The Delta Experience - Details Matter
Jul 22, 2014, 6:13 am
#1
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Join Date: Dec 2013
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The Delta Experience - Details Matter
Experience on Delta
Delta flight DL189 July 11th 2014
This flight was diverted on the way from DTW to PEK due to a medical emergency on board. We spent time on the ground in Edmonton, Alberta while the passenger was removed. Clearly this meant that the flight arrival in PEK was delayed. At conclusion of the flight I was ambushed by a flight attendant who told me that we had only arrived at all on the scheduled day, because the flight crew had taken a vote whether to continue the flight because it meant that some would have to work a longer shift, and would I please send a note to Delta to let the management know what a great crew they were for doing their job and voting (although not unanimously) to continue. For me this brings up two points:
1) Whatever happened to doing your job conscientiously and why was this not a unanimous vote? There are many passengers on the flights that extend for 14 hours or more who don’t have the opportunity to retreat to the bunks in the crew rest area and sleep for a few hours because they are stuck in an uncomfortable economy seat (yes, they are all uncomfortable, why not try it Richard Anderson? 14 hours in coach will make you a changed man).
2) Why is it necessary for Delta management to have to get a note from a passenger? Is the management structure so fragile and regimented that management don’t believe their crews are capable of sacrifice and need continual feedback from passengers to ratify them
Delta flight DL582 July 19th
On the return flight I had booked, it was my intention to use one of the new-fangled “World Upgrades” and having booked my ticket on July 1st for a July 19th return, I thought that I might have a decent chance. On July 1st the Diamond desk informed me that the flight was wide open in business, with 16 seats available but they had to sell a few more in business before upgrade seats would become available. Okay, I can accept that, business has to make a profit. On July 13th I check and there are 11 seats available, call Diamond desk and they can’t confirm that I will get an upgrade. On July 16th there are 8 seats left and Diamond desk tell me that it should clear since the cabin is wide open. On July 18th the day before the flight, there are seven seats left. I am feeling optimistic after 103 hours of business time on the road in China in 90 degree heat, it will be sweet to relax and sleep my way home. Overnight on the 18th the number of seats decreases from 8 to 2 at 8am. I call the Diamond desk and they tell me to go to the airport early for my 4.20pm flight to make sure I get my upgrade (?). The Delta website has sent me an email nagging me to check in early but will not let me check in because as a green card holder they need to see my documents at the airport. Well, Delta, I have only showed my green card to you about 50 plus times in the last five years, isn’t it time someone wrote the details down?
As I write this I am sitting in PVG having arrived at 10.30 for my 4.20 flight but I have been turned away from the Sky Priority check in line with a “Too Early, go rest” from the Chinese Delta staff. So I don’t even have access to the club, and here I sit among people who think that covering their cough or sneeze with a handkerchief or something is clearly a quaint western custom, to which they dont subscribe.
The Diamond desk are unable to even tell me where my position is in the standby list for upgrade because “We can’t see that detail, these are all computer assigned by the system, but if you check in you will see the standby list” (Can’t check in on line for reasons stated above, can’t check in at airport for reasons stated above)
So Delta, since I am a Diamond, and you are fully aware of what that means in terms of customer loyalty, how about a truthful, accurate, and honest explanation of just how upgrades are assigned? I am certain the people on the Diamond desk would appreciate the explanation too.
I could end this by predictably saying “There is a choice in air travel and I plan to go elsewhere” but that is not my intention or desire. I actually like Delta, and most of the time the airline does an excellent job. But as in many things, it’s the small details that make up the overall picture, and it’s small details like those above which drive passengers mad (passengers = revenue, remember?)
Just checked the Delta App on my i-phone (3 ½ hours to departure) and there is now only one seat open in Business Elite. That is probably me shot for an upgrade since no doubt there will be a NONREV Delta employee in that seat.
