RLG

I agree.

I suspect the problem is that Charge"Smart"'s historical customer base is deadbeats who are delaying the inevitable foreclosure/repo by a few months rather than milehounds like us. The deadbeats a) aren't fee sensitive, and b) probably chargeback a lot.

RLG

Apparently Amex and other credit card companies found certain customer patterns to be strong predictors of default. However, they took a lot of heat for the practice and appear to have discontinued it.

I'm not sure if any credit card companies are still profiling customers based on where they shop.

If so, I suspect that using ChargeSmart will quickly result in big cuts to or cancellation of your credit lines.

ChargeSmartPhilip

The overwhelming majority of our customers are not subjected to the Large Payment Security Fee. We went into some detail explaining it because of the questions posed on this forum, but keep in mind that the first fee is the only fee for most of the customers who use ChargeSmart.

It seems like your beef here is not the fee itself, but the way the fee is disclosed. The problem is, as many of our billers accept a wide range of payments (with a wide range of costs and risks associated), we would alienate the majority of our customers by blanketing them all with the highest fee level for the benefit of those few outliers at the top (whose fee would work out to be the same, only "all inclusive" instead of broken out, as it is now).

We have automated most of our fraud detection procedures, but the high dollar, high risk transactions still require more man-power than one might think. Many of these larger payments require follow up telephone calls or emails, which take up additional resources and cost money.

I'm sorry you feel that the second fee is deceptive, and we will work to make our process more transparent. Keep in mind though, this practice actually lowers our margins substantially and doesn't raise the fee for those paying larger than average amounts.

Even if ChargeSmart doesn't work for your particular card reward or cash management strategy, we appreciate your the discussion and will take a serious look at the suggestions we've received from it.

rrgg

How about a package option where I could "buy" 6 mortgage payments in advance? Chargesmart would pay them once per month and offer a reduced total fee. Just an idea.

4Health

I don't know how to explain it, just go to the site and type in the information that's required. You need one of your statements because you need the exact address to which your payment would normally be mailed so that it is credited properly.

Boraxo

If so it would not follow historical pattern. Amex has cut credit limits for people who shopped at WalMart, charged marital counseling sessions, etc. (query why WalMart would continue to accept Amex though perhaps it doesn't care so long as it gets paid). Using a credit card to pay off installment is not necessarily a predictor of default unless you have data that I haven't seen (if so I'd think all those balance transfer offers would disappear) . In fact I'd wager many FTers would charge mortgages of mileage cards if the price was low enough

It is too bad that the merchant hasn't been able to develop a program that is better capable of predicting chargebacks. But maybe that's why banks that process visa, mc and amex charge merchants 2-3% on average - to cover risk as well. Perhaps it is smarter to charge a much lower fee for lower amounts - though of course that makes it a loser proposition for those of us who would be stuck with the "insurance" fee.

4Health

This fee is terrible. I thought I was only going to be charged the $9.95 fee that Wells Fargo charges and I was ready to submit payment, then I caught that sneaky fee in there for $17 additional dollars! What a rip off! My mortgage payment is around $985 a month, so it's not like it is a huge payment. I understand covering your butt, but this is not a service in my opinion that is worth paying for. If it was a straight $9.95 fee, I would have tried out the service, but $17 additional to pay a companies insurance premiums is ridiculous. Insurance is a cost of doing business, either eat that cost or this company is going to lose a lot of potential customers.

WorldTravelGeek

What specific link(s) did you click? Where they while you were logged into your account?

4Health

Sorry, I didn't understand that you didn't see the link: https://www.chargesmart.com/

It is not a feature available through wellsfargo.com, you have to use another company but they charge a ridiculous security fee on top of the payment fee so I am steering clear of this service until they have found a way to reduce or eliminate that charge. With the payment fee and security insurance fee, my payment would be charged more than 3% of my mortgage amount, which is unacceptable to me.

mooper

I was confused, too. So just to confirm - you, nor anyone else, has figured out a way to pay a Wells Fargo mortgage for less than a 3% net fee - correct? If anyone has a method - through WF or otherwise - please share. Thanks!

WorldTravelGeek

Yeah, that's what I'm trying to figure out... not through this other service... directly to WellsFargo. Even a $10 fee is worth the miles I'd get. After that the law of diminishing returns kicks in.

jchock1

To pay my $2400 BofA mortgage is $14.95 fee, plus $46 "insurance fee." This fee is only disclosed on the very last page prior to paying. No where else on the site is there any mention of this fee, except for the very last FAQ. I doubt seriously that the majority of mortgage payments don't incur this fee. Talk about bait and switch.

4Health

Correct

mooper

I doubt there's a way. For someone with a larger payment, say $5,000/month, the mortgage company would be eating far too much in processing fees to allow it. Would love to be proven wrong, however.

jdrtahoe

I would much like to give them the biz on 3K to 8K per month on
mortg. payments, however price needs to come closer to 1 cent/
USD spend, total. I am a big fan of SPG AMEX, so that would need
to change as well. Perhaps, this company can figure a way to
provide the service, and take into acct. the above, if so I'll stop
charging tax payments and give them 140k+ in biz.