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Medical Costs in China/Travel Insurance

Medical Costs in China/Travel Insurance

Old Apr 12, 2011, 2:53 am
  #31  
 
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I have used 3 different insurers for cover on US trips.. and the MAIN cover wanted was comprehensive medical....

If I get injured/ill over there I don't want to pay the costs of treatment, that's for sure.

All of those policies covered unlimited medical treatment AND medical evacuation home...

Not sure where the idea came from that medical cover on Travel Insurance for foreigners in the US was non-existent or "limited"??

An annual policy cost me (single guy) about AUD$580 last year... with higher than normal "single item" cover...

Don't know how anyone could insure for US travel for 10 Euro per annum...
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 4:25 am
  #32  
 
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Originally Posted by trooper
I have used 3 different insurers for cover on US trips.. and the MAIN cover wanted was comprehensive medical....

If I get injured/ill over there I don't want to pay the costs of treatment, that's for sure.

All of those policies covered unlimited medical treatment AND medical evacuation home...

Not sure where the idea came from that medical cover on Travel Insurance for foreigners in the US was non-existent or "limited"??
An annual policy cost me (single guy) about AUD$580 last year... with higher than normal "single item" cover...

Don't know how anyone could insure for US travel for 10 Euro per annum...
I don't recall reading that upthread. This thread has focused on US citizens/residents needing coverage abroad, and as a secondary tangent, that products commonly available to them are different than for residents of other countries traveling abroad (implied is to non-US locations). The issue of insuring foreigners visiting the USA is completely different.

@Charlie--since you feel you need the trip cancellation insurance, I see why you feel you are locked into those comprehensive policies. Your choice, but it's way too much money. But at least you are going into it having done research and considered your alternatives.

And here's where I want to bring up another point and to make sure it doesn't get lost in the shuffle, all-caps: IF YOU CAN PLAN A TRIP TO CHINA INDEPENDENTLY YOU DON'T NEED TRIP CANCELLATION INSURANCE. This is because except for air tickets--where the cancellation risk can be managed differently by booking carefully--and accommodation--where many options are available cancellable 1-3 days in advance--there really aren't many more advance payment types of items. When you don't need trip cancellation insurance bundled in with medical, you can focus on what counts and then the choice of travel medical options gets vetted differently.
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 4:37 am
  #33  
 
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Ah.. of course.. I misread that.. you were referring to Travel Insurance not providing much medical cover within the USA.. for US citizens!

Big difference to how I had read it! Sorry.

Still fascinated how -when annual travel insurance for an Aussie (which includes the USA) costs at least AUD$400 or more - Europeans can get it for 10 Euro!
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 5:17 am
  #34  
 
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Originally Posted by trooper
Ah.. of course.. I misread that.. you were referring to Travel Insurance not providing much medical cover within the USA.. for US citizens!

Big difference to how I had read it! Sorry.

Still fascinated how -when annual travel insurance for an Aussie (which includes the USA) costs at least AUD$400 or more - Europeans can get it for 10 Euro!
I don't believe that 10 Euro number for a second.
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 5:31 am
  #35  
 
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Originally Posted by jiejie
I don't believe that 10 Euro number for a second.
Choose any insurer you like:
HUK 24 (cost is 6 €/year, 14.50€/year for a family. Surcharges (10-20 €) for people over 70.)
Allianz (8€/year)
cosmos direkt
Hanse Merkur

or, as another poster mentioned many credit cards have it included already.

As I said before, it is for leisure travellers staying max 30-60 days per journey abroad, only applicable for treatment abroad incl. US, but not in Germany. I'm actually triple insured: Two credit cards, one family plan.

If you still don't "believe" it, go ahead and translate these pages or ask someone who you believe to be more credible...

Last edited by Chinatrvl; Apr 12, 2011 at 5:49 am
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 6:58 am
  #36  
 
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Originally Posted by Chinatrvl
Choose any insurer you like:
HUK 24 (cost is 6 /year, 14.50/year for a family. Surcharges (10-20 ) for people over 70.)
Allianz (8/year)
cosmos direkt
Hanse Merkur

or, as another poster mentioned many credit cards have it included already.

As I said before, it is for leisure travellers staying max 30-60 days per journey abroad, only applicable for treatment abroad incl. US, but not in Germany. I'm actually triple insured: Two credit cards, one family plan.

