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Citi ThankYou Points (TYPs): airline and hotel transfer partners

Old Aug 5, 2014, 12:17 pm
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Last edit by: mia
Q. Can I transfer Thank You points to airline programs?

A. Yes, but only from a TYP account tied to one of the following premium (fee-based) Citi cards:
  • Premier
  • Prestige
  • Chairman

Exception: Citi Preferred or Rewards+ cardholders can transfer to JetBlue at a less favorable rate (1000:500). They cannot transfer to other airline or hotel programs except as explained in the next paragraph .

Points earned through other cards -- such as the Citi Preferred or Rewards+ -- are eligible for transfer to airline programs, provided you also hold one of the premium cards listed above.

ThankYou Points earned through banking and customer service adjustments are called Taxable Points. Citi reports them as taxable when they are redeemed, not when they are earned. Citi does not allow Taxable Points to be Shared or Transferred, because they cannot determine a monetary value for those redemptions. However, the IT implementation of this policy may be imperfect. In 2015 one member was able to Transfer points earned through banking shortly after combining two ThankYou Rewards accounts. See posts 207-210, but no one has replicated this success.

Q. Which airline programs can I transfer TYP into?

A. TYP may be transferred 1:1 to these airline programs:

OneWorld
  • Cathay Pacific Asia Miles (CX)
  • Malaysia Airlines Enrich (MH)
  • Qantas Frequent Flyer (QF)
  • Qatar Airways Privilege Club (QR)

SkyTeam
  • Aeromexico Club Premier
  • Flying Blue: Air France (AF), KLM (KL) and others
  • Garuda Indonesia GarudaMiles (GA)
  • Virgin Atlantic (VS)

Star Alliance
  • Avianca LifeMiles (AV)
  • EVA Air Infinity MileageLands (BR)
  • Singapore Airlines KrisFlyer (SQ)
  • Thai Airways Royal Orchid Plus (TG)
  • Turkish Airlines (TK)

Independent
  • Etihad Guest (EY)
  • Emirates Skywards (EK)
  • Jet Airways (9W)
  • jetBlue (B6) (TYP 1000 = 800 B6)


and to these hotel programs:
  • ALL - Accor Live Limitless ( TYP 1000 = 500 ALL)
  • Choice Privileges (TYP 1000 = 2000 Choice)
  • Leading Hotels of the World Leaders Club (TYP 1000 = 200 LC)
  • Wyndham Rewards


and to this retail program:
  • Shop Your Way (Sears) (at ratio 1 TYP: 12 SYW)


Q: After I transfer, when will my miles expire at that airline/hotel program? Is there anything I can do to avoid expiration there?

The Miles/Points that Do and Don't Expire wiki now lists all of the above Citi TYP airline/hotel transfer partners and their respective expiration policies.

Q. Are transfers instant?

A. Not necessarily. Although Citi's FAQ states that it may take up to fourteen days for the ThankYou Points to post to your participating travel loyalty program member account, anecdotal evidence suggests that many transfer times will be much shorter. A summary:

Q. Can I transfer to another person's airline or hotel program account?

A. Per the Citi FAQ,
No. The first and last names on both the ThankYou Member Account and the participating travel loyalty program member's account must match in order to transfer points using the Points Transfer feature.
We do not have many reports describing how strictly this rule is applied/enforced, nor any reports on workarounds. One FTer, in his first post ever, claimed success in transfering TYP to another person's Etihad (EY) account.

Keep in mind that TYP may be freely Shared with another TYP member's account (with the points expiring 90 days after transfer). If the recipient member has a transfer-eligible card (as described above), s/he can Transfer points to airline or hotel partners.










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Citi ThankYou Points (TYPs): airline and hotel transfer partners

Old Jul 21, 2014, 12:40 pm
  #16  
 
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Originally Posted by rgAAFT
(not to mention the mainly middle eastern airlines that ended up being citi's transfer partners
I'd agree that the list is pretty disappointing, but only 2 of the 8 airlines are middle eastern.
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 12:42 pm
  #17  
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Bleh, I never got any thankyou cards precisely because they didn't transfer to miles. Too bad I just did a churn last week!
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 1:22 pm
  #18  
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Originally Posted by roki
Considering the largest single investor in Citi is from the UAE (I believe), I'm not surprised. The transfer partners are, near as I can tell, catered strongly to Citigroup's client demographic (Asian, Middle Eastern, Indian).

I looked at SQ, but it doesn't seem like a good value for me, at least in the near future. Guess I'll keep on earning for now and see what happens.
I believe its the Saudi royal fam that owns 10% of Citigroup. and this was before the subprime meltdown. not sure if they've doubled down and invested more (or reversed course and divested now -- not that it matters considering how frivolous they are with their money.)


