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Citi ThankYou points - cancel, downgrade & expiration considerations (2012 - 2023)

Old May 29, 2013, 3:40 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: rrgg
When do my Thank You points expire?

It depends.

It's important to understand that if you have multiple Citi cards ("sponsor accounts") generating points into a single TY account, those pooled points may have different expiration dates based upon the rules of the corresponding sponsor account. Points from some sponsor accounts never expire as long as the sponsor account is open, while others have an expiration date based on the date of earning. (For a comprehensive list of expiration rules, see the TYP T&C.)

To complicate matters further, points-earning activity from a sponsor account will often extend the validity of older points from that same sponsor account.

What happens when I cancel a credit card from which I have earned TY points?

Points previously earned from that sponsor account will expire after 60 days.


What happens when I downgrade a Prestige card or Premier card from which I've earned TY points?

A product change from one ThankYou earning card to another ThankYou earning card should keep the points from expiring.


What are the rules for sharing points from my account to another TY account?

If you share points with (that is, make an internal TY transfer to) another TY account, those points will expire 90 days after the transfer. Note that
  • this is true regardless of whether you share to another TY user or to another TY account you hold (if you have multiple TY accounts);
  • you may not share points that are expiring in less than 90 days; and
  • you may not share more than 100K points (or receive more than 100K shared TY points) in any calendar year.

For details, see ThankYou Point Sharing capped at 100,000 points per calendar year


When I redeem points (for travel, gift cards, etc.), which ones does Citi use up first?


Citi will use the points with the soonest expiration date, which may or may not be points from a canceled sponsor account.


How can I see my expiring points?


Follow these steps:
  1. Log into your Thank You account (either directly or via citicards.com)
  2. From the My Account menu (top right of screen), select either "My Account Overview" or "My Points Summary"
  3. Look for a statement near the top of the screen such as "You do not have any points expiring within the next 60 days or less"
  4. Select "View all expiring points"
  5. Alternate: If logged in, you should be able to see the list at:https://www.thankyou.com/accountStatementExpiry.jspx
Note: The totals displayed will not include points expiring within 60 days as a result of closing a sponsor account. SOURCE


Why do I see a warning that points expire in 7 days after converting from Citi Preferred to Citi Rewards+?


Citi acknowledges this message can appear in error after converting from one ThankYou credit card to another type of ThankYou credit card. If your points actually expired they will adjust the point balance upon request. In at least one case, the expiration never occurred despite the message.

If you converted a ThankYou credit card to a non-ThankYou credit card, that may be a different issue, and it's possible points really will expire by the stated deadline.
The info about 24-month clocks vs product changes came from these web pages:

https://www.doctorofcredit.com/produ...w-card-number/

https://thepointsguy.com/2017/07/pro...24-month-rule/




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Citi ThankYou points - cancel, downgrade & expiration considerations (2012 - 2023)

Old Jul 11, 2012, 10:05 am
  #31  
 
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Thank you kind Sir
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Old Jul 11, 2012, 3:05 pm
  #32  
 
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Originally Posted by beltway
Specifically, while logged into your TYP account,
  • click on your "available points" total at the top of the home page
  • click on "expiring" (on the right-hand side)
  • click "show all"
Or just go to https://www.thankyou.com/accountStatementExpiry.jspx
When I go there I find only "Expiring (within 90 days): 0 Pts". Is there some way to find out exactly when my points will expire? (I've emailed ThankYou/CITI about this, but they have not answered.)
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Old Jul 11, 2012, 3:19 pm
  #33  
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Originally Posted by beltway
Specifically, while logged into your TYP account,
  • click on your "available points" total at the top of the home page
  • click on "expiring" (on the right-hand side)
  • click "show all"
Or just go to https://www.thankyou.com/accountStatementExpiry.jspx
Originally Posted by muji
When I go there I find only "Expiring (within 90 days): 0 Pts". Is there some way to find out exactly when my points will expire? (I've emailed ThankYou/CITI about this, but they have not answered.)
Did you click "show all"?
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Old Jul 11, 2012, 3:46 pm
  #34  
 
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Originally Posted by beltway
click on your "available points" total at the top of the home page; click on "expiring" (on the right-hand side);click "show all"
Originally Posted by beltway
Did you click "show all"?
Yes. After clicking on "expiring" I get two options: "sponsor account" (and I selected "all sponsor accounts") and "Points expiring (within 90 days) show all" - which then brings up "expiration date: N/A; points: 52,000".
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Old Jul 11, 2012, 4:01 pm
  #35  
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Originally Posted by muji
Yes. After clicking on "expiring" I get two options: "sponsor account" (and I selected "all sponsor accounts") and "Points expiring (within 90 days) show all" - which then brings up "expiration date: N/A; points: 52,000".
That's a good answer to get. What's the problem with having 52,000 non-expiring points?
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Old Jul 11, 2012, 7:12 pm
  #36  
 
