London is weird on Chip & Signature credit cards
Oct 29, 2014, 9:30 am
#1
Used to be 'flymanbeast'
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2011
Programs: Delta silver/marriot platinum
Posts: 2,795
London is weird on Chip & Signature credit cards
Once or twice I went to places with my Sig based credit card chip it went thru and then they freaked out because of the signature and canceled the transaction how crazy is that?
Oct 29, 2014, 9:57 am
#2
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,537
Not at all unheard of sadly, just walk out. DO NOT give merchants like that cash, DO post negative reviews online, DO complain to your card issuer.
Oct 29, 2014, 10:43 am
#3
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,293
Sadly not that uncommon, but in Britain less so (in my personal experience).
Why did they run it through if they were going to cancel the transaction if it was approved?
I sorta don't get how all these countries with chip cards can be so forgetful about how things "used to" work. It wasn't that long ago that their cards didn't have chips. I usually just explain US cards usually don't have chips and just to swipe the card.
Why did they run it through if they were going to cancel the transaction if it was approved?
I sorta don't get how all these countries with chip cards can be so forgetful about how things "used to" work. It wasn't that long ago that their cards didn't have chips. I usually just explain US cards usually don't have chips and just to swipe the card.
Oct 29, 2014, 10:49 am
#4
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,952
A merchant cannot visually distinguish a Chip & Signature card from a Chip & PIN card. The reaction is partly based on unfamiliarity, and partly on risk (or perceived risk.) Generalization: in the UK merchants are not responsible for fraud if a card is inserted into a chip reader and verified by PIN. They are responsible if the card is swiped and verified by Signature. I don't know who is responsible for Chip & Signature fraud, but if such transactions are rare the merchant may assume that the swipe rules apply.
Oct 29, 2014, 12:31 pm
#6
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,537
A merchant cannot visually distinguish a Chip & Signature card from a Chip & PIN card. The reaction is partly based on unfamiliarity, and partly on risk (or perceived risk.) Generalization: in the UK merchants are not responsible for fraud if a card is inserted into a chip reader and verified by PIN. They are responsible if the card is swiped and verified by Signature. I don't know who is responsible for Chip & Signature fraud, but if such transactions are rare the merchant may assume that the swipe rules apply.
Oct 29, 2014, 12:33 pm
#7
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,952
Magnetic stripe
There are still a small number of UK issued cards in circulation that are not chip & PIN enabled and have only a magnetic stripe; you should deal with these in the same way as for any foreign-issued cards that don't have a chip. To process a transaction using this type of card, you will need to swipe your customer's card through the terminal and follow the instructions provided to complete the transaction. As part of the process, you’ll require the cardholder to provide a signature on the terminal receipt to authorise the transaction. In the case of a fraudulent transaction – for example, a forged signature - different chargeback rights exist for this transaction type compared to that for a chip & PIN transaction.
There are still a small number of UK issued cards in circulation that are not chip & PIN enabled and have only a magnetic stripe; you should deal with these in the same way as for any foreign-issued cards that don't have a chip. To process a transaction using this type of card, you will need to swipe your customer's card through the terminal and follow the instructions provided to complete the transaction. As part of the process, you’ll require the cardholder to provide a signature on the terminal receipt to authorise the transaction. In the case of a fraudulent transaction – for example, a forged signature - different chargeback rights exist for this transaction type compared to that for a chip & PIN transaction.
Oct 29, 2014, 7:08 pm
#8
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: East Coast
Programs: SPG 75 Plat, Hyatt Diamond, Delta PM, AA EXP
Posts: 111
In my experience in London I've never encountered an issue with having a chip and sig card. Even with my penfed chip + pin it wouldn't even ask for a pin in most places.
I assume most merchants expect the signature slip based on my American accent.
Even when they don't, they are used enough to printing out the receipt for a signature I assume it's relatively routine.
I assume most merchants expect the signature slip based on my American accent.
Even when they don't, they are used enough to printing out the receipt for a signature I assume it's relatively routine.
Oct 29, 2014, 7:33 pm
#9
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,537
Oct 30, 2014, 9:49 am
#11
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: ELP
Programs: AAdvantage, Amex MR
Posts: 2,314
I will be in London in two weeks with my Barclay card arrival. From what I understand from reading up here and elsewhere is the chip and pin of the Arrival only works if the signature fails, such as at an unmanned train kiosk, but at restaurants and stores and the like it will default to chip and sig which is disappointing.
