New ID checks at gate on domestic flights
Feb 14, 2013, 10:10 pm
#61
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Boston
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Your government and mine has created a secret blacklist of people so dangerous that they cannot get on a plane but who have not committed any crime and therefore cannot be arrested (or killed by drone strike) on the ground.
We live in a great nation, don't we?
(Yes, yes, we all know that it would be trivially easy to use a fake boarding pass and real ID to get around the no-fly list.)
Feb 14, 2013, 10:35 pm
#62
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Three words: No Fly List
Your government and mine has created a secret blacklist of people so dangerous that they cannot get on a plane but who have not committed any crime and therefore cannot be arrested (or killed by drone strike) on the ground.
We live in a great nation, don't we?
(Yes, yes, we all know that it would be trivially easy to use a fake boarding pass and real ID to get around the no-fly list.)
Your government and mine has created a secret blacklist of people so dangerous that they cannot get on a plane but who have not committed any crime and therefore cannot be arrested (or killed by drone strike) on the ground.
We live in a great nation, don't we?
(Yes, yes, we all know that it would be trivially easy to use a fake boarding pass and real ID to get around the no-fly list.)
In all fairness, do we even know what the criteria for being hit by a drone strike is now? You can be taken out without an arrest, extradition, or trial even if you are 16-years-old and related to a bad guy.
Feb 15, 2013, 7:58 am
#63
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 729
But don't most adults fly with an ID anyway? If you are driving to/from the airport, you need your driver's license, you might need it at the ticket counter, and you might need it if you make any credit card purchases during your trip. I'm not saying that you need to show the ID to TSA but that you likely would have some form of ID on you anyway.
Feb 15, 2013, 9:18 am
#64
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Three words: No Fly List
Your government and mine has created a secret blacklist of people so dangerous that they cannot get on a plane but who have not committed any crime and therefore cannot be arrested (or killed by drone strike) on the ground.
We live in a great nation, don't we?
(Yes, yes, we all know that it would be trivially easy to use a fake boarding pass and real ID to get around the no-fly list.)
Your government and mine has created a secret blacklist of people so dangerous that they cannot get on a plane but who have not committed any crime and therefore cannot be arrested (or killed by drone strike) on the ground.
We live in a great nation, don't we?
(Yes, yes, we all know that it would be trivially easy to use a fake boarding pass and real ID to get around the no-fly list.)
Only reason that I can come up with is that TSA leadership doesn't trust TSA screeners to do their jobs the first time.
ID Checking serves no security function and is not part of a limited administrative search for WEI.
Feb 15, 2013, 9:21 am
#65
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Boston
Posts: 821
Two words for you: Make-work.
Feb 15, 2013, 9:38 am
#66
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 616
If the TSA has enough screeners that they can conduct ID checks at the gate, they need to reduce their staffing. I've never seen one of these ID checks. Do the screeners check the ID's against a list or anything? If they just look at the ID and hand it back, talk about a waste of money and resources. At least a random bag check has a slight, yet highly unlikely, chance of catching something dangerous.
Feb 15, 2013, 9:45 am
#67
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If the TSA has enough screeners that they can conduct ID checks at the gate, they need to reduce their staffing. I've never seen one of these ID checks. Do the screeners check the ID's against a list or anything? If they just look at the ID and hand it back, talk about a waste of money and resources. At least a random bag check has a slight, yet highly unlikely, chance of catching something dangerous.
Worthless evolution but that pretty well describes the whole of TSA.
Feb 15, 2013, 2:21 pm
#68
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Coming to a bus terminal near you…
That DL employee was out of line; please let DL know.I learned the mobile boarding pass trick in Atlanta when I had a connecting flight coming back from overseas. Since there was no travel document inspection at the international transfer security checkpoint, my boarding card had no scribbles on it. The TSA woman went crazy, as if I must have snuck in.
I'm looking forward to going through the same experience you did. My response to their query will be "Yeah, one of your your fellow employees made a bunch of marks on it, so I threw it away."
Feb 15, 2013, 3:33 pm
#69
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This week I put my Japanese driver's license back in my wallet. If they want to play silly buggers and delay my flight by "screening" at the gate then I'll screw with them right back and switch to Japanese for everything.
Feb 15, 2013, 5:49 pm
#70
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 1,007
But don't most adults fly with an ID anyway? If you are driving to/from the airport, you need your driver's license, you might need it at the ticket counter, and you might need it if you make any credit card purchases during your trip. I'm not saying that you need to show the ID to TSA but that you likely would have some form of ID on you anyway.
Feb 15, 2013, 6:24 pm
#71
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Feb 15, 2013, 6:36 pm
#72
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Feb 15, 2013, 6:44 pm
#73
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If the back of your credit card is properly signed, then requiring such would be a violation of their merchant agreement.
Feb 16, 2013, 8:09 pm
#75
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I suggest that not only does ID not make us safer, it makes us less safe.
As an example, a teacher of mine had escaped Cuba in a small boat in the 1960s. This made him a criminal fugitive in the eyes of the Cuban government. A few years later, he was on a Miami to Tampa flight that was hijacked to Havana. (in Flyertalk parlance, MIA to TPA; irrops; HAV) He hid/destroyed his ID when he realized that the flight was crossing the Florida Straights. He avoided recapture partly because it was plausible for an American to be traveling without ID back in those days.
To leave the realm of anecdote and cite something verifiable, Petty Officer Robert Stetham was killed by the TWA 847 hijackers because they found his U.S. military ID. Leon Klinghoffer was singled out for death by the Achille Lauro highjackers because his U.S. passport listed his birthplace as Israel.
Do you think that ID made those folks safer? Once the scanning check point has confirmed that I don’t have a weapon or an explosive, why does it matter whether I’m John Smith or Joe Bloggs?
As an example, a teacher of mine had escaped Cuba in a small boat in the 1960s. This made him a criminal fugitive in the eyes of the Cuban government. A few years later, he was on a Miami to Tampa flight that was hijacked to Havana. (in Flyertalk parlance, MIA to TPA; irrops; HAV) He hid/destroyed his ID when he realized that the flight was crossing the Florida Straights. He avoided recapture partly because it was plausible for an American to be traveling without ID back in those days.
To leave the realm of anecdote and cite something verifiable, Petty Officer Robert Stetham was killed by the TWA 847 hijackers because they found his U.S. military ID. Leon Klinghoffer was singled out for death by the Achille Lauro highjackers because his U.S. passport listed his birthplace as Israel.
Do you think that ID made those folks safer? Once the scanning check point has confirmed that I don’t have a weapon or an explosive, why does it matter whether I’m John Smith or Joe Bloggs?
BUt don't get me wrong - I am firmly in the "ID checks are unadulterated BS" camp. While the theoretical argument can be made that the ID check at the c/p has some potential security value, in that it is intended to prevent anyone from entering the sterile area who is not a ticketed passenger whose name has been run through the various Enemy of the State lists, there is absolutely no justification whatsoever to the gate ID checks.
If the back of your credit card is properly signed, then requiring such would be a violation of their merchant agreement.
I am a merchant that accepts CC's. This is quite true. Some merchants will ask, but they can not require. Usually, the people at the register do not know this and even the manager may be unaware. I left $500 of stuff lying on the checkout of a local building supply when they refused my CC without ID.
Complaining to the CC company might be effective, however; I will start doing so in the future via the link ND provided.