Delta flight DL189 July 11th 2014
This flight was diverted on the way from DTW to PEK due to a medical emergency on board. We spent time on the ground in Edmonton, Alberta while the passenger was removed. Clearly this meant that the flight arrival in PEK was delayed. At conclusion of the flight I was ambushed by a flight attendant who told me that we had only arrived at all on the scheduled day, because the flight crew had taken a vote whether to continue the flight because it meant that some would have to work a longer shift, and would I please send a note to Delta to let the management know what a great crew they were for doing their job and voting (although not unanimously) to continue. For me this brings up two points:
1) Whatever happened to doing your job conscientiously and why was this not a unanimous vote? There are many passengers on the flights that extend for 14 hours or more who don’t have the opportunity to retreat to the bunks in the crew rest area and sleep for a few hours because they are stuck in an uncomfortable economy seat (yes, they are all uncomfortable, why not try it Richard Anderson? 14 hours in coach will make you a changed man).
2) Why is it necessary for Delta management to have to get a note from a passenger? Is the management structure so fragile and regimented that management don’t believe their crews are capable of sacrifice and need continual feedback from passengers to ratify them
Delta flight DL582 July 19th
On the return flight I had booked, it was my intention to use one of the new-fangled “World Upgrades” and having booked my ticket on July 1st for a July 19th return, I thought that I might have a decent chance. On July 1st the Diamond desk informed me that the flight was wide open in business, with 16 seats available but they had to sell a few more in business before upgrade seats would become available. Okay, I can accept that, business has to make a profit. On July 13th I check and there are 11 seats available, call Diamond desk and they can’t confirm that I will get an upgrade. On July 16th there are 8 seats left and Diamond desk tell me that it should clear since the cabin is wide open. On July 18th the day before the flight, there are seven seats left. I am feeling optimistic after 103 hours of business time on the road in China in 90 degree heat, it will be sweet to relax and sleep my way home. Overnight on the 18th the number of seats decreases from 8 to 2 at 8am. I call the Diamond desk and they tell me to go to the airport early for my 4.20pm flight to make sure I get my upgrade (?). The Delta website has sent me an email nagging me to check in early but will not let me check in because as a green card holder they need to see my documents at the airport. Well, Delta, I have only showed my green card to you about 50 plus times in the last five years, isn’t it time someone wrote the details down?
As I write this I am sitting in PVG having arrived at 10.30 for my 4.20 flight but I have been turned away from the Sky Priority check in line with a “Too Early, go rest” from the Chinese Delta staff. So I don’t even have access to the club, and here I sit among people who think that covering their cough or sneeze with a handkerchief or something is clearly a quaint western custom, to which they dont subscribe.
The Diamond desk are unable to even tell me where my position is in the standby list for upgrade because “We can’t see that detail, these are all computer assigned by the system, but if you check in you will see the standby list” (Can’t check in on line for reasons stated above, can’t check in at airport for reasons stated above)
So Delta, since I am a Diamond, and you are fully aware of what that means in terms of customer loyalty, how about a truthful, accurate, and honest explanation of just how upgrades are assigned? I am certain the people on the Diamond desk would appreciate the explanation too.
I could end this by predictably saying “There is a choice in air travel and I plan to go elsewhere” but that is not my intention or desire. I actually like Delta, and most of the time the airline does an excellent job. But as in many things, it’s the small details that make up the overall picture, and it’s small details like those above which drive passengers mad (passengers = revenue, remember?)
Just checked the Delta App on my i-phone (3 ½ hours to departure) and there is now only one seat open in Business Elite. That is probably me shot for an upgrade since no doubt there will be a NONREV Delta employee in that seat.
Jul 22, 2014, 6:55 am
#2
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It won't be different anywhere else.
Jul 22, 2014, 7:29 am
#3
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: MSP
Programs: DL GM, AMEX Business Platinum, AMEX Delta Reserve, DL SkyClub Member, Choice PM
Posts: 2,218
Did you get the upgrade to BE?
For easier reading you may want to adequately space out the paragraphs etc.
These things happen!
With reduced competition, reduced availability and increasing demand the airlines can do as they please.
For easier reading you may want to adequately space out the paragraphs etc.
These things happen!
With reduced competition, reduced availability and increasing demand the airlines can do as they please.
