Executive orders banning entry to US ... [merged threads]
Jan 31, 2017, 6:00 pm
#151
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Any information on those with existing (non LPRs) would be helpful. I'm pretty sure the courts will protect LPRs, but I'd like to see any actual news on the question of what will happen with the non-LPRs.
Jan 31, 2017, 6:43 pm
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Right now they are mostly out of luck as citizens (dual or otherwise) of blacklisted countries unless having one of a shortlist of special circumstances.
Jan 31, 2017, 7:56 pm
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Some dual-citizens of the blacklisted countries are ok, but several hours back all of them certainly weren't. It seems like a lot of this "new info" hasn't filtered down to everywhere and that some of it really is just a Monday/Tuesday PR game of sorts more than a properly, fully implemented change from Sunday.
That's a reference to the following:
https://www.cbp.gov/border-security/...-united-states
<deleted by moderator>
Some dual-citizens of the blacklisted countries are ok, but several hours back all of them certainly weren't. It seems like a lot of this "new info" hasn't filtered down to everywhere and that some of it really is just a Monday/Tuesday PR game of sorts more than a properly, fully implemented change from Sunday.
That's a reference to the following:
https://www.cbp.gov/border-security/...-united-states
<deleted by moderator>
Last edited by TWA884; Jan 31, 2017 at 8:40 pm Reason: Quote of deleted post and response
Feb 1, 2017, 2:21 am
#154
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Just saw this from CBP.
1. How will the EO affect college students from the barred countries, such as F1/J1/M1 visa holders? Are they included in the ban? What kind of guidance is being given to foreign students from these countries legally in the US?
F1/J1/M1 visas are currently temporarily suspended due to the executive order. Individuals who were in the U.S. at the time of the signing of the executive order are not affected by the order. However, individuals who were out of the country at the time of the signing, or who travel out of the country and attempt to return will not be allowed to return at this time. The Department is evaluating whether those who are precluded from returning as a result of the Executive Order will be considered to have maintained their status as F1 or M1 students.
2. Does this Executive Order apply to green card holders from one of the seven countries listed?
Yes - if the green card holder (a Lawful Permanent Resident, or LPR) was out of the country at the time of the order’s signing, or travels out of the country after the order was signed. However, green card holders are eligible for national interest waivers consistent with the provisions of the Executive Order. It does not affect lawful permanent residents who are currently in the country.
In applying the provisions of the President's Executive Order, the entry of lawful permanent residents is in the national interest. Accordingly, absent significant derogatory information indicating a serious threat to public safety and welfare, lawful permanent resident status will be a dispositive factor in our case-by-case determinations.
3. So far, how many Lawful Permanent Residents have not been allowed to enter pursuant to the Exception to the Executive Order?
Two.One, who was entered into proceedings based on a criminal record. Another individual chose to return to Canada and withdrew his request for entry.
4. Does this Executive Order apply to dual nationals of the seven countries who want to enter the U.S.? If they apply for entry based on their citizenship from one of the countries NOT on the list, will they be allowed entry?
Yes, but travelers are being treated according to the travel document they present. For example, if they present a Canadian passport, that is how they are processed for entry.
https://www.cbp.gov/border-security/...-united-states
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1. How will the EO affect college students from the barred countries, such as F1/J1/M1 visa holders? Are they included in the ban? What kind of guidance is being given to foreign students from these countries legally in the US?
F1/J1/M1 visas are currently temporarily suspended due to the executive order. Individuals who were in the U.S. at the time of the signing of the executive order are not affected by the order. However, individuals who were out of the country at the time of the signing, or who travel out of the country and attempt to return will not be allowed to return at this time. The Department is evaluating whether those who are precluded from returning as a result of the Executive Order will be considered to have maintained their status as F1 or M1 students.
2. Does this Executive Order apply to green card holders from one of the seven countries listed?
Yes - if the green card holder (a Lawful Permanent Resident, or LPR) was out of the country at the time of the order’s signing, or travels out of the country after the order was signed. However, green card holders are eligible for national interest waivers consistent with the provisions of the Executive Order. It does not affect lawful permanent residents who are currently in the country.
