OhDoctor

Flew JFK to PHX last Sunday, April 12th. Boarded at ~7:45, delayed for >3 hours before takeoff (first engine stall, then "too much fuel was put in the plane", then waiting for "paperwork" from the ground crew). Water was offered, but no food, and no opportunity to deplane.

Sent a complaint to Delta the next day, clicked the box requesting a reply, and have heard nothing since.

Thoughts? Let it go? I at least wanted them to acknowledge the incident, which I believe was technically a DOT violation.

kettle1

What are you looking for? Miles? Did you want to fly on a unsafe plane? That "paperwork" from the ground crew is VERY important. You seem to know what was going on - so the crew kept the PX advised.

The "incident" you report is an airline trying to get you to PHX on a safe plane.

sbm12

FlightStats history says DL491 on 12 Apr 2015 was on time.

aww3583

Yesterday, my mother in law had a 3-hour tarmac delay turn into an 8-hour delay on a 40-minute flight (VPS-ATL). Multiple attempts at the repair were futile and another plane was brought in. No refreshments or meal vouchers were distributed. Shortly before the successful departure, they were notifying the passengers a plan was being developed to bus everyone to a nearby hotel for the night.

By the time she landed, she had a $75 voucher added to her account.

apodo77

What evidence do you have to support "most other carriers would have simply canceled the flight"?

In regards to the OP here are the DOT rules on tarmac delays (it needs to be more than 3 hours and even then the pilot has a say). Outside of some courtesy miles not sure what else you think DL should do for you:

"Some flights are delayed on the airport "tarmac" before taking off or after landing. DOT rules prohibit most U.S. airlines from allowing a domestic flight to remain on the tarmac for more than three hours unless:

the pilot determines that there is a safety or security reason why the aircraft cannot taxi to the gate and deplane its passengers, or
Air traffic control advises the pilot that taxiing to the gate (or to another location where passengers can be deplaned) would significantly disrupt airport operations."

apodo77

I would assume he is referring to the AM flight (425). Long delay:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/D...210Z/KJFK/KPHX

IIIIIIIIIIllllllllll

11:02 departure for 8:10 flight.. how convenient...

Oakshadow

Does that important paperwork usually take an hour or more? The OP didn't specify as to how long the "paperwork" part of their delay was, but it's implied it was about an hour. I've frequently traveled on DL and other carrier flights that have had less than 30 minutes turnaround from their inbound flights, presumably with the paperwork portion of that 30 minutes consuming only part of that time. Are those flights inherently dangerous since their "paperwork" was completed in such a small time-frame?

kettle1

You are correct, I have none. I have been on UA flts a few times with very similar circumstances and they cancelled the flt. I retract my statement.

The bottom line is that paperwork is VERY important and the pilot is only going to fly a safe plane.

This is one of the reasons I choose DL. Are other carriers safe. YES. Again, I retract that statement. I will go back to my post and remove that statement, as I can not back it up.

I pulled a Brian Williams. Sorry.

Navig8R

Did you miss the part about the OP's aircraft experiencing an "engine stall" (I'm assuming compressor stall on takeoff)? There is no doubt that extra paperwork and maintenance checks were required to let this flight continue to PHX. And yes, no aircraft will leave the gate until the paperwork is in order.

xliioper

The clock generally doesn't start until the doors close, not the beginning of boarding. If they let people off, they would have likely had to delay the flight further and then you run the risk of the crew timing out and canceling the flight completely.

MaydayMayday

Dont quite understand why you keep equating the paperwork to safety. Just seems like an appeal to emotion with really no evidence that this flights safety was in question... Presumably they weren't in an engine stall for the full 3 hours.

javabytes

DL425

kettle1

MaydayMayday - I love your handle.

Navig8R

The paperwork allows the pilot to sign off on activities related to the aircraft. This is done on every flight and is typically boiler plate, but when a maintenance issue occurs, more paperwork is generated. A compressor stall can be serious and result in damage to the engine, meaning a return to the gate and a potentially lengthy maintenance check and delay. The paperwork is essentially a checklist indicating that the pilot accepts the aircraft and is safe to fly. So yes, paperwork and safety go hand-in-hand