Looking for compensation
Mar 26, 2017, 4:48 pm
#31
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 17
Denied boarding is the term for pax w/ boarding pass refused to board aircraft by gate agent.
What you stated is mismatch of pax name in DL system, regardless of circumstance, so DL was unable to issue a boarding pass. The issue is more likely on TA/VS and complicated system to transit pax info. It's one of the reason strongly encouraged to purchase fare directly from airline...
What you stated is mismatch of pax name in DL system, regardless of circumstance, so DL was unable to issue a boarding pass. The issue is more likely on TA/VS and complicated system to transit pax info. It's one of the reason strongly encouraged to purchase fare directly from airline...
As for purchasing a ticket direct via the airline? They did! Virgin! But it was code share with Delta,
Mar 26, 2017, 5:08 pm
#32
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Brighton. UK
Programs: BA Gold / VS /IHG Diamond & Ambassador
Posts: 14,194
Mar 26, 2017, 5:10 pm
#33
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 2,881
Yes I work for an airline too. I'm well aware what denied boarding means, therefore I'm well aware that Delta are also trying to get away with over booking with out paying compensation.
As for purchasing a ticket direct via the airline? They did! Virgin! But it was code share with Delta,
As for purchasing a ticket direct via the airline? They did! Virgin! But it was code share with Delta,
- It's common knowledge to checkin with your operating carrier
- It's common knowledge that denied boarding happens at the gate
- It's common knowledge that failure to checkin by the cutoff time is the passenger's fault, not the airline's.
- It's common knowledge to verify checkin capability before arriving at the airport.
You were not denied boarding. You failed to checkin by the published cutoff time because you failed to ensure that the name mismatch was resolved. You also failed to contact the correct airline for checkin. Lesson learned? Probably not. You'll be back complaining about how fog in JFK ruined your trip and you want the airline to pay for lost wages.
you make real complaints harder to process.Edit:
Sorry I know this comes off very mean, but this kind of stuff perturbs me.
Last edited by Widgets; Mar 26, 2017 at 5:20 pm
Mar 26, 2017, 5:11 pm
#34
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 17
If you feel you've been ignored and have a strong case, just go to court. Delta will respond.
Alternatively, use a service which will fight for you for a fee to save you time
https://www.airhelp.com/en/
Alternatively, use a service which will fight for you for a fee to save you time
https://www.airhelp.com/en/
Mar 26, 2017, 5:14 pm
#35
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 17
Yes. You are correct. However it was with virgin, they specifically wanted to fly with virgin because of their reputation. They've always been happy with them. So again apologies for the mistake.
Last edited by 19briot; Mar 26, 2017 at 5:42 pm
Mar 26, 2017, 5:15 pm
#36
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 3,394
Yes I work for an airline too. I'm well aware what denied boarding means, therefore I'm well aware that Delta are also trying to get away with over booking with out paying compensation.
As for purchasing a ticket direct via the airline? They did! Virgin! But it was code share with Delta,
As for purchasing a ticket direct via the airline? They did! Virgin! But it was code share with Delta,
Sites like that are worthless if any error is made. There was obviously some name miss-match so either someone typo-ed something or the name entered didn't match the name on the passport. I would find it highly unlikely DL rigged the check-in system to give you Aunt a hard time checking in so they don't have to pay IDB. That seems rather far-fetched.
Mar 26, 2017, 5:17 pm
#37
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 2,881
In what way is booking from lastminute.com the same as booking directly with the airline? It's not about the codeshare, it's the crappy Online site you used.
Sites like that are worthless if any error is made. There was obviously some name miss-match so either someone typo-ed something or the name entered didn't match the name on the passport. I would find it highly unlikely DL rigged the check-in system to give you Aunt a hard time checking in so they don't have to pay IDB. That seems rather far-fetched.
Sites like that are worthless if any error is made. There was obviously some name miss-match so either someone typo-ed something or the name entered didn't match the name on the passport. I would find it highly unlikely DL rigged the check-in system to give you Aunt a hard time checking in so they don't have to pay IDB. That seems rather far-fetched.
Mar 26, 2017, 5:20 pm
#38
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 17
This whole thread is so strange. This incident happened back in December,we gave delta plenty of opportunities to explain what happened but they ignored us, so that's why we had no alternative but to go to the CAA. They have totally supported us, they have got all the letters, all the emails etc , there is no Scull duggery going on here. It would be nice to have a constructive comment, either examples of claiming compensation or unbiased views.
Mar 26, 2017, 5:26 pm
#40
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 17
In what way is booking from lastminute.com the same as booking directly with the airline? It's not about the codeshare, it's the crappy Online site you used.
