2 month notice of this charge....shoud they put out billboards for this or something. Not to mention the news channels are all over this.
Maybe you're right. But most people aren't like us. So they won't know - because, until they fly, they won't be listening.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtrue28
False. Read the COC.
The contract of carriage is a contract of adhesion that's hardly worth the paper its written on. DL might rely on it when dealing you face to face, but the odds that a small claims court would enforce it are low to zero. Verbiage like this would give you a good change of having the contract of carriage dismissed as a consumer fraud:
Times shown in timetables or elsewhere are not guaranteed and form no part of this contract. Delta may without notice substitute alternate carriers or aircraft, and may alter or omit stopping places shown on the ticket in case of necessity. Schedules are subject to change without notice. Delta is not responsible or liable for making connections, or for failing to operate any flight according to schedule, or for changing the schedule or any flight.
The CoC verbiage says they take your money and aren't obligated to do much of anything in return.
In the small number of small claims cases that I've heard of, the airlines have showed up ill-prepared.
No airline promises that the bag (or passenger) will be accommodated on a specific flight or that a certain schedule will be met. You're contracting for transportation from Point A to Point B. Schedules are published for reference and the convenience of passengers and are not legally binding.
Huge mistake in business logic, sadly.
If I or you are simply and limitedly "contracting for transportation from Point A to Point B", then that makes change fees and capacity controls fraudulent. Bottom line: If when I buy a ticket, it requires that I fly a given flight on a given date between point A and point B, I am within both my rights and common sense that my bag(s) will be on that same flight.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GUWonder
Fees, fees, fees -- DL management is hooked to them like a crack cocaine addict is hooked to cocaine.
It would be unlawful if the revised baggage allowance is applied to all international DL tickets already issued while DL was still marketing to the purchasers that there were two free checked bags applicable for their ticket.
