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If mega ship like the Anthem sank during the recent incident, could USCG rescue them?

If mega ship like the Anthem sank during the recent incident, could USCG rescue them?

Old Feb 11, 2016, 2:56 pm
  #1  
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If mega ship like the Anthem sank during the recent incident, could USCG rescue them?

I've been trying to convince a couple of family members to go on a cruise for
the very first time. They don't like ships... not even little paddle boats in
amusement parks. It doesn't help that the Anthem incident is on all TV news
stations repeated in the last few days.

It does make me think... if a mega ship like Anthem sank last week, would the
USCG/Navy or other rescue ships or helicopters reach the passengers in those
monster waves? The Titanic struck an iceberg but remained in relatively
calm waters. The passengers were able to board lifeboats and be rescued by
other ships. (obviously their problem was not nearly enough lifeboats, but
that's not a problem these days)
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Old Feb 11, 2016, 4:28 pm
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Originally Posted by weltfrieden
They don't like ships... not even little paddle boats in amusement parks.
They would not like a cruise ship, then. Even if it was sailing on smooth-as-glass water.
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Old Feb 12, 2016, 5:24 am
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Originally Posted by weltfrieden
I've been trying to convince a couple of family members to go on a cruise for
the very first time. They don't like ships... not even little paddle boats in
amusement parks. It doesn't help that the Anthem incident is on all TV news
stations repeated in the last few days.

It does make me think... if a mega ship like Anthem sank last week, would the
USCG/Navy or other rescue ships or helicopters reach the passengers in those
monster waves? The Titanic struck an iceberg but remained in relatively
calm waters. The passengers were able to board lifeboats and be rescued by
other ships. (obviously their problem was not nearly enough lifeboats, but
that's not a problem these days)
The truth is that if the Anthem had broken up or capsized during that storm there would have been little the USCG/Navy could have done for several hours if not days. It's probably one of those cases that the cruise lines would rather not discuss a lot. The loss of life would have been substantial and maybe close to total. Like airlines cruise lines go back to the statistical passenger miles versus accidents comparisons to show it is a relatively and actually very safe way to travel or vacation. Obviously the potential exists for a travel disaster of significant proportion with cruise ships getting bigger and bigger.
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Old Feb 12, 2016, 5:30 am
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It would have taken a lot of helicopter trips to rescue 4500 people.
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Old Feb 12, 2016, 6:21 am
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Originally Posted by JumboJet
It would have taken a lot of helicopter trips to rescue 4500 people.
And that would be true even under the best conditions which obviously was not the case for several hours. I don't know the operating parameters of USCG/Navy rescue helicopters but I'd bet that it's marginal in 100+ MPH winds, 30+ foot seas, and at night. The few videos I've seen on TV and YouTube also makes me think launching lifeboats would have been virtually impossible. Like I said the potential for a monumental disaster was there.
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Old Feb 12, 2016, 8:26 am
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Originally Posted by Randyk47
And that would be true even under the best conditions which obviously was not the case for several hours. I don't know the operating parameters of USCG/Navy rescue helicopters but I'd bet that it's marginal in 100+ MPH winds, 30+ foot seas, and at night. The few videos I've seen on TV and YouTube also makes me think launching lifeboats would have been virtually impossible. Like I said the potential for a monumental disaster was there.
I haven't kept up with the news in a couple of days. Still don't know what
caused the RCCL crew to take the ship into those waves. Is modern weather
forecasting still that inaccurate?
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Old Feb 12, 2016, 9:02 am
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Originally Posted by weltfrieden
I haven't kept up with the news in a couple of days. Still don't know what
caused the RCCL crew to take the ship into those waves. Is modern weather
forecasting still that inaccurate?
Somebody, or maybe several somebodies, made the decision to sail. I think the storm was worse than forecast but a storm was forecast. I imagine it was a money decision as cruise ships make more money at sea than tied up to a dock. Personally I think they gambled and they lost. Let's face it this cruise probably cost RCCL millions of dollars in lost revenue and costs to repair the Anthem. Obviously the USGC is going over the ship carefully and it's still not known or at least being released exactly the extent of the damages. If they broke her back the Anthem could be in for anything from major repair to being scrapped.
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Old Feb 12, 2016, 9:41 am
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The waves aren't nearly the issue that the winds were IMHO. I've sailed through higher than 30 ft seas, most recently on a trans-Atlantic cruise. However, we did not have 120 mph+ winds to contend with. I'll anxiously await any information that becomes available as a result of any investigations into this by the authorities, which in this case is likely the Bahamian government assisted by the USCG.
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Old Feb 12, 2016, 11:07 am
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Originally Posted by Randyk47
If they broke her back the Anthem could be in for anything from major repair to being scrapped.
Eh, I don't know of any reason to suspect anything that major in the way of damage. If a ship that size could be damaged that badly by 30 foot seas, it shouldn't be sailing in the first place.