Sites like that are worthless if any error is made. There was obviously some name miss-match so either someone typo-ed something or the name entered didn't match the name on the passport. I would find it highly unlikely DL rigged the check-in system to give you Aunt a hard time checking in so they don't have to pay IDB. That seems rather far-fetched.
Sites like that are worthless if any error is made. There was obviously some name miss-match so either someone typo-ed something or the name entered didn't match the name on the passport. I would find it highly unlikely DL rigged the check-in system to give you Aunt a hard time checking in so they don't have to pay IDB. That seems rather far-fetched.
Mar 26, 2017, 5:33 pm
#41
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 17
If you work for an airline, they you shouldn't have made so many mistakes that insiders would know not to make.
You were not denied boarding. You failed to checkin by the published cutoff time because you failed to ensure that the name mismatch was resolved. You also failed to contact the correct airline for checkin. Lesson learned? Probably not. You'll be back complaining about how fog in JFK ruined your trip and you want the airline to pay for lost wages. you make real complaints harder to process.
Edit:
And an airline employee would never book on lastminute.com. We cringe at people who do that instead of booking with the airline. There's often little advantage to using cheap third party agents. What exactly do you do for an airline?
Sorry I know this comes off very mean, but this kind of stuff perturbs me.
- It's common knowledge to checkin with your operating carrier
- It's common knowledge that denied boarding happens at the gate
- It's common knowledge that failure to checkin by the cutoff time is the passenger's fault, not the airline's.
- It's common knowledge to verify checkin capability before arriving at the airport.
You were not denied boarding. You failed to checkin by the published cutoff time because you failed to ensure that the name mismatch was resolved. You also failed to contact the correct airline for checkin. Lesson learned? Probably not. You'll be back complaining about how fog in JFK ruined your trip and you want the airline to pay for lost wages.
you make real complaints harder to process.Edit:
And an airline employee would never book on lastminute.com. We cringe at people who do that instead of booking with the airline. There's often little advantage to using cheap third party agents. What exactly do you do for an airline?
Sorry I know this comes off very mean, but this kind of stuff perturbs me.
If it was my airline I'd have no issue with admitting the fault was ours. I don't own the airline.
Last edited by 19briot; Mar 26, 2017 at 5:44 pm
Mar 26, 2017, 6:06 pm
#42
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 17
As a starting point and perhaps for the benefit of others in your situation:
1. There is no benefit in writing to random people at a large operating business, even to senior executives. All of these claims are forwarded to the same database as an EC 261/2004 claim would made it into in a day or two had it been correctly submitted. While people sometimes believe that "executive support" and other sillinesses mean special treatment, it does not. It means delay.
2. Complaints should be short and to the point. An EC 261/2004 claim is based on a simple set of facts and is binary. Those facts either exist or not. The purpose of your trip and your aunt's age are irrelevant. Unlike situations where you are seeking assistance where the personal situation may matter, it does not matter here.
3. This claim demonstrates that it is a waste of time dealing with the NEB's such as the CAA with respect to a multinational such as DL as repsects a claim such as this. DL knows full well what the Regulation provides, has a team of highly-paid lawyers to determine its legal positions, and a larger team of regulatory front-line people to send out formulaic answers such as the one you received. It will not be swayed by the CAA. Presuming that you have a UK address and thus access to MCOL, your time with the CAA is not well spent. File your claim with DL, if it is denied, start the MCOL process (Letter Before Action forms are on the website) and let the matter take its course.
But, but, but -- At least on the facts you suggest, I do not believe that your aunt has a valid denied boarding claim against DL under EC 261/2004 and that she will lose that claim should she as the passenger (not you) pursue her claim.
As best as I can see, your aunt had troubles with VS which caused a name mismatch ultimately leading to an inability to timely check in with DL. The technical fault appears to have been due to a "meltdown" (your words) at VS which DL was able to correct but not quickly enough to permit boarding.
Nonetheless, DL did rebook, either as required by the fare rules or ex gratia. While the entire check-in mess is neither your fault nor your aunt's so far as your statement suggests, if DL boards a passenger with a name mismatch, it subjects itself to massive fines and the prospect of having to return your aunt to LHR on its next flight. In turn, your aunt faces being excluded from the US at JFK, a far worse situation than being stuck at LHR waiting for the next flight.
It is possible that DL may toss something your aunt's way to soothe hurt feelings, but it seems clear that it is dug in and quite prepared to deal with MCOL and the ensuing court proceeding. While the end result is not precedential in the sense of UK and EU law, it sets a pattern which DL does not want to set.
1. There is no benefit in writing to random people at a large operating business, even to senior executives. All of these claims are forwarded to the same database as an EC 261/2004 claim would made it into in a day or two had it been correctly submitted. While people sometimes believe that "executive support" and other sillinesses mean special treatment, it does not. It means delay.
