Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC)
#16
Join Date: Feb 2001
Programs: IHG Diamond, HH Diamond, BW Diamond Select, Accor Silver, Marriott Gold
Posts: 4,228
Now AUS has other quirks like the allowance of merchants to charge a service fee (which I saw come up a number of times), and they are tap for *everything* including their stored value transit cards, amusement park tickets, hotels, passport e-gates, but I didn't have a good non-FTF tap card to use sadly.
#17
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,799
Now AUS has other quirks like the allowance of merchants to charge a service fee (which I saw come up a number of times), and they are tap for *everything* including their stored value transit cards, amusement park tickets, hotels, passport e-gates, but I didn't have a good non-FTF tap card to use sadly. I only saw *one* unattended kiosk the entire trip that only took tap (it was a vending machine in the airport bathroom). All other kiosks took at least chip as well.
Because I was a good person and used a MC card, I was asked if they could Paypass (tap) my card. Obviously, nothing happened so they had to insert. I had a PIN card if needed, but signature card worked everywhere.
Because I was a good person and used a MC card, I was asked if they could Paypass (tap) my card. Obviously, nothing happened so they had to insert. I had a PIN card if needed, but signature card worked everywhere.
#18
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 6,059
This experience generally accords with my visit down under last June/July. We were embarassed to bits by the number of times cashiers "plunk" our HKD cards against card terminals and us saying "err you're going to have to stick that into the terminal and have me sign for it".
#19
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
This experience generally accords with my visit down under last June/July. We were embarassed to bits by the number of times cashiers "plunk" our HKD cards against card terminals and us saying "err you're going to have to stick that into the terminal and have me sign for it".
#20
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,799
They didn't have overseas earn promos so we weren't carrying them in our travel wallets.
Actually the ones that had the overseas earn promos were in the process of being replaced but ours were still in the queue. On return to HK we promptly called the two banks and requested expedited replacement.
#21
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: SF
Programs: UA, VX, QF, EY, VA
Posts: 756
The only retailer that asked me about DCC in Australia was Uniqlo, last time I was there.
Amex acceptance is generally low. The places that charge CC surcharges also tend to charge more for Amex. In some cases there will be no surcharge for V/MC and a surcharge for Amex.
And yes, everyone taps. It's why the banks there just don't care about Apple Pay (not enough to give Apple a cut, anyway). The way they see it, they put in significant resources into contactless adoption (terminals, ads, etc) and Apple wants to piggyback off that and take their money because they're Apple.
Amex acceptance is generally low. The places that charge CC surcharges also tend to charge more for Amex. In some cases there will be no surcharge for V/MC and a surcharge for Amex.
And yes, everyone taps. It's why the banks there just don't care about Apple Pay (not enough to give Apple a cut, anyway). The way they see it, they put in significant resources into contactless adoption (terminals, ads, etc) and Apple wants to piggyback off that and take their money because they're Apple.
#22
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
And yes, everyone taps. It's why the banks there just don't care about Apple Pay (not enough to give Apple a cut, anyway). The way they see it, they put in significant resources into contactless adoption (terminals, ads, etc) and Apple wants to piggyback off that and take their money because they're Apple.
Of course, Apple has never agreed to such a thing and isn't about to start now.
#23
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: SF
Programs: UA, VX, QF, EY, VA
Posts: 756
There's also the part where the major Australian banks want the right to pass through to their customers whatever Apple charges them (so if Apple charges the bank 5c/transaction, the bank wants to charge the customer the 5c too). The bank's own app would likely be free to use as well as the physical contactless card.
Of course, Apple has never agreed to such a thing and isn't about to start now.
Of course, Apple has never agreed to such a thing and isn't about to start now.
#24
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 6,059
I believe use of contactless payments generally will remove the chance of DCC occurring. Does anyone know if the Pays do not support DCC at all?
#25
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,799
PayPal and Ebay have now stopped to worry about DCC (see https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/.../920926/page/8 ) . They are now charging people in their home currency without asking.
"Alsa still looks the same, but German PayPal states the HKD amount and no obvious way to change. I don't know whether clicking the amount works like Alsa clicking the exchange rate, but after I disabled DCC for my card permanently using the rate in post #1, I was charged in Euros."