I think there are many reasons for this list and the decision that was made to go ahead with it (since we dont know the inside history/behind the scenes details of the TY program for purposes of transfer partners.) but from this news alone we can deduce:

- Citi wants to let its customers know (or rather think -- cause perception is reality) that its working to change things up by 'enhancing' its current program and product offerings. but at the same time as a new player in the transfer program, they prolly wanna minimize their costs.

- which means signing up transfer partners which are gonna require a lot of effort to build up substantial balances to redeem anything of worth. all while the risk of imminent and stealthy deval is constant (just ask TG) ... the more Citi's customers work aka spend to build up their balances, the better it is for business and their bottom line. add the cherry on top about aspirational awards that never come to fruition cause one is always chasing the carrot ahead on a stick.

- IMHO its clear that Citi thinks MEA & APAC are bigger growth areas that they need to target, not only for its customer base that uses their products but perhaps they think the 'demand' is gonna come from these regions. I'm talking about where ppl might wanna fly to and the FFP/loyalty programs they would thus ascribe to.

- with that above line of thinking in mind, perhaps the US/EU markets are tapped out (for now) ... and I dont mean in terms of business generated for Citi (which could be stagnant and would explain marketing pushes like the CitiAA Exec bonanza) but perhaps transfer partners have exclusive agreements with UR/MR/SPG. or perhaps the US/EU transfer partners have a higher cost of doing business that Citi cant justify right now (keep in mind Citi in effect 'buys' the points that you transfer to their partners.)

Last edited by FTR 787; Jul 21, 2014 at 4:14 pm
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 2:10 pm
  #19  
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Excellent news. So this rumor can finally be put to bed.
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 2:14 pm
  #20  
 
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Originally Posted by mia
Not surprising. Citi does not want Premier or Prestige to cannibalize their AAdvantage cards.
So why do Chase and AmEx offer transfers to MileagePlus and SkyPesos, respectively? I would guess they're waiting for AA and US programs to merge, maybe for a contract stipulation with Barclaycard to expire.

Originally Posted by rgAAFT
This is even more disappointing than the time when Chase kept stalling with putting an EMV chip into CSP (for no real reason as it turns out) and it doesn't even have real pin capability
I thought the goal was to push people into the JPM Select card that lacked a bunch of CSP's bonuses. They got rid of JPM Select a while back, but they seem to be turning CSP into the Select card: dropping the 7% annual bonus but bringing primary rental coverage.

Originally Posted by roki
If my Earning + Redemption + Transferable balance isn't an error, it looks like they definitely use points earned with Banking/Taxable points first, which I guess makes sense. In a way that's nice, because you can burn through the banking points without decreasing the number you're able to transfer.
I think they use the earliest-expiring points first. As points from the Preferred-level and higher cards don't expire, that leaves your banking points, which, I think, expire after three years.
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 2:18 pm
  #21  
 
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can points earned from my forward card be eligible for this transfer if I apply for the citi premier/prestige card? its' still my main card for dining/amazon at 5pts/$
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 2:22 pm
  #22  
 
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Originally Posted by bbmatt
can points earned from my forward card be eligible for this transfer if I apply for the citi premier/prestige card? its' still my main card for dining/amazon at 5pts/$
Yes, all points earned combine into one ThankYou account and are eligible.
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 2:40 pm
  #23  
 
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Originally Posted by FTRox87
I believe its the Saudi royal fam that owns 10% of Citigroup. and this was before the subprime meltdown. not sure if they've doubled down and invested more (or reversed course and divested now -- not that it matters considering how frivolous they are with their money.)


I think there are many reasons for this list and the decision that was made to go ahead with it (since we dont know the inside history/behind the scenes details of the TY program for purposes of transfer partners.) but from this news alone we can deduce:

- Citi wants to let its customers know (or rather think -- cause perception is reality) that its working to change things up by 'enhancing' its current program and product offerings. but at the same time as a new player in the transfer program, they prolly wanna minimize their costs.

- which means signing up transfer partners which are gonna require a lot of effort to build up substantial balances to redeem anything of worth. all while the risk of imminent and stealthy deval is a constant risk (just ask TG) ... the more Citi's customers work aka spend to build up their balances, the better it is for business and their bottom line. add the cherry on top about aspirational awards that never come to fruition cause one is always chasing the carrot ahead on a stick.

- IMHO its clear that Citi thinks MEA & APAC are bigger growth areas that they need to target, not only for its customer base that uses their products but perhaps they think the 'demand' is gonna come from these regions. I'm talking about where ppl might wanna fly too and the FFP/loyalty programs they would thus ascribe to.

