May 18, 2019, 4:15 am
Last edit by: Deltus
As of May 2019, this thread is closing in on its 9 year anniversary. A lot has changed during the course of the past 9 years. In particular: 1. WeChat Wallet and Alipay have risen to prominence, and 2. banking related security measures have become much more intense. #2 is especially relevant to foreigners in China because many --if not most-- banks are reluctant to open accounts for people on standard tourist or business visas.
The objective of this thread is to help people navigate these waters. Please feel free to add your own data points to the Google Sheet in the following link:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lBOLufpsS_YypVd4Yv75aDVNLK2K0t8GHtbV7-O9Hqw/edit?usp=sharing
For an account of using HSBC Premier in China, see post 188.
The objective of this thread is to help people navigate these waters. Please feel free to add your own data points to the Google Sheet in the following link:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1lBOLufpsS_YypVd4Yv75aDVNLK2K0t8GHtbV7-O9Hqw/edit?usp=sharing
For an account of using HSBC Premier in China, see post 188.
Banking and Good banks in the PRC Discussion
Oct 14, 2010, 10:54 pm
#31
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: PEK and BOS
Programs: BA - Blue
Posts: 4,530
Thanks for the info, although I'm now more confused.
If the $50k thing has been around for years, and doesn't require paperwork, if I want to change less than $50k (or $10k), does that mean I could have e.g. gotten $2k-$3k changed at a bank or airport counter without a forex transaction slip?
The $500 thing sounds like a hassle, since it would involved (at best) visits to banks for several days in a row, and at worst, running around trying to find banks that play ball.
I didn't realise that wire transfers were so tricky -- is that even for institutions (this is a university that I'm dealing with)?
tb
If the $50k thing has been around for years, and doesn't require paperwork, if I want to change less than $50k (or $10k), does that mean I could have e.g. gotten $2k-$3k changed at a bank or airport counter without a forex transaction slip?
The $500 thing sounds like a hassle, since it would involved (at best) visits to banks for several days in a row, and at worst, running around trying to find banks that play ball.
I didn't realise that wire transfers were so tricky -- is that even for institutions (this is a university that I'm dealing with)?
tb
Oct 15, 2010, 2:28 am
#32
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Southeast USA
Programs: various
Posts: 6,710
Thanks for the info, although I'm now more confused.
If the $50k thing has been around for years, and doesn't require paperwork, if I want to change less than $50k (or $10k), does that mean I could have e.g. gotten $2k-$3k changed at a bank or airport counter without a forex transaction slip?
The $500 thing sounds like a hassle, since it would involved (at best) visits to banks for several days in a row, and at worst, running around trying to find banks that play ball.
I didn't realise that wire transfers were so tricky -- is that even for institutions (this is a university that I'm dealing with)?
tb
If the $50k thing has been around for years, and doesn't require paperwork, if I want to change less than $50k (or $10k), does that mean I could have e.g. gotten $2k-$3k changed at a bank or airport counter without a forex transaction slip?
The $500 thing sounds like a hassle, since it would involved (at best) visits to banks for several days in a row, and at worst, running around trying to find banks that play ball.
I didn't realise that wire transfers were so tricky -- is that even for institutions (this is a university that I'm dealing with)?
tb
1) Changing USD (or other forex) INTO RMB. This is what the $50K/$10K limitation is referring to.
2) Changing RMB into USD (or other forex).
3) Changing RMB BACK into USD (or other forex), where there is documentation that it originally came in as forex.
4) Changing USD physical currency into electronic format so it can be sent out of the country.
When we are saying "no paperwork" we are referring to not having to show things like official permission letters, tax receipts, etc.--in other words, only a passport needs to be presented.
What exactly are you trying to do? For any teller window transaction that converts Forex into RMB, whether at the airport or elsewhere, there will be a physical piece of paper documenting the transaction, of which you receive a chopped copy. Always. This is Situation #1. That piece of paper is good for converting the resulting amount of RMB (or less) back into Forex, normally within 6 months assuming you are a non-account holding visitor. That is Situation #3.
Situations #2 and #4 is where things get stickiest, and require creativity and/or a useful network.