#26
Join Date: Oct 2007
Programs: AA, WN, UA, Bonvoy, Hertz
Posts: 2,491
This is the merchant company that asked for AUD/USD choice for at least one of my transactions: https://www.tyro.com/
The terminal with the vertical chip insert is the Yomani box on this same page.
DCC is an option via Tyro as noted here: https://www.tyro.com/dynamic-currency-conversion-dcc/
They are not hiding the revenue enhancement fact with DCC.
Rasheed
#27
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 6,059
That is ridiculous that there is DCC at Marriott Sydney Harbour when you already pay an extra 2% just for using a credit card as payment. I strongly suggest going across the street to the ANZ bank and taking out the cash to make the payment (like I did). ANZ only charges 2 AUD as an ATM fee, and my bank reimburses that anyway. Even with having the MR Visa, I still was against paying the fee.
I am very familiar with that ANZ branch, and it's usually my first stop after checking into the hotel after walking from Circular Quay station. I don't know which other hotels levy a credit card surcharge, but it seems like it's becoming more of a problem in Australia.
Imagine a worse case where a naive traveler was using a 3% FTF card, was ignorant of DCC (3.8% in this case), and paid the 2% surcharge... 8.8% stupid tax for using a credit card for the hotel bill.
I'm trying to think of a practical way to pay the hotel room next time. I'm about 50/50 in terms of my stays there on points versus paid, but I think in the future I'll exclusively stay on points or do as you did and pay down the room in cash. Even with the SPG AmEx at 6x, it's unlikely to be worth it.
#28
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,799
For me the math is worse (yes Majuki you don't need to point I have Aus savings and credit card accounts; I'm hypothesising the situation where the AUD is low and I do not wish to utilise those savings).
My wife can draw cash with Unionpay, which is 0.42% over the Visa rate
Add the $2 per $1,000 for 0.62% net cost
Alternatively I can card my HKD cards
Unionpay: 0.42% + 2% surcharge - ~1.3% in miles = 1.12% net cost
Visa: 1.85% FTF + 2% surcharge - ~2.07% in miles = 1.78% net cost
(I'm roughly earning 1.3 miles per $ on Unionpay foreign spending, 2.07 per $ on Visa foreign spending, and I'm using 1cpm for valuation)
My wife can draw cash with Unionpay, which is 0.42% over the Visa rate
Add the $2 per $1,000 for 0.62% net cost
Alternatively I can card my HKD cards
Unionpay: 0.42% + 2% surcharge - ~1.3% in miles = 1.12% net cost
Visa: 1.85% FTF + 2% surcharge - ~2.07% in miles = 1.78% net cost
(I'm roughly earning 1.3 miles per $ on Unionpay foreign spending, 2.07 per $ on Visa foreign spending, and I'm using 1cpm for valuation)
#29
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 5
I was asked but some years ago in a hotel with a similar terminal/PIN pad combination DCC was applied hidden behind the reception desk. Suddenly the lady did not speak English or German anymore.
#30
Join Date: Aug 2008
Programs: HHonors Gold, Marriott Lifetime Gold, IHG Gold, OZ*G, AA Gold, AS MVP
Posts: 1,874
If anyone's still curious about China, here's one more case I bumped into at a Mexican restaurant in Shanghai some time back:
Terminal doesn't obviously indicate a bank on the main screen, just the words "外卡支付". No apparent way to opt out in the beginning, and it does the checkbox thing (it also shows at the bottom that the bank doing the DCC-ing is called "Nanyue Bank" and indicates a mark-up of 3.8%). The cashier has to reconcile it afterwards, but the way to do so isn't immediately obvious; it's a separate process. You have to press 1 to get into the menu, find "DCC退出", then it asks for the trace number on the card slip. Then it runs the transaction again with only local currency displayed, and the slip shows the transaction type as "DCC VOID".
Terminal doesn't obviously indicate a bank on the main screen, just the words "外卡支付". No apparent way to opt out in the beginning, and it does the checkbox thing (it also shows at the bottom that the bank doing the DCC-ing is called "Nanyue Bank" and indicates a mark-up of 3.8%). The cashier has to reconcile it afterwards, but the way to do so isn't immediately obvious; it's a separate process. You have to press 1 to get into the menu, find "DCC退出", then it asks for the trace number on the card slip. Then it runs the transaction again with only local currency displayed, and the slip shows the transaction type as "DCC VOID".