- with that above line of thinking in mind, perhaps the US/EU markets are tapped out (for now) ... and I dont mean in terms of business generated for Citi (which could be stagnant and would explain marketing pushes like the CitiAA Exec bonanza) but perhaps transfer partners have exclusive agreements with UR/MR/SPG. or perhaps the US/EU transfer partners have a higher cost of doing business that Citi cant justify right now (keep in mind Citi in effect 'buys' the points that you transfer to their partners.)
So, Are you implying that citi does not have to "buy" the miles required from AA to fuel such as promos as the 100k? (which can be had multiple times over) whats their reasoning behind that then?
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 2:51 pm
  #24  
 
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Originally Posted by rgAAFT
So, Are you implying that citi does not have to "buy" the miles required from AA to fuel such as promos as the 100k? (which can be had multiple times over) whats their reasoning behind that then?
I don't think that's the implication at all. The 100K promo is offset by the $450 annual fee + revenue on $10K spend. There are loads of people with 100K+ TY points just sitting in their accounts (my parents have 250K+). If Citi made AA a transfer partner, it wouldn't shock me if 100 million+ TY points got dumped into AA (2000 people with 50K+). Even at the bargain rate I'm sure Citi has negotiated with AA, that's a solid chunk of change without any current period revenue to offset it. They could make an adjustment to long-term liabilities (outstanding TY points), I guess.

Just guesswork, I don't know.
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 3:05 pm
  #25  
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Originally Posted by rgAAFT
So, Are you implying that citi does not have to "buy" the miles required from AA to fuel such as promos as the 100k? (which can be had multiple times over) whats their reasoning behind that then?
no, why would I be implying that? or where in my post did you gather that from.

anyways, also keep in mind Citi is a giant entity. CitiAA and Citi TYP are very much different departments, they might as well be diff subsidiaries or sister companies under Citigroup.

CitiAA has specially negotiated rates with AA. not to mention they already bought about a billion miles for a huge discount during the AA bankruptcy. and while CitiTYP could get em cheaper (at cost?) from them rather than AA directly now, not sure CitiAA would be willing to part with their stash. yep, internal politics is gonna be a bit of a grind here to get both kids to 'share' their toys. and in this case I dont see CitiTYP offering anything of value to CitiAA, just 'taking' from an established player/dept.

Originally Posted by roki
I don't think that's the implication at all. The 100K promo is offset by the $450 annual fee + revenue on $10K spend. There are loads of people with 100K+ TY points just sitting in their accounts (my parents have 250K+). If Citi made AA a transfer partner, it wouldn't shock me if 100 million+ TY points got dumped into AA (2000 people with 50K+). Even at the bargain rate I'm sure Citi has negotiated with AA, that's a solid chunk of change without any current period revenue to offset it. They could make an adjustment to long-term liabilities (outstanding TY points), I guess.

Just guesswork, I don't know.
and what he said ^
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 3:22 pm
  #26  
 
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Maybe it's just me, but I feel like the cannabalization train has already left the station. The Citi Exec and Prestige cards used to be complimentary, but with the addition of Admirals Club access, increased value for AA/US spend, and the upcoming dropping of some of the Prestige's unique features, it seems like there's little reason to have both.

Originally Posted by rgAAFT
So, Are you implying that citi does not have to "buy" the miles required from AA to fuel such as promos as the 100k? (which can be had multiple times over) whats their reasoning behind that then?
Supposedly in the Barclays US Air contract, miles for signup bonuses cost even less than normal miles.
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 4:03 pm
  #27  
 
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I guess I just wasn't aware how separate the different entities at citi really were.(?)
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 5:03 pm
  #28  
mia
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Originally Posted by FTRox87
...at the same time as a new player in the transfer program,
Citi knows how these programs work, and they have the requisite contacts with pretty much any airline. In 1984 Citi invented Diners Club Rewards, the first card program that awarded points which could be transferred to a variety of airlines. The program still exists, but has been sold on to BMO.


Originally Posted by Rus925
So why do Chase and AmEx offer transfers to MileagePlus and SkyPesos
In the case of American Express the reason is historical. Delta was one of the original partners in Membership Miles, as the American Express program was called when in launched in 1991. The SkyMiles credit cards came later.

Chase did not add UA to Ultimate Rewards until a few months before Continental OnePass ceased to exist. I think they knew they need a Star Alliance partner to make the program appealing. Now they also have SQ, and I wonder if UA will remain long term.

I do also wonder if Citi will cave in and add AA to ThankYou Rewards after the legacy balances are flushed out.
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 5:05 pm
  #29  
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Originally Posted by mia
Now they also have SQ, and I wonder if UA will remain long term.

I hope they give some notice when/if they plan to do this.
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Old Jul 21, 2014, 5:07 pm
  #30  
 
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The only program that seems worthwhile is SQ's, and I can already transfer from Amex and Chase to them. Using my balance for 1.6 cents each toward AA/US flights seems a better option.
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