2. Complaints should be short and to the point. An EC 261/2004 claim is based on a simple set of facts and is binary. Those facts either exist or not. The purpose of your trip and your aunt's age are irrelevant. Unlike situations where you are seeking assistance where the personal situation may matter, it does not matter here.
3. This claim demonstrates that it is a waste of time dealing with the NEB's such as the CAA with respect to a multinational such as DL as repsects a claim such as this. DL knows full well what the Regulation provides, has a team of highly-paid lawyers to determine its legal positions, and a larger team of regulatory front-line people to send out formulaic answers such as the one you received. It will not be swayed by the CAA. Presuming that you have a UK address and thus access to MCOL, your time with the CAA is not well spent. File your claim with DL, if it is denied, start the MCOL process (Letter Before Action forms are on the website) and let the matter take its course.
But, but, but -- At least on the facts you suggest, I do not believe that your aunt has a valid denied boarding claim against DL under EC 261/2004 and that she will lose that claim should she as the passenger (not you) pursue her claim.
As best as I can see, your aunt had troubles with VS which caused a name mismatch ultimately leading to an inability to timely check in with DL. The technical fault appears to have been due to a "meltdown" (your words) at VS which DL was able to correct but not quickly enough to permit boarding.
Nonetheless, DL did rebook, either as required by the fare rules or ex gratia. While the entire check-in mess is neither your fault nor your aunt's so far as your statement suggests, if DL boards a passenger with a name mismatch, it subjects itself to massive fines and the prospect of having to return your aunt to LHR on its next flight. In turn, your aunt faces being excluded from the US at JFK, a far worse situation than being stuck at LHR waiting for the next flight.
It is possible that DL may toss something your aunt's way to soothe hurt feelings, but it seems clear that it is dug in and quite prepared to deal with MCOL and the ensuing court proceeding. While the end result is not precedential in the sense of UK and EU law, it sets a pattern which DL does not want to set.
Mar 26, 2017, 6:37 pm
#43
Join Date: Feb 2016
Programs: DL DM, SPG Plat 100/LT Gold, Marriott Plat, National Executive Elite
Posts: 2,988
I'm sure the complaints body (CAA) that delta refer to on their own site would know everything about EC261, so maybe read the whole thread? The pax booked through virgin thsts why they went to the virgin ticket desk!
Your comments are meaningless unless you read the whole thread. And as for deltas customer service? Are you joking? Or do you work for them?
Your comments are meaningless unless you read the whole thread. And as for deltas customer service? Are you joking? Or do you work for them?
It seems your note about them booking directly via Virgin turns out to be incorrect. I do not work for Delta, and am not joking. Your sarcasm and personal attacks are not appreciated.
Everyone is providing their unbiased view. Please don't attack people personally just because you may disagree with their point of view.
I stand by my original assessment.
Mar 26, 2017, 7:15 pm
#44
In memoriam, FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2005
Location: PIT
Programs: DM life is over 2MM PM now & NW MillionAir Wyndham Rewards Plat -Hotels.com Silver -Accor Silver
Posts: 15,408
Well, this is the wrong forum when someone is looking for "yes men".
Mar 26, 2017, 7:15 pm
#45
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: RDU
Posts: 5,239
If you work for an airline, they you shouldn't have made so many mistakes that insiders would know not to make.
You were not denied boarding. You failed to checkin by the published cutoff time because you failed to ensure that the name mismatch was resolved. You also failed to contact the correct airline for checkin. Lesson learned? Probably not. You'll be back complaining about how fog in JFK ruined your trip and you want the airline to pay for lost wages. you make real complaints harder to process.
Edit:
And an airline employee would never book on lastminute.com. We cringe at people who do that instead of booking with the airline. There's often little advantage to using cheap third party agents. What exactly do you do for an airline?
Sorry I know this comes off very mean, but this kind of stuff perturbs me.
- It's common knowledge to checkin with your operating carrier
- It's common knowledge that denied boarding happens at the gate
- It's common knowledge that failure to checkin by the cutoff time is the passenger's fault, not the airline's.
- It's common knowledge to verify checkin capability before arriving at the airport.
You were not denied boarding. You failed to checkin by the published cutoff time because you failed to ensure that the name mismatch was resolved. You also failed to contact the correct airline for checkin. Lesson learned? Probably not. You'll be back complaining about how fog in JFK ruined your trip and you want the airline to pay for lost wages.
you make real complaints harder to process.Edit:
And an airline employee would never book on lastminute.com. We cringe at people who do that instead of booking with the airline. There's often little advantage to using cheap third party agents. What exactly do you do for an airline?
Sorry I know this comes off very mean, but this kind of stuff perturbs me.