Jul 22, 2014, 7:45 am
#4
Join Date: Dec 2009
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Welcome to FT! You're probably going to get hazed a bit on that rant...so put on your thick skin.
The only thing I see remotely wrong here was the flight attendant "ambushing" you to get you to write a letter. That was a bit inappropriate. However, you should be glad they decided to continue. The alternative is that they call in "fatigued" and you spend the night in YEG and get to PVG even later. If the flight had spent too much time on the ground, they would have gone over duty time anyway (had they continued). Thankfully, it appears it worked out well.
As far as the rant about not getting an upgrade... You probably won't find much sympathy here. WFBF, which means: Want First, BUY First (or BE in this case). If you're waiting for an upgrade, just know that at any time, someone else can buy that seat. For FC/BE that's more likely to happen close to the departure since peeps that book at the last minute aren't usually price sensitive.
The only thing I see remotely wrong here was the flight attendant "ambushing" you to get you to write a letter. That was a bit inappropriate. However, you should be glad they decided to continue. The alternative is that they call in "fatigued" and you spend the night in YEG and get to PVG even later. If the flight had spent too much time on the ground, they would have gone over duty time anyway (had they continued). Thankfully, it appears it worked out well.
As far as the rant about not getting an upgrade... You probably won't find much sympathy here. WFBF, which means: Want First, BUY First (or BE in this case). If you're waiting for an upgrade, just know that at any time, someone else can buy that seat. For FC/BE that's more likely to happen close to the departure since peeps that book at the last minute aren't usually price sensitive.
Jul 22, 2014, 9:12 am
#5
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Programs: DM
Posts: 9
@ dd1612, nope no upgrade on the return
@ HDQDD, ah dont worry on the thick skin, can't be English and not have that.
Funny thing is, on the outgoing I got a WUG confirmed with 12 open seats and 10 days prior to flight date. However with an 18 day advance notice on the return flight, it just didnt happen. Thats what I mean about the rules being so arcane. I have actually reached the conclusion that check-in staff, Diamond desk staff etc. are being deliberately kept in the dark on the rules so they don't have the chance to tell a customer he likely won't get the upgrade today.
Even on check in at PVG with 2 hours to go and no seats showing available on the website, the check in girl still told me to hang around at the gate and wait for an announcement, because I might get an upgrade. I withdrew to the club and enjoyed a sleeping draft.
@ HDQDD, ah dont worry on the thick skin, can't be English and not have that.
Funny thing is, on the outgoing I got a WUG confirmed with 12 open seats and 10 days prior to flight date. However with an 18 day advance notice on the return flight, it just didnt happen. Thats what I mean about the rules being so arcane. I have actually reached the conclusion that check-in staff, Diamond desk staff etc. are being deliberately kept in the dark on the rules so they don't have the chance to tell a customer he likely won't get the upgrade today.
Even on check in at PVG with 2 hours to go and no seats showing available on the website, the check in girl still told me to hang around at the gate and wait for an announcement, because I might get an upgrade. I withdrew to the club and enjoyed a sleeping draft.
Jul 22, 2014, 10:31 am
#6
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You don't have to hang out in the gate area but it's true that you should get the upgrade if there's a no show in BE or if a BE passenger misses the connection.
However, "the check in GIRL"? I wasn't aware that DL used child labor, even at outstations? Would you have expected a different result if it had been a check in BOY?
However, "the check in GIRL"? I wasn't aware that DL used child labor, even at outstations? Would you have expected a different result if it had been a check in BOY?
Jul 22, 2014, 10:32 am
#7
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@ dd1612, nope no upgrade on the return
@ HDQDD, ah dont worry on the thick skin, can't be English and not have that.
Funny thing is, on the outgoing I got a WUG confirmed with 12 open seats and 10 days prior to flight date. However with an 18 day advance notice on the return flight, it just didnt happen. Thats what I mean about the rules being so arcane. I have actually reached the conclusion that check-in staff, Diamond desk staff etc. are being deliberately kept in the dark on the rules so they don't have the chance to tell a customer he likely won't get the upgrade today.