In applying the provisions of the President's Executive Order, the entry of lawful permanent residents is in the national interest. Accordingly, absent significant derogatory information indicating a serious threat to public safety and welfare, lawful permanent resident status will be a dispositive factor in our case-by-case determinations.
3. So far, how many Lawful Permanent Residents have not been allowed to enter pursuant to the Exception to the Executive Order?
Two.One, who was entered into proceedings based on a criminal record. Another individual chose to return to Canada and withdrew his request for entry.
4. Does this Executive Order apply to dual nationals of the seven countries who want to enter the U.S.? If they apply for entry based on their citizenship from one of the countries NOT on the list, will they be allowed entry?
Yes, but travelers are being treated according to the travel document they present. For example, if they present a Canadian passport, that is how they are processed for entry.
https://www.cbp.gov/border-security/...-united-states
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Feb 1, 2017, 2:45 am
#155
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Just saw this from CBP.
1. How will the EO affect college students from the barred countries, such as F1/J1/M1 visa holders? Are they included in the ban? What kind of guidance is being given to foreign students from these countries legally in the US?
F1/J1/M1 visas are currently temporarily suspended due to the executive order. Individuals who were in the U.S. at the time of the signing of the executive order are not affected by the order. However, individuals who were out of the country at the time of the signing, or who travel out of the country and attempt to return will not be allowed to return at this time. The Department is evaluating whether those who are precluded from returning as a result of the Executive Order will be considered to have maintained their status as F1 or M1 students.
2. Does this Executive Order apply to green card holders from one of the seven countries listed?
Yes - if the green card holder (a Lawful Permanent Resident, or LPR) was out of the country at the time of the order’s signing, or travels out of the country after the order was signed. However, green card holders are eligible for national interest waivers consistent with the provisions of the Executive Order. It does not affect lawful permanent residents who are currently in the country.
In applying the provisions of the President's Executive Order, the entry of lawful permanent residents is in the national interest. Accordingly, absent significant derogatory information indicating a serious threat to public safety and welfare, lawful permanent resident status will be a dispositive factor in our case-by-case determinations.
3. So far, how many Lawful Permanent Residents have not been allowed to enter pursuant to the Exception to the Executive Order?
Two.One, who was entered into proceedings based on a criminal record. Another individual chose to return to Canada and withdrew his request for entry.
4. Does this Executive Order apply to dual nationals of the seven countries who want to enter the U.S.? If they apply for entry based on their citizenship from one of the countries NOT on the list, will they be allowed entry?
Yes, but travelers are being treated according to the travel document they present. For example, if they present a Canadian passport, that is how they are processed for entry.
https://www.cbp.gov/border-security/...-united-states
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1. How will the EO affect college students from the barred countries, such as F1/J1/M1 visa holders? Are they included in the ban? What kind of guidance is being given to foreign students from these countries legally in the US?
F1/J1/M1 visas are currently temporarily suspended due to the executive order. Individuals who were in the U.S. at the time of the signing of the executive order are not affected by the order. However, individuals who were out of the country at the time of the signing, or who travel out of the country and attempt to return will not be allowed to return at this time. The Department is evaluating whether those who are precluded from returning as a result of the Executive Order will be considered to have maintained their status as F1 or M1 students.
2. Does this Executive Order apply to green card holders from one of the seven countries listed?
Yes - if the green card holder (a Lawful Permanent Resident, or LPR) was out of the country at the time of the order’s signing, or travels out of the country after the order was signed. However, green card holders are eligible for national interest waivers consistent with the provisions of the Executive Order. It does not affect lawful permanent residents who are currently in the country.
In applying the provisions of the President's Executive Order, the entry of lawful permanent residents is in the national interest. Accordingly, absent significant derogatory information indicating a serious threat to public safety and welfare, lawful permanent resident status will be a dispositive factor in our case-by-case determinations.
3. So far, how many Lawful Permanent Residents have not been allowed to enter pursuant to the Exception to the Executive Order?