Last edited by jiejie; Oct 15, 2010 at 2:34 am
Oct 15, 2010, 9:43 am
#33
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: HKG
Posts: 1,314
You can try, but don't be surprised if you get a No without a conversion strip. Bring your passport along. If what Tauphi is saying is true, try a couple of other banks also to see if you get some joy. Unlike Tauphi, I've never seen this work in real life, at least not in Beijing, without the conversion slip. Even for under $500. My last data points on this are at least 2-3 years' old, though.
The USD $50,000-to RMB conversion limit has been around for at least 4-5 years and is not tied to the Expo. The rule for individuals is $10,000 maximum can be converted in any given month, $50,000 limit per year. Without paperwork, just your passport. USD $50,000 can be done all or part in other foreign currencies, in equivalent value. Over that limit requires quite a bit more paperwork.
The USD $50,000-to RMB conversion limit has been around for at least 4-5 years and is not tied to the Expo. The rule for individuals is $10,000 maximum can be converted in any given month, $50,000 limit per year. Without paperwork, just your passport. USD $50,000 can be done all or part in other foreign currencies, in equivalent value. Over that limit requires quite a bit more paperwork.
As for the $500 per day amount, you can refer to the SAFE website:
http://fj.safe.gov.cn/110000/110000e0263021.html
So the next time some bank turns you down for doing an exchange from RMB worth US$500 or less, point them to the SAFE website.
While I was browsing the SAFE website, I noticed that they've extended the $50000 exchange period through to the end of December due to the Asian games. So if you have a large wad of RMB that you're trying to get rid of, now is the time to head to your nearest BoC branch.
Oct 15, 2010, 9:50 am
#34
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: HKG
Posts: 1,314
If the $50k thing has been around for years, and doesn't require paperwork, if I want to change less than $50k (or $10k), does that mean I could have e.g. gotten $2k-$3k changed at a bank or airport counter without a forex transaction slip?
The $500 thing sounds like a hassle, since it would involved (at best) visits to banks for several days in a row, and at worst, running around trying to find banks that play ball.
I didn't realise that wire transfers were so tricky -- is that even for institutions (this is a university that I'm dealing with)?
The $500 thing sounds like a hassle, since it would involved (at best) visits to banks for several days in a row, and at worst, running around trying to find banks that play ball.
I didn't realise that wire transfers were so tricky -- is that even for institutions (this is a university that I'm dealing with)?
So if you head to any BoC branch, you should be able to buy up to US$50000 worth of foreign currency with RMB.
If you wait until 2011 then you will probably have to do the $500 thing or use the black market, unless you have a work permit.
And no wire transfers aren't tricky at all. What is tricky is buying/selling foreign currency using RMB. This is because the RMB is not freely convertible, in case you haven't noticed
Oct 15, 2010, 9:57 am
#35
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: HKG
Posts: 1,314
I haven't been to an ICBC branch in three years so my memory is rusty 
IIRC, as long as you stick to your guns and get them to ask a supervisor they will follow the rules as set out by SAFE. However, I've found BoC to be much more reliable when it comes to foreign exchange than the ICBC, plus the BoC's fees for transactions such as wires are often lower than the ICBC.
But it doesn't hurt to try if the ICBC branch is more convenient for you. After all, the regulation is on your side
IIRC, as long as you stick to your guns and get them to ask a supervisor they will follow the rules as set out by SAFE. However, I've found BoC to be much more reliable when it comes to foreign exchange than the ICBC, plus the BoC's fees for transactions such as wires are often lower than the ICBC.
But it doesn't hurt to try if the ICBC branch is more convenient for you. After all, the regulation is on your side
Oct 15, 2010, 12:09 pm
#36
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: PEK and BOS
Programs: BA - Blue
Posts: 4,530
I'm not sure what you are asking. What is probably confusing is that this thread contains simultaneous references to four different situations:
1) Changing USD (or other forex) INTO RMB. This is what the $50K/$10K limitation is referring to.
2) Changing RMB into USD (or other forex).
3) Changing RMB BACK into USD (or other forex), where there is documentation that it originally came in as forex.
4) Changing USD physical currency into electronic format so it can be sent out of the country.
When we are saying "no paperwork" we are referring to not having to show things like official permission letters, tax receipts, etc.--in other words, only a passport needs to be presented.
