kebosabi

Google Wallet is a software that supports NFC, your Japanese Android phone hardware only supports Felica. This is like trying to pop in a Blu-ray disc (software) into a old DVD player (hardware); the old DVD player is not going to read the newer Blu-ray disc. Put it another way, it's like trying to play a PS3 game into a PS2 console; it's not going to work.

What you need is an Android phone that supports NFC. When that comes out (it's pretty much just around the corner, 1st or 2nd quarter 2012) then stuff like adding your Suica/PASMO card (Felica), Oyster Card (MIFARE) as well as Google Wallet (NFC) becomes possible through apps; albeit there probably will be a bunch of initial bug reports though. This is akin to Blu-ray players (hardware) having backward compatibility to play DVDs, VCDs, and CDs (softwares). Using the PS analogy, the PS3 can handle PS1 & PS2 games as well as PS3 games.


Market size. Hong Kong and Singapore is a much smaller country with a fewer population than Japan. Japan OTOH, while normally viewed as a smaller country respective to the US, it's land area is a bit bigger than the State of California with a population 1/3 of the US. By world standards, Japan is a fairly medium sized country, ranking 62nd in land size a tad smaller than Zimbabwe and a bit bigger than Germany.

Naturally, it's more of a pain in the butt for VISA to push VISA payWave in Japan when the Felica standard is so established across its nation with multitude of merchants compared to dealing with smaller number of merchants and size of HK and Singapore. HK and Singapore is what, about the size of a single metropolitan statistical area of the US?

jamar

An oddity I've discovered while using my Canadian Chip+PIN debit card in China: a signature is required on top ofthe PIN. So just like a local card, it's Chip+PIN+Signature. I remember someone complaining that switching to Chip+PIN would take away the "legal protection" provided by the old signature system, so why not require both like China does?

percysmith

Cos it's only good for the cardholder. Not for the bank, and not for the merchant.

kebosabi

Mastercard joins VISA on EMV push for the US

Similar as VISA, MC will offer merchant incentives as audit relief if they upgrade their terminals by Oct 2013, and shift reliability to merchants on Oct 2015 if they stick using to the old mag-stripe.

That's 2 out of 3 major networks in the US, only left is AMEX. No one cares about Discover; it's useless both here and abroad anyway.

sdsearch

Anyone who has a Diners Club card issued anywhere else other than US/Canada cards. Discover bought the Diners Club network a couple years back. So even though Discover branded cards may not be used much overseas perhaps, Discover networks are used by more oversears visitors than you might think (if you didn't know about the Discover-DC link).

(Discover has no relevance, however, to the US/Canadian Diners Club cards that are administered now by BOM/Harris. Those run on the MC network worldwide.)

jamar

The Discover network is going to be more useful in the future as it builds more agreements with local networks overseas (for example, its superior acceptance rate in China thanks to its UnionPay agreement). And as its partners switch to chip technology I see it switching too)

kebosabi

Good point; forgot all about that Discover owns the Diners Club network. Plus the bilateral acceptance of China's Union Pay and Japan's JCB networks as well.

kebosabi

Highlighting another reason why the US needs to start ditching the mag-stripe:

6 charged in credit card skim scheme at Wrigley Field

koconut

Hello,
I'm from germany but I've lived in the US.
i dont understand why they are trying to change everything.
Ive experienced that chip transactions are way slower than magstripe transactions. i really don't understand why a so called "new" or "better" technology is slower than a very "old" technology.
i still have a non chip german issued visa card and some other emv cards.
everytime i use the non chip visa its way faster. chip transactions always take longer ... i really don't understand that.
here in germany most of the cards issued are chip and signature cards.
I'm working part time at a gas stations which means I'm processing cards every day. at our place we actually process 90 % of the german debit cards with magstripe / signature only about 5 % to 10 % are pin based debit card transactions. ( a lot of them btw even Magstripe and Pin transactions.
We still have a lot of people paying with non chip credit cards. They are processed so fast. chip cards take about 5 times longer.
Due to the fact that were using readers that read the magstripe and the chip at the same time i can choose to use the chip or the magstripe of a CC. i often choose to use the magstripe instead of the chip because its just faster and i don't want too many ppl waiting in the line...
well idk

mia

Welcome to Flyertalk, and thank you for an informative first post. Are most cards in Germany issued by a few nationwide banks or by smaller banks? Do most people obtain their card from the same bank where they deposit money?

koconut

We also accept those fuel company cards like ROUTEX.
they are all based on magstripe technology. I've seen a few with a chip. but our reader only reads the magstripe.
so the chip is probably not in use yet on those cards.( 99 % don't have one )

koconut

Thank you for you're welcoming.
We have a lot of different Banks. But most of the Banks are nationwide.
All Banks issue the GIROCARD ( plus MAESTRO or V-PAY ). ( the debit card)
The GIROCARD System is used for Magstripe signature and pin transaction. The chip is used for giro( in germany ) chip pin based and maestro or v-pay( out of germany )chip Pin based transactions.

A few online banks offer the giro card ( plus maestro or v-pay ) and a VISA debit card comes with it. You must take both, but both are free.