Two.One, who was entered into proceedings based on a criminal record. Another individual chose to return to Canada and withdrew his request for entry.
4. Does this Executive Order apply to dual nationals of the seven countries who want to enter the U.S.? If they apply for entry based on their citizenship from one of the countries NOT on the list, will they be allowed entry?
Yes, but travelers are being treated according to the travel document they present. For example, if they present a Canadian passport, that is how they are processed for entry.
https://www.cbp.gov/border-security/...-united-states
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Feb 1, 2017, 6:35 am
#156
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Here are a few anecdotal numbers to suggest how big the problem is.
In a large major research university, there are somewhat more than a hundred students (maybe about 120-130?), presumably at the undergraduate and graduate levels combined with most being MS or PhD students, from the seven countries. All are believed to be in the USA as the semester started in mid-January, but in a few cases their families are not currently in the USA. In addition, there are less than a half dozen researchers (presumably mostly expected to visit during the coming months) from these countries who cannot enter under the current regulations. I haven't heard of any faculty being stuck outside of the USA at the moment, but there would be certainly some who now cannot travel to international conferences or do other professional foreign travel.
The biggest affected group is from Iran, including those with dual Iranian-EC or in some cases Iranian-Canadian citizenship; I'm not sure how dual Iranian-USA citizenship is being treated.
Of academics and researchers I know (at the Post-PhD level), I can easily list about a dozen with Iranian citizenship who have jobs in the USA, often on a very long term basis if they finished graduate school a while ago. For them, being unable currently to leave the USA is a major concern, not only for research related travel, but also if there were to be a family emergency involving someone outside of the USA, including aging parents and grandparents.
There's also a Catch-22 of some of them being able to get suitable jobs in the UK etc. but generally needing first to go to the prospective foreign university (with no guarantees) for a day or two for interviews and to give a presentation before a job offer can be extended. In especially private universities in the USA, the visit could be waived for extraordinarily well qualified individuals who are already established in their fields, but it could be more difficult to do so in the UK and other countries.
My sense from the grapevine as well as official announcements is that universities are offering to "help" but I don't know specifically what is being done or, in fact, what can be done.
In a large major research university, there are somewhat more than a hundred students (maybe about 120-130?), presumably at the undergraduate and graduate levels combined with most being MS or PhD students, from the seven countries. All are believed to be in the USA as the semester started in mid-January, but in a few cases their families are not currently in the USA. In addition, there are less than a half dozen researchers (presumably mostly expected to visit during the coming months) from these countries who cannot enter under the current regulations. I haven't heard of any faculty being stuck outside of the USA at the moment, but there would be certainly some who now cannot travel to international conferences or do other professional foreign travel.
The biggest affected group is from Iran, including those with dual Iranian-EC or in some cases Iranian-Canadian citizenship; I'm not sure how dual Iranian-USA citizenship is being treated.
Of academics and researchers I know (at the Post-PhD level), I can easily list about a dozen with Iranian citizenship who have jobs in the USA, often on a very long term basis if they finished graduate school a while ago. For them, being unable currently to leave the USA is a major concern, not only for research related travel, but also if there were to be a family emergency involving someone outside of the USA, including aging parents and grandparents.
There's also a Catch-22 of some of them being able to get suitable jobs in the UK etc. but generally needing first to go to the prospective foreign university (with no guarantees) for a day or two for interviews and to give a presentation before a job offer can be extended. In especially private universities in the USA, the visit could be waived for extraordinarily well qualified individuals who are already established in their fields, but it could be more difficult to do so in the UK and other countries.
My sense from the grapevine as well as official announcements is that universities are offering to "help" but I don't know specifically what is being done or, in fact, what can be done.
Feb 1, 2017, 9:15 am
#157
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After 3+ days of causing dual-citizens of the banned countries with VWP country or Canadian passports, the USG message and messaging finally gets fixed. Such class of persons are no longer meant to be all banned and many of them are to be allowed to travel to and enter the US as long as they meet the other conditions applicable to them from before this past Friday.