If you still don't "believe" it, go ahead and translate these pages or ask someone who you believe to be more credible...
Pretty amazing. I assumed it covered care but not evacuation but it appears to cover that as well:

"medizinisch notwendigen Rcktransport" = Medical Repatriation (I think?)

How does Allianz make any money on this type of policy?

One guy getting into a serious car accident in Asia somewhere and needing to be airlifted back to Germany privately for treatment would wipe out the premiums of thousands of policy holders.

Doesn't add up, but certainly a great deal if you can get it!
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 9:44 am
  #37  
 
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Originally Posted by FLLDL
"medizinisch notwendigen Rcktransport" = Medical Repatriation (I think?)
Thats the correct translation. Including medical repatriation, but only if its really necessary. And thats from every point of the world.

Originally Posted by FLLDL
How does Allianz make any money on this type of policy?
Maybe because everyone have this insurance. Even my grandma who drive abroad every 5 years.

This insurance will pay everything. Hospital, even a standard doctor, medicin...
Here is a index of the best insurance in germany: http://www.test.de/themen/versicheru...12817-4220608/

But I checked every insurance, all require that you live in germany.
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 7:06 pm
  #38  
 
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Originally Posted by 31570324
<snip> But I checked every insurance, all require that you live in germany.
That's the rub, then, you have to be a resident which means you're already covered under a basic national health scheme (govt = tax supported). The pittance extra fee of Euro 8 or 10 or whatever charged, in no way can represent the real cost of insuring the actual travelers--the math just flatly doesn't work. In effect, the real cost and risk is bundled into the basic national health care scheme, spread over all German residents whether they travel or not.

This system is really a very different concept, and is more akin to worldwide medical coverage that expats often get when overseas on assignment (though the expat medical doesn't include trip cancellation, baggage, etc stuff). At least in the sense that one policy fee pays for anything, anywhere in the world including evac/repatr. But expat insurance is paid for by the company and/or the expat, not the taxpayers of the expat's country (usually).

So Chinatrvl, if you truly think you are really "buying travel insurance" for only Euro 10, think again. The true cost is already in your basic medical coverage for Germany, paid for presumably by your taxes. I'm not knocking the system, it sounds great for travelers from countries that set up their insurance systems this way. But not applicable to other travelers that come from places that have unbundled systems. Apples to oranges.
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 9:34 pm
  #39  
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Originally Posted by anacapamalibu
I was a witness to the violent beating of a person. Assisted the ambulance
personnel and traveled to the hospital for trauma care. The victim was
hospitalized for 6 months. I don't know if it was the senseless violence or
the thought that I came about 1 step from being the one in the hospital, but
I left the country the next day.
Sadly, I've also witnessed them same 10+ times (during each of the past three decades, but it's getting worse). Accordingly, I think the odds of getting clobbered in or near a bar are probably 1,000x greater than the car accident scenario. However, I'm guessing this risk isn't applicable to the OP (those who simply contemplate purchasing evacuation insurance are unlikely to make it Sanlitun or Xiu). To a certain extent, I am at risk because I go to bars in which nut cases are present, but not so much because I tend to back off (quickly) whenever I smell trouble.

To put things more bluntly, guys; if a crazy person sets his eyes on your significant other when you're at a bar in China, it is wise to accept an ego blow and defer to the him/her until you get a handle on the situation. The normal police are unlikely to offer any help at all because they aren't paid enough to put themselves in harm's way.

Last edited by moondog; Apr 12, 2011 at 9:43 pm
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 9:59 pm
  #40  
 
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I have personally witnessed the father of a friend who had a massive stroke. We went with her to the hospital. The Chinese medical system is so blatently unfair that it was amazing. Money or foreign insurance makes a HUGE difference on quality of care. The emergency doctor is so upfront, I was personally offended for our friend's sake. Doctor wanted a red envelope with cash. He actually said, "ATM machine is across the street". Every nurse, care aide and EVEN the cleaning staff all came over with their hand out. The local I was with said, "nurses get about 500 rmb or they will not care for your father and nursing assistant should get about 200 rmb or they will not feed or wash your father and the janitor should get about 100 rmb or the bed area will not be cleaned"

As we were waiting, nurse comes up to us and says, "your father needs his head shaved so that doctor can cut a hole in his head to relieve the pressure - I need a razor to shave a part of his hair off, give me 20 rmb now"

The 12 or so hours we waited in the waiting room, at least once a hour somebody will come by demanding cash for everything and anything.