What exactly are you trying to do? For any teller window transaction that converts Forex into RMB, whether at the airport or elsewhere, there will be a physical piece of paper documenting the transaction, of which you receive a chopped copy. Always. This is Situation #1. That piece of paper is good for converting the resulting amount of RMB (or less) back into Forex, normally within 6 months assuming you are a non-account holding visitor. That is Situation #3.
Situations #2 and #4 is where things get stickiest, and require creativity and/or a useful network.
1) Changing USD (or other forex) INTO RMB. This is what the $50K/$10K limitation is referring to.
2) Changing RMB into USD (or other forex).
3) Changing RMB BACK into USD (or other forex), where there is documentation that it originally came in as forex.
4) Changing USD physical currency into electronic format so it can be sent out of the country.
When we are saying "no paperwork" we are referring to not having to show things like official permission letters, tax receipts, etc.--in other words, only a passport needs to be presented.
What exactly are you trying to do? For any teller window transaction that converts Forex into RMB, whether at the airport or elsewhere, there will be a physical piece of paper documenting the transaction, of which you receive a chopped copy. Always. This is Situation #1. That piece of paper is good for converting the resulting amount of RMB (or less) back into Forex, normally within 6 months assuming you are a non-account holding visitor. That is Situation #3.
Situations #2 and #4 is where things get stickiest, and require creativity and/or a useful network.
thanks,
tb
Oct 15, 2010, 10:17 pm
#37
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Shanghai
Posts: 42,033
BofA works really well... no fees at all and the exchange rate is pretty close to WSJ.
Oct 15, 2010, 10:25 pm
#38
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: PEK and BOS
Programs: BA - Blue
Posts: 4,530
Oct 15, 2010, 11:10 pm
#39
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Shanghai
Posts: 42,033
-$29.92
(200)
CCB BEIJING ATM WITHDRWL 10-05
-$74.80
(500)
CCB BEIJING ATM WITHDRWL 10-04
-$44.88
(300)
CCB BEIJING ATM WITHDRWL 10-02
-$44.88
(300)
Using one of the 44.88 transactions, the exchange rate was 6.68. xe.com is showing 6.64 today (yikes!) so I think BofA is pretty good.
Oct 15, 2010, 11:12 pm
#40
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: HKG
Posts: 1,314
Oct 15, 2010, 11:34 pm
#41
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Southeast USA
Programs: various
Posts: 6,710
I don't know about the expiration/extention date. But I can absolutely, positively, 1000% without equivocation state that in Beijing at least, as far back in late 2005, the exchange limit policy of $50K USD per year for individuals, $10K per month was in place and enforced. And hasn't changed yet. YMMV where you are. I'm not betting on seeing any cancellation of this policy as of the end of December, either. Mostly because I can't see, from the Chinese govt point of view, why it would be beneficial to either lower or raise this limit at this time.
Oct 15, 2010, 11:54 pm
#42
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: HKG
Posts: 1,314
I don't know about the expiration/extention date. But I can absolutely, positively, 1000% without equivocation state that in Beijing at least, as far back in late 2005, the exchange limit policy of $50K USD per year for individuals, $10K per month was in place and enforced. And hasn't changed yet. YMMV where you are. I'm not betting on seeing any cancellation of this policy as of the end of December, either. Mostly because I can't see, from the Chinese govt point of view, why it would be beneficial to either lower or raise this limit at this time.
Oct 16, 2010, 12:15 am
#43
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Southeast USA
Programs: various
Posts: 6,710
Up here, either account-less or on individual accounts, we can't sell this much RMB (US 50K worth) and buy foreign notes without involved documentation. So whatever great deal you are talking about must be specific and localized--which means for other readers who may be lurking--not to be assumed to be expandable to anywhere in China, even during the immediate future.
Oct 16, 2010, 6:54 am
#44
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: HKG
Posts: 1,314
Up here, either account-less or on individual accounts, we can't sell this much RMB (US 50K worth) and buy foreign notes without involved documentation. So whatever great deal you are talking about must be specific and localized--which means for other readers who may be lurking--not to be assumed to be expandable to anywhere in China, even during the immediate future.
Print it out and take it with you if your bank teller has just come back from Mars.
However, even the teller at my local HSBC branch knew about this so I wonder which bank you've been going to that hasn't received this memo from SAFE?
Oct 16, 2010, 9:27 am
#45
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: PEK and BOS
Programs: BA - Blue
Posts: 4,530
tb