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Originally Posted by beltway
That's a good answer to get. What's the problem with having 52,000 non-expiring points?
I agree. But I understood N/A to mean "not available (to show you at this time)" instead of "not applicable" (which would, of course, be nice). Anyway, I'll simply call them to get the exact expiration date.
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Old Jul 11, 2012, 7:48 pm
  #37  
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Originally Posted by muji
I agree. But I understood N/A to mean "not available (to show you at this time)" instead of "not applicable" (which would, of course, be nice). Anyway, I'll simply call them to get the exact expiration date.
N/A means Not Applicable - because those points do not expire, therefore it is Not Applicable when it comes to expiration date.

All TYPs are available as long as they are transferred into your account. There is no such thing of Not Available as they are not subject to any kind of hold.
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Old Jul 11, 2012, 8:36 pm
  #38  
 
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Originally Posted by Happy
N/A means Not Applicable - because those points do not expire, therefore it is Not Applicable when it comes to expiration date. All TYPs are available as long as they are transferred into your account.
Thank you Happy and beltway. The ThankYou terms state "If your participating Sponsor Account is closed, you ...may lose the ThankYou Points that you earned through that Sponsor...If all your Sponsor Accounts are closed, we may close your ThankYou Member Account". My sponsor account is the CITI ThankYou card. I thought that once I close that credit card account (which I plan to do just prior to renewal time next year) I would lose my ThankYou points. (That's why I was planning to use the points in some way before closing my CITI credit card account next year.) It sounds, however, like you are saying I can in fact close my CITI credit card account and my ThankYou points will remain safe in my ThankYou account (i.e., the points will not expire)?
see post 64 here: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/credi...t-state-5.html
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Old Jul 11, 2012, 8:48 pm
  #39  
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Originally Posted by muji
I thought that once I close that credit card account (which I plan to do just prior to renewal time next year) I would lose my ThankYou points. (That's why I was planning to use the points in some way before closing my CITI credit card account next year.) It sounds, however, like you are saying I can in fact close my CITI credit card account and my ThankYou points will remain safe in my ThankYou account (i.e., the points will not expire)
Two different issues are involved:
  • Inherent point expiration: Some points have built-in expiration dates under the terms of the "sponsor account" (card) that earned them, and can expire even if you continue to hold the card. (For a no-fee card like the Citi Forward card, expiration might be a threat if you don't bother using the card for 3 years running.)
  • Card account closure: if you close a "sponsor account," your points suddenly have a very near-term expiration date, regardless of whether they were previously non-expiring.
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Old Jul 11, 2012, 10:48 pm
  #40  
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30 days to use up the points associated with a closed Sponsor Account

Actually Citi is pretty lenient in that it gives you 30 days to use up the TYPs associated with a closed Sponsor Account.

And yes, as beltway points out, when you close a Sponsor Account, the TYPs from that account suddenly become expiring in 30 days regardless what they used to be.
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 6:43 am
  #41  
 
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I have 4 Citi Thank You sponsor accounts. One each for my wife's checking accounts and one each for my Thank You and my wife's Thank you credit card. For various reasons I merged my and wife's accounts a few years ago.

The points earned on all of the above have no expiration. If I close any but not all of the sponsor accounts the previously unused points associated with that sponsor account will expire within 30 days unless used within that period.

The checking accounts go back many years, the credit cards were opened for the bonuses.

Citi "stacks" (their terminology not mine) the points in chronological order, first in first out. Their computer system is able to track your usage across multiple sponsor accounts. However, their CS representatives claim that they cannot provide an individual with such an analysis.

I cannot provide any input as to whether expiring miles will be used first (as when you cancel one of the sponsor accounts).

Last edited by kayjay; Jul 12, 2012 at 6:45 am Reason: change expiry date
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 9:18 am
  #42  
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Originally Posted by kayjay
I have 4 Citi Thank You sponsor accounts. One each for my wife's checking accounts and one each for my Thank You and my wife's Thank you credit card. For various reasons I merged my and wife's accounts a few years ago.

The points earned on all of the above have no expiration. If I close any but not all of the sponsor accounts the previously unused points associated with that sponsor account will expire within 30 days unless used within that period.

The checking accounts go back many years, the credit cards were opened for the bonuses.

Citi "stacks" (their terminology not mine) the points in chronological order, first in first out. Their computer system is able to track your usage across multiple sponsor accounts. However, their CS representatives claim that they cannot provide an individual with such an analysis.

I cannot provide any input as to whether expiring miles will be used first (as when you cancel one of the sponsor accounts).
By default they would. because once the sponsor account is closed, the associated points expire in 30 days. In most cases, that would be the most close expiration dates.