If I couldn't speak Chinese, this would be a frighting experience.

Why I feel basic travel medical insurance is not necessarily a bad thing to purchase.
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 10:52 pm
  #41  
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Originally Posted by charlie1960
I find it interesting and curious as to why some posters think there is no need for insurance because they are "low risk." The whole point of insurance is to protect against unpredictable events that can be catastrophic. And none of us can predict that our low risk lifestyle will not get hit by a car. I'm guessing that those people who think travel insurance is a waste of money (yes, it is way overpriced but, as I pointed out elsewhere, this is America) are (1) making a hefty sum that they don't need to fret about OP expenses; (2) young and invincible; (3) in believe that they will be protected from bad things.
Well, "waste of money" is a personal decision. I know for a fact that moondog has lived in China a long time and never needed it. I have visited China many times and have lived in China for quite some time as well and don't need it.

If I had a massive stroke or some other massive emergency requiring help, well then to be honest it wouldn't matter what insurance I had. I would have to be operated on in China. To be honest it would have to be non-life threatening to be able to be evacuated from China back to your home country. Since that is the case, I always was willing to bare that risk on myself having to cough up some expensive airfare to get myself back to the US. But to me, I'm not all about worrying about all of the "if's" when it comes to things going wrong. I get my vaccines, but otherwise China is no different when it comes to risk than any US city if you ask me. Yes HC is not the same, so really the "insurance" you are paying for is for a plane ride back to your home country. For me, I wouldn't pay $200/person for 3 weeks of in case. But again, that's just me, to each their own.
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 11:32 pm
  #42  
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Originally Posted by moondog
Sadly, I've also witnessed them same 10+ times (during each of the past three decades, but it's getting worse). Accordingly, I think the odds of getting clobbered in or near a bar are probably 1,000x greater than the car accident scenario. However, I'm guessing this risk isn't applicable to the OP (those who simply contemplate purchasing evacuation insurance are unlikely to make it Sanlitun or Xiu). To a certain extent, I am at risk because I go to bars in which nut cases are present, but not so much because I tend to back off (quickly) whenever I smell trouble.

To put things more bluntly, guys; if a crazy person sets his eyes on your significant other when you're at a bar in China, it is wise to accept an ego blow and defer to the him/her until you get a handle on the situation. The normal police are unlikely to offer any help at all because they aren't paid enough to put themselves in harm's way.
The incident I was referring to didn't involve drunk expats at a bar. It was
an elderly Chinese woman beaten by a youth gang.
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 11:37 pm
  #43  
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Originally Posted by Taiwaned

As we were waiting, nurse comes up to us and says, "your father needs his head shaved so that doctor can cut a hole in his head to relieve the pressure - I need a razor to shave a part of his hair off, give me 20 rmb now"
That statement pretty much explains the way the system works.
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Old Apr 12, 2011, 11:57 pm
  #44  
 
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Originally Posted by jiejie
That's the rub, then, you have to be a resident which means you're already covered under a basic national health scheme (govt = tax supported). The pittance extra fee of Euro 8 or 10 or whatever charged, in no way can represent the real cost of insuring the actual travelers--the math just flatly doesn't work. In effect, the real cost and risk is bundled into the basic national health care scheme, spread over all German residents whether they travel or not.
Thats wrong. The national insurance will not pay anything for health care outside the european union. Inside the european union they pay the same they would pay if you have a accident inside your home country, so if we went to a medical high price country inside the european union we need this additional insurance, too.
If you have a accident somewhere in the world the additional insurance will pay everything for the time you are abroad. If they organize a medical repatriation and will bring you back to germany, the standard german insurance will pay for your cure after you arrive back.
And the german standard insurance is not tax paid. Every employee pay a fee for it, about 8.2% of his salary. His employer will pay additional 7.3%.
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Old Apr 13, 2011, 12:05 am
  #45  
 
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Originally Posted by jiejie
[...]So Chinatrvl, if you truly think you are really "buying travel insurance" for only Euro 10, think again. The true cost is already in your basic medical coverage for Germany, paid for presumably by your taxes. [...]
Quick facts, core of the medical coverage system in Germany (c. 90%) is state run, travel insurances are 100% private insurance companies. Subventions unlikely or even illegal by EU law.
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