Even on check in at PVG with 2 hours to go and no seats showing available on the website, the check in girl still told me to hang around at the gate and wait for an announcement, because I might get an upgrade. I withdrew to the club and enjoyed a sleeping draft.
@ HDQDD, ah dont worry on the thick skin, can't be English and not have that.
Funny thing is, on the outgoing I got a WUG confirmed with 12 open seats and 10 days prior to flight date. However with an 18 day advance notice on the return flight, it just didnt happen. Thats what I mean about the rules being so arcane. I have actually reached the conclusion that check-in staff, Diamond desk staff etc. are being deliberately kept in the dark on the rules so they don't have the chance to tell a customer he likely won't get the upgrade today.
Even on check in at PVG with 2 hours to go and no seats showing available on the website, the check in girl still told me to hang around at the gate and wait for an announcement, because I might get an upgrade. I withdrew to the club and enjoyed a sleeping draft.
Jul 23, 2014, 5:10 am
#8
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2013
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Posts: 9
Are you going all PC on me? Anyway she was an attractive Chinese female girl and I expect no difference if a trained monkey had checked me in. Fact is I don't think the customer facing staff have been equipped with enough knowledge to satisfactorily answer questions regarding WUG's mainly because Delta want the system to work things out rather than the employee being able to answer a reasonable question. To me this degrades customer service rather than enhancing it. What do you think?
Jul 23, 2014, 5:18 am
#9
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WUG?
I assume you mean the Global Upgrade Certificates (GUCs)?
I assume you mean the Global Upgrade Certificates (GUCs)?
Jul 23, 2014, 5:30 am
#10
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: MCO
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Funny thing is, on the outgoing I got a WUG confirmed with 12 open seats and 10 days prior to flight date. However with an 18 day advance notice on the return flight, it just didnt happen. Thats what I mean about the rules being so arcane. I have actually reached the conclusion that check-in staff, Diamond desk staff etc. are being deliberately kept in the dark on the rules so they don't have the chance to tell a customer he likely won't get the upgrade today.
Even on check in at PVG with 2 hours to go and no seats showing available on the website, the check in girl still told me to hang around at the gate and wait for an announcement, because I might get an upgrade. I withdrew to the club and enjoyed a sleeping draft.
Even on check in at PVG with 2 hours to go and no seats showing available on the website, the check in girl still told me to hang around at the gate and wait for an announcement, because I might get an upgrade. I withdrew to the club and enjoyed a sleeping draft.
Also not sure it is helpful to hear that an UG won’t happen, only to find out that it does due to some unforeseen future event. No way they can know with certainty sometimes. And yes, I have also endured my share of flts to Asia sitting in the back. Welcome to the world of travel.
Jul 23, 2014, 5:59 am
#11
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Was this a thread to be taken seriously?
I would note that, for someone who seems to so clearly be important and better than things like not being borderline sexist in a public forum, it seems odd they couldn't buy a J ticket outright.
I would note that, for someone who seems to so clearly be important and better than things like not being borderline sexist in a public forum, it seems odd they couldn't buy a J ticket outright.
Jul 23, 2014, 8:51 am
#12
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Long Beach, CA
Programs: DL DM
Posts: 5,292
Sounds to me like revenue management did a stellar job then in not releasing the upgrade. Seeing as you would be near the top of the pecking order, it seems that DL sold those seats. Good for DL, bad for you, but remember, if it is THAT important to you, you probably should have bought it to begin with.
Jul 23, 2014, 9:57 am
#13
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2013
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Posts: 9
Oh, and I am married to a beautiful English girl, that a sexist comment too?
Jul 23, 2014, 11:15 am
#14
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2013
Programs: DM
Posts: 9
Most forums appear to have a self appointed arbiter of what they think is acceptable, and a willingness to jump on a poster for reasons of grammar, spacing, perceived sexist remarks etc. Are you that person on flyertalk?
Jul 23, 2014, 11:33 am
#15
Join Date: Sep 2013
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Thought Police on the Prowl
Unfortunately, the liberal thought police are far more intelligent and are given the special dispensation to judge others as they see fit. We neandertal, pre-hominid knuckledraggers just do not have the prescient insight of the enlightened.