I have multiple years of expiration dates in my TYP accout because some cards are really old, points earned long before they change to N/A. Every redemption would take out the layers of the points that would expire the soonest, regardless when they are earned. (some points at the time have 5 years life, some have only 3).

Now in the new scheme of N/A, I suspect the True FIFO would be in place - the points earned the earliest got redeemed first as you described.

I have 165K from PPE before the conversion that would expire 4/30/2013. I have no idea what would be the best way to empty it. I think I need to study Marriott's LNF program and if LNF rate can be paid by Marriott Travel Card, that would be the way to redeem. (Yeah I know booking flights yields the best value... only that I dont have a slightest idea when / where to fly to.)
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Old Jul 13, 2012, 5:32 pm
  #43  
 
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Sorting Out Citi ThankYou point expiration

Originally Posted by kayjay
Citi "stacks" (their terminology not mine) the points in chronological order, first in first out. Their computer system is able to track your usage across multiple sponsor accounts. However, their CS representatives claim that they cannot provide an individual with such an analysis.
You can provide your own analysis.

1. log into your ThankYou account

2. click on My Account > Point Summary

3. click on the Expiring link to the right of your total available points

4. click on the Show All link to the right of the 'Points Expiring' section

At this point you can now see each date of expiry in the series of your ThankYou points however you cannot see if the sponsor or if multiple sponsors share the same expiry date, so...

5. expand all the little orange + signs to see the sponsor(s) on that expiry date

Now at this point Citi should have sorted them for you but they didn't so you're going to have to sort them yourself. I got weirdness copying them into eXcel (mac) but found that they copied quite nicely into Word (mac) as a table and could then be sorted. The A>Z sort put the NA expiries on top but other than that they were now sorted in the order in which they will expire. This is also the FIFO (first in, first out) order that Citi will use them.

See the next post for a special consideration when closing a sponsor in a ThankYou account with combined sponsor accounts.

Last edited by CVG_Kid; Jul 13, 2012 at 5:56 pm
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Old Jul 13, 2012, 5:53 pm
  #44  
 
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Special Account Closure Considerations for Combined ThankYou Sponsors

Originally Posted by Happy
By default they would. because once the sponsor account is closed, the associated points expire in 30 days. In most cases, that would be the most close expiration dates.
Happy's assumption is natural but that is not how it works at Citi. Account closure does not change the expiration of ThankYou points. You lose them, or forfeit them, after 30 days. Citi's T&C and Help pages specifically do not refer to this as expiration (or forfeiture) but simply say you'll lose them. There's a probable reason for that: they don't change their expiration date, they just go away.

<No Longer Valid>
Normally, this doesn't matter UNLESS you have combined your accounts. If you have combined your accounts, the fact that the expiration date DOES NOT CHANGE for closed sponsor accounts to close date + 30 means that their original expiration remains the same after close. The implication is that if you have 'stacked' expirations that kayjay refers to, you must use all the points up to the oldest expiring date of the sponsor you're closing in order not to lose any points as the result of your closure.

I know that's a lot. I know it may not be readily accepted until a few try it and post testimonials, but that's how it works. You can verify it after closure by reviewing your expiration dates at ThankYou.com as well as referring to the T&C and Help pages.

I also recognize this is a little muddy so let me give an example:

Kayjay has three sponsors (A,B,C) combined in one ThankYou account with the following point expirations:

12-31-12 1000 typ Sponsor A
2-28-13 1000 typ Sponsor B

4-30-13 1000 typ Sponsor C

If Kayjay chooses to close Sponsor B, he must use 2000 ThankYou points within 30 days of closure in order not to lose any points.

The FIFO rule means that Sponsor A will be used first. Sponsor B's expiration does NOT change, therefore he must use 2000 NOT 1000 in order not to lose points.

Should Kayjay take no action in 30 days, he will lose 1000 points from Sponsor B.


</No Longer Valid>

Last edited by CVG_Kid; Jul 24, 2012 at 9:35 pm
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Old Jul 14, 2012, 12:50 am
  #45  
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Oh I know that, it is not just for the combined accounts

I mean not the combined accounts from both husband and wife.

Exactly as CVG_kid explained, I am "forced" to keep a Dividend turned TYP card forever because it is a conversion from the old AMEX something that earned 5 pts on everything the first year? and the earning has 5 years life... Those points now are the ones that have the longest expiration date in 2015. The total is less than 10K. But I would have to use up ALL of my other TYPs (208K) before I would get to this last 10K, if I close that particular Sponsor Account. This is absolutely very annoying, because that card now has no purpose of existing with only 1% earning, but carries a reasonably good credit line which I could not move to other card each time I asked Citi I was fed the BS of "due to new regulation"... I understand you could keep going up the chain but when they finally agree move, they would make a hard pull - that is a hard pull for nothing!
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