Did the f/a's and/or captain make a big deal about getting to their destination early? I always consider this announcement to be the kiss of death: "Ladies and gentlemen, we've arrived at XXX 30 minutes ahead of schedule, we'll be taxiing to the gate for the next few moments....." Exactly a "few moments" later, the captain comes on the p/a and says "well, there's a jet still at our gate." When you get off 50 minutes later, you've still "arrived early."
I sometimes wish they'd just circle - at least then you can keep working.
No, we didn't arrive early, so he didn't have that opportunity (but I know what you mean).
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At least it was cold out, I hate sitting on the ground at tpa in the summer for 2hrs waiting to be cleared to ewr all while the sun bakes you on the tarmac.
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on BA 115 last night LHR-JFK. Over Maine the pilot said we were slowing down so instead of landing at 555pm we would arrive at about 615pm as our gate would have been occupied until then. On the ground at about 610pm we then sat for 35 minutes because an IB plane made a wrong turn and was nose to nose with a BA plane pulling out. As we waited the pilot apologized, and said "I've never really seen anything so simple made so complicated." Anyway we were at the gate "on time"
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CO DCA
Did the f/a's and/or captain make a big deal about getting to their destination early? I always consider this announcement to be the kiss of death: "Ladies and gentlemen, we've arrived at XXX 30 minutes ahead of schedule, we'll be taxiing to the gate for the next few moments....." Exactly a "few moments" later, the captain comes on the p/a and says "well, there's a jet still at our gate." When you get off 50 minutes later, you've still "arrived early."
I sometimes wish they'd just circle - at least then you can keep working.
I actually had the opposite this evening — my ATL-IAH flight arrived approximately 25 minutes early, and our gate was free! It helped that we were arriving at IAH C North, which isn't seeing too many flights these days.
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I was on the first VS A340-600 to land at EWR. Even though we landed early, we reached the gate 45 minutes late because they (EWR) was expecting a 744. The A346 only fits at a couple of gates and they had to move a few planes to get us to one of those gates. (longest commercial aircraft and the jetways can't reach door 2 so the plane sticks way out @ EWR)
Of course I had a IND-EWR with super schedule padding and we landed a hour early at the start of EWR rush hour and had to wait 50 minutes as plane after plane were leaving the gates.
IAH-SEA this morning...I was on 467. I would have rather diverted somewhere...
This is total b*******. This is the worst kind of abuse by an airline. It's one thing to be held for 2 hrs to take off but in my opinion this is being held captive for the of convenience of the airline. I don't care what kind of accommodations the airline has to make; let me off of the plane.
I would be livid. It's an airport, not Cape Canaveral.
This is total b*******. This is the worst kind of abuse by an airline. It's one thing to be held for 2 hrs to take off but in my opinion this is being held captive for the of convenience of the airline. I don't care what kind of accommodations the airline has to make; let me off of the plane.
I would be livid. It's an airport, not Cape Canaveral.
I remained calm at the time, because I knew it wouldn't do any good to do otherwise. Is compensation appropriate for this situation? I feel like CO should know that this is not okay to do.
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IAH-SEA this morning...I was on 467. I would have rather diverted somewhere...
Hi aviators99, sorry you had to endure what was clearly a frustrating situation. In this particular case, we proceeded with what appeared to be our most viable option.
That evening, the weather prediction was for .75" if snow, when in actuality 3" snow fell between 7:30 PM to 10:30PM, with continued fluries until midnight. While that may not seem like alot, the airport did have to close runways for clearing, and at times, only allowed flights to land. As a result, all gates were occupied and the aircraft who landed ahead of your flight filled every possible "pad" location. As a result, there was no place to push the Continental aircraft occupying our gates. To compound this issue, airlines couldn't deice their aircraft fast enought to meet the deicing fluid FAA limits (30 minutes). Unfortunately, upon landing, there were no gates for us to use (or even rent), nor were there any pad locations.
We did consider diverting to another airport as an option, but no option would've been better than what you endured. Boeing field, our primary diversion airport, was snowed in. Portland or Spokane were options, but were ruled out because they would've involved a comparable amount of hold time, plus the potential of a much more significant delay.