I do think they basically got caught off guard on how bad the storm was, and that it was more severe than they expected. But keep in mind, they sail these ships doing transatlantics through the north atlantic, and a number of ships do trips around cape horn. Both of these locations are known for having severe weather, and the ships can handle it. (Personally, on the cape horn trip I did, we had ridiculously calm weather, almost something of a let down when you hear about how bad it can be there. Captain said it was the best weather he'd had in 30 years of sailing that route). It's pretty easy to decide in hindsight that the weather was too bad to sail, but weather forecasts aren't exactly perfect, so I can understand them thinking they'd be ok. (And I can pretty much guarantee, the cruise line was screwed whether they left port or not, because if they hadn't, everyone would be griping about how the weather wasn't that bad and they should have sailed and they ruined the cruise. I've seen enough of that type of .....ing from people when a ship misses port and all the armchair sailors all think the captain made the wrong call because the weather looks fine to them.)

Now, as for the question about rescue? Personally, I'd guess if one of these ships ever really sank in a rapid fashion somewhere that's not easy to get to, it's going to be real ugly. I was always real surprised at just how little loss of life there was on the Concordia incident. I'd expect the Coast Guard would try up to the limits of what they could do and if they at all thought they could fly they would - look back at Sandy and them getting most of the crew of the Bounty rescued. But you're not going to helicopter rescue that many people, and getting enough ship based assets out there in that type of weather is not going to be quick.

I tend to think for myself that if I happen to be on a ship and something goes seriously wrong, there's going to be a good chance of not making it. Especially on routes where you may be a long ways from shore, and thus a long ways from anything that can come to assistance. It's just one of those risks you take, but in general, the safety record is pretty good. Outside the Concordia, it's been quite some time since one of the major lines has lost a ship (I know some smaller lines have had incidents, but even then, the track record is pretty good). And guess what, it's a pretty similar experience on an airline. If something real major goes wrong, there's a decent chance you're not going to make it - but again, in general, the safety record is pretty good.
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Old Feb 12, 2016, 11:12 am
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Heard on ABC World News Tonight (2/11/16), she will be heading out again this Saturday, so damage was minimal/cosmetic.
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Old Feb 12, 2016, 2:07 pm
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Looks like she burned out some components of her port azipod. They are being replaced, and they're replacing the clutches of the other as a precaution. Saturday's cruise is probably a go, but I'd stay tuned to RCL's website, and in touch with your travel agent if you use one.

Here's an interesting article from gCaptain that references the USCG's statement on Anthem.
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Old Feb 13, 2016, 8:51 am
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Kind of spooky to think or at least wonder how close the Anthem might have been to losing propulsion. The various, and granted maybe the uneducated/uninformed, live reports from the Anthem indicated the captain was working hard to keep the ship into the wind and the seas. The impression was they were barely making headway at times. Kudos to him for making the best out of a bad situation and potentially the maybe not so good decision to leave port in the first place. Anyhow, a bit sobering to think about how close this whole situation may have been to complete disaster.
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Old Feb 16, 2016, 4:05 am
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Large ships like Anthem that are designed expressly for cruises aren't built to the same specs as ships designed for transoceanic voyages (e.g. QM2), which can better tolerate big waves and high winds.

If it went down and weren't able to deploy lifeboats, there really isn't anything that USCG can do at all. Helicopters have limited range/loiter times, weather limitations, capacity issues, and winching up people one at a time in bad weather takes a really, really long time.

Last edited by Javelin; Feb 16, 2016 at 2:44 pm
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Old Feb 16, 2016, 6:41 am
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Originally Posted by Javelin
Large ships like Anthem that are designed expressly for cruises aren't built to the same specs as ships designed for transoceanic voyages (e.g. QM2), which can better tolerate big waves and high winds.

If it went down and weren't able to reply lifeboats, there really isn't anything that USCG can do at all. Helicopters have limited range/loiter times, weather limitations, capacity issues, and winching up people one at a time in bad weather takes a really, really long time.
How about Titanic 2, which is expected to go into service in 2018?
Perhaps they should build it to the same standard as icebreakers?
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Old Feb 16, 2016, 2:44 pm
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Originally Posted by weltfrieden
How about Titanic 2, which is expected to go into service in 2018?
Perhaps they should build it to the same standard as icebreakers?
^
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