So I figure just so the merchant doesnt freak out just tell them before they run the card that it is chip and sig, and to expect a recept with a signature line to come out so there is no confusion, and bring my passport with me so they can check the signature there and on the back of the card as well and I figure I should be good.
So I figure just so the merchant doesnt freak out just tell them before they run the card that it is chip and sig, and to expect a recept with a signature line to come out so there is no confusion, and bring my passport with me so they can check the signature there and on the back of the card as well and I figure I should be good.
Oct 30, 2014, 9:56 am
#12
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 401
Sadly not that uncommon, but in Britain less so (in my personal experience).
Why did they run it through if they were going to cancel the transaction if it was approved?
I sorta don't get how all these countries with chip cards can be so forgetful about how things "used to" work. It wasn't that long ago that their cards didn't have chips. I usually just explain US cards usually don't have chips and just to swipe the card.
Why did they run it through if they were going to cancel the transaction if it was approved?
I sorta don't get how all these countries with chip cards can be so forgetful about how things "used to" work. It wasn't that long ago that their cards didn't have chips. I usually just explain US cards usually don't have chips and just to swipe the card.
The OP is describing experiences with a Chip and Signature card, not a magnetic stripe card. A properly configured terminal will not allow swipes of magnetic stripe when the card has a Chip.
In Europe, most cards are issued with a Chip and PIN. Most of the Chip cards issued in the USA to date are Chip and Signature, or Chip and Signature priority with a Chip and PIN backup for unstaffed kiosks. You (nor the merchant) cannot tell what mode the card supports just by looking at the card, the chips look the same.
Some merchants (especially in UK) believe that they will be liable to fraud for a Chip transaction processed without a PIN and there is some history to why they believe this is so. However, even in UK banks will issue Chip and Signature cards for accessibility/handicapped reasons and merchants should be accepting them. But the OP's experience is not atypical with some merchants in Europe.
Oct 30, 2014, 12:49 pm
#13
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: DFW,OVB (Russia)
Programs: AA HH Gold SPG Gold BA
Posts: 1,823
DanPeake,
The OP is describing experiences with a Chip and Signature card, not a magnetic stripe card. A properly configured terminal will not allow swipes of magnetic stripe when the card has a Chip.
In Europe, most cards are issued with a Chip and PIN. Most of the Chip cards issued in the USA to date are Chip and Signature, or Chip and Signature priority with a Chip and PIN backup for unstaffed kiosks. You (nor the merchant) cannot tell what mode the card supports just by looking at the card, the chips look the same.
Some merchants (especially in UK) believe that they will be liable to fraud for a Chip transaction processed without a PIN and there is some history to why they believe this is so. However, even in UK banks will issue Chip and Signature cards for accessibility/handicapped reasons and merchants should be accepting them. But the OP's experience is not atypical with some merchants in Europe.
The OP is describing experiences with a Chip and Signature card, not a magnetic stripe card. A properly configured terminal will not allow swipes of magnetic stripe when the card has a Chip.
In Europe, most cards are issued with a Chip and PIN. Most of the Chip cards issued in the USA to date are Chip and Signature, or Chip and Signature priority with a Chip and PIN backup for unstaffed kiosks. You (nor the merchant) cannot tell what mode the card supports just by looking at the card, the chips look the same.
Some merchants (especially in UK) believe that they will be liable to fraud for a Chip transaction processed without a PIN and there is some history to why they believe this is so. However, even in UK banks will issue Chip and Signature cards for accessibility/handicapped reasons and merchants should be accepting them. But the OP's experience is not atypical with some merchants in Europe.
on a sidenote,
What is their reasoning for providing Chip and Sig card for people with disabilities ? As someone who is wheelchair bound myself, I can tell you from personal experience that pins would be WAY Easier.
For example, I cannot write, but I can type a pin
Oct 30, 2014, 12:57 pm
#14
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,952
Chip & Signature cards are available to individuals with specific disabilities which prevent them from memorizing or entering a PIN. They are not provided to everyone with any type of disability, nor to anyone unless requested.
Oct 30, 2014, 1:02 pm
#15
Used to be 'flymanbeast'
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2011
Programs: Delta silver/marriot platinum
Posts: 2,795
I called this guy an idiot because he told me to make it go with the pin and not the Sig then he told me to leave what an .... I have complained to his boss if i was not leaving in a few days btw this was in a supermarket and for 3.5 pounds so nothing too serious .