Sorry again - this was an unfortunate situation. You can bet we're working with Port of Seattle to create better alternatives for this type of situation in the future.
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Hi aviators99, sorry you had to endure what was clearly a frustrating situation. In this particular case, we proceeded with what appeared to be our most viable option.
That evening, the weather prediction was for .75" if snow, when in actuality 3" snow fell between 7:30 PM to 10:30PM, with continued fluries until midnight. While that may not seem like alot, the airport did have to close runways for clearing, and at times, only allowed flights to land. As a result, all gates were occupied and the aircraft who landed ahead of your flight filled every possible "pad" location. As a result, there was no place to push the Continental aircraft occupying our gates. To compound this issue, airlines couldn't deice their aircraft fast enought to meet the deicing fluid FAA limits (30 minutes). Unfortunately, upon landing, there were no gates for us to use (or even rent), nor were there any pad locations.
We did consider diverting to another airport as an option, but no option would've been better than what you endured. Boeing field, our primary diversion airport, was snowed in. Portland or Spokane were options, but were ruled out because they would've involved a comparable amount of hold time, plus the potential of a much more significant delay.
Sorry again - this was an unfortunate situation. You can bet we're working with Port of Seattle to create better alternatives for this type of situation in the future.
It's the "or even rent" statement that I question. Was calling Alaska Air out of the question? If so, can you shed some insight on why?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aviators99
It's the "or even rent" statement that I question. Was calling Alaska Air out of the question? If so, can you shed some insight on why?
I think a good patch of the blame rests on the Port of Seattle, but I also think CO should have been more aggressive with them to find creative options.
Unless they had every single possible spot of space occupied, there is ramp space at the north end of the airport at the cargo area, and ramp space over by the GA FBOs - the aircraft could have taxied to either spot, unloaded its passengers into buses and sent them to the terminal. Bags could have been claimed later or the next morning.
They could have taxied near the clump of Horizon gates which have ground-level ramp access via doors, both at S and the main concourse, escorted the pax down airstairs and into the terminal, then taxied on to find holding space elsewhere.
Of course none of us were there, or part of the discussions with the Port, but I would have pushed them harder for a solution to get my customers off and into the terminal.
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Did the f/a's and/or captain make a big deal about getting to their destination early? I always consider this announcement to be the kiss of death: "Ladies and gentlemen, we've arrived at XXX 30 minutes ahead of schedule, we'll be taxiing to the gate for the next few moments....." Exactly a "few moments" later, the captain comes on the p/a and says "well, there's a jet still at our gate." When you get off 50 minutes later, you've still "arrived early."
I sometimes wish they'd just circle - at least then you can keep working.
I missed the last 10 minutes of Antwone Fisher one time because of that early arrival!
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This was obviously a terrible situation which could not have been pleasant (I was once trapped on one of those jetBlue flights for nearly 6 hours, but that was before take off).
While I have been known to be critical of CO here on FT, in this case I commend Scott for posting a very forthright, very uncorporate explanation. Kudos, Scott.
Second, to all of you who think CO should have contacted Alaska Airlines or found a pod somewhere on the Seattle field, I am sure that is a far more complicated thing than might meet the eye.
In addition to negotiating with the other entity, there is the issue of unloading luggage and shuttling passengers to the appropriate terminal.
I would imagine that, by the time all those arrangements would have been made, well over two hours could have elapsed.
Airline travel is a miracle. It allows us to cross the American continent in a few hours, a trip that would have taken months just slightly over 150 years ago...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aviators99
Some good points made in your post...however, this one (comparing to horse and carriage?) is a bit misplaced!
My point was simply that we take this miracle of air transport so for granted that we expect to be whisked around the world at 500 mph and everything to work perfectly all the time.
Sometimes it just can't.
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No gates for rent = all gates occupied
No pads available = there is no parking place to put an aircraft; also called
a hard stand area
Bus passenges to terminal = not always an option due to lack of buses
or the time it takes to arrange one, often up to 4 hours
to get buses for duty
Walking down stairs = very dangerous especially in bad weather
I can assure you that CO was trying to get you into a gate and off the plane as soon as possible. This costs CO alot: the gas to keep the plane running, the cost of the crew (they are still being paid) and the good will that is lost by having you stuck on board.
Manning to Tyree 