You can get credit cards from all banks. As far as i know only very few banks issue chip and PIN credit cards.
Only the DEUTSCHE KREDIT BANK and AMEX GERMANY have totally switched to chip and pin.
All other BANK ISSUED credit cards. Like Deutsche Bank Credit cards, UniCredit Bank Credit Cards, Sparkassen/Volksbanken Credit Cards ( very common because widely spread ), even barclaycard only issue chip and signature cards.
The Deutsche Bahn Credit card ( germanys train company ) doesn't even issue a pin at all. You would have to pay for it.
At the gas station I'm working at more than 90 % of all transactions are signature based ( it belongs to the BP chain ).

A few weeks ago a new lufthansa miles and more master card was sent to me. They told me they sent me a new one because there had been suspicious requests.
Well, this card is supposed to only issued as a chip and pin card since the end of 2011. On the letter it said it was a chip and pin card. They sent the pin to me in a separate mail. Anyways even it was supposed to be a chip and pin card I'm never asked for a pin. They definitely made a mistake. But i don't know how its possible that they tell me this is a chip and pin card even tho its not.

kebosabi

Interesting read Big-Box Retailers Like Wal-Mart Remain Wary of Network EMV Plans

It seems Wal-Mart is taking the stance similar to how much we complain how issuers are choosing Chip-and-Signature over Chip-and-PIN.


I can more say that I agree with Wal-Mart.

Signature is faster, but IMO, signature authentication is a vestigial remnant from the days when graphology was considered solid science.

Besides, no one really checks the signature on the back of the card used these days anyway. Most likely, people haven't even signed them at all either. When was the last time that the front line employee at Taco Bell who swipes your card for that 7 layer burrito even checked for your signature, let alone even asked you for it?

Practically any thief can just make a fake signature and chances high that minimum wage earning cashiers who are evaluated by how many transactions they can run through in an hour won't even check the signature on the back of the card.

Signature authentication has no place in the digital world.

reft

I get the impression for transaction speed, that some retailers have forgone even the signature for certain transaction amounts and just depend on the [mag] swipe. $50 seems to ring a bell, and not all retailers.

The card holder may be concerned here, since a test transaction can occur at Taco Bell to see if a card still works, before they get slammed for some heavy fraudulent charges. Taco Bell might be out $7, and the card holder is protected after $50. So systemically, the lack of extra authentication may be a bad idea, but, Taco Bell probably makes more money by shaving seconds off the transaction at lunch hour, as compared to probability_of_fraud%*$7, and other than losing the privilege of taking cards, Taco Bell is only concerned about Taco Bell and not the overall security of the credit card industry. (Not picking on them -- you can insert the business name of your choice here.)

On the other side, Sears and Staples (and perhaps others) take the CVV when you pay with AMEX in person. Amazon doesn't for a VS, for a cardholder not present, even online. Go figure.

JEFFJAGUAR

The USPS around my parts do not require a signature under $25 but do ask for the card and enter the ccv value after I swipe it in the pos terminal.

One of the grocery chains here, Waldbaum's, does not ask for signature for purchases under $50. Of course metrocard vendin machines in the NYC subways sometimes ask for zip codes when purchasing transit fares as do some self service gasoline stations. Interestingly enough, Wal-mart asks for zip codes on Amex charges but not visa or mc or discover. Almost everywhere I go in the USA uses now pos terminals where you swipe the card yurself and checking of signatures is very variable.

Interestingly enough, in the UK some of the fast food places like Mickey D do not ask for signatures. But in places where they ask for signatures namely almost everywhere, the clerks always make a pretense of checking the signature panel. I derliberately sign the sales slip somewhat differently than the signature on the signature panel to see if they really check and of course they don't (after a few runs through a pos terminal anyway the signature panel begins to wear through and in some places in the UK, they insist they have to stick the card in the chip reader and then swipe it even though they can plainly see there is no chip. That simply accelerates the disintergration of the signature panel and the word void starts to show through.

Of course the other move some carry out here is write see ID on their signature panels. What they don't realize is that invalidates the card as you are required to sign it. And this question of ID does bug me. MC/Visa regs say a merchant can ask for id but cannot refuse to complete a sale for failure to produce id provided the signature on the sales slip matches the signature on the signature panel.

I have had hassles at this one grocery store in particular whichh despite the fact I have shown them the approrpiate language in the merchant's agreement still insists on asking for ID. So I show them my metrocard (I'm over 65 and have a reduced fare NYC metrocard with my picture and name on it but no other identifying number except the metrocard number. I doubt that an identity thief can do much with that number. At first they wouldn't take that as valid ID. It has to be government issued ID the manager tells me. But the MTA is a government agency. They now accept it but no matter, I've reported them three times oon the mastercard merchant violation form and still nothing has happened. We'll see.

That only leaves restaurants for the most part and I will simply not allow a waiter to take my credit card to some other room. I insist on being allowed to follow him or her to the cashier or whatever secret place they use to swipe cards (and steal information from them; much of this does come out of restaurants). I think all restaurants in the USA should be mandated to use the portable terminals they use in Europe and bring them to the table.