Of course nothing in this latest message/messaging about the list of those amongst such impacted class of persons who had Global Entry membership but have had it revoked or blocked since such order hit them. [It also hit even a bunch of US dual-citizens with citizenship also of the blacklisted countries.]
Of course nothing in this latest message/messaging about the list of those amongst such impacted class of persons who had Global Entry membership but have had it revoked or blocked since such order hit them. [It also hit even a bunch of US dual-citizens with citizenship also of the blacklisted countries.]
Last edited by GUWonder; Feb 1, 2017 at 10:12 am
Feb 1, 2017, 10:06 am
#158
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Ramped up CBP effort to get citizens of the blacklisted countries to sign I-407s (whereby LPRs sign away permanent residency status) or I-275s.
Talk about the government playing dirty tricks. This is what was meant by case-by-case waiver -- in the so-called "national interest" -- for US LPRs with citizenship (dual or otherwise) of the blacklisted countries?
If you're an LPR and sign the I-407, you better be sure you know you're signing away your chance to stay here or perhaps to ever return here.
http://www.scpr.org/news/2017/01/30/...s-to-sign-awa/
Amongst the stuff that goes on while people are being pressured to sign I-407s, this kind of stuff can happen: http://www.scarymommy.com/immigratio...rs-at-airport/
Talk about the government playing dirty tricks. This is what was meant by case-by-case waiver -- in the so-called "national interest" -- for US LPRs with citizenship (dual or otherwise) of the blacklisted countries?
If you're an LPR and sign the I-407, you better be sure you know you're signing away your chance to stay here or perhaps to ever return here.
http://www.scpr.org/news/2017/01/30/...s-to-sign-awa/
Amongst the stuff that goes on while people are being pressured to sign I-407s, this kind of stuff can happen: http://www.scarymommy.com/immigratio...rs-at-airport/
Last edited by GUWonder; Feb 1, 2017 at 10:26 am
Feb 1, 2017, 12:09 pm
#159
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Ramped up CBP effort to get citizens of the blacklisted countries to sign I-407s (whereby LPRs sign away permanent residency status) or I-275s.
Talk about the government playing dirty tricks. This is what was meant by case-by-case waiver -- in the so-called "national interest" -- for US LPRs with citizenship (dual or otherwise) of the blacklisted countries?
If you're an LPR and sign the I-407, you better be sure you know you're signing away your chance to stay here or perhaps to ever return here.
http://www.scpr.org/news/2017/01/30/...s-to-sign-awa/
Amongst the stuff that goes on while people are being pressured to sign I-407s, this kind of stuff can happen: http://www.scarymommy.com/immigratio...rs-at-airport/
Talk about the government playing dirty tricks. This is what was meant by case-by-case waiver -- in the so-called "national interest" -- for US LPRs with citizenship (dual or otherwise) of the blacklisted countries?
If you're an LPR and sign the I-407, you better be sure you know you're signing away your chance to stay here or perhaps to ever return here.
http://www.scpr.org/news/2017/01/30/...s-to-sign-awa/
Amongst the stuff that goes on while people are being pressured to sign I-407s, this kind of stuff can happen: http://www.scarymommy.com/immigratio...rs-at-airport/
Well actually, under the law as it actually exists the agents should just back down, but the "advantage" I suppose is to avoid being put into removal and imprisoned (I try not to say "detention" or "detained") until (after Gods only know how long) either a corrupt judge orders removal or an honest judge dismisses the case).
Feb 1, 2017, 12:23 pm
#160
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US LPRs with citizenship from the blacklisted countries no longer need a waiver to travel to/from/enter the US.
Feb 1, 2017, 2:36 pm
#161
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Just saw this from CBP.
2. Does this Executive Order apply to green card holders from one of the seven countries listed?
Yes - if the green card holder (a Lawful Permanent Resident, or LPR) was out of the country at the time of the order’s signing, or travels out of the country after the order was signed. However, green card holders are eligible for national interest waivers consistent with the provisions of the Executive Order. It does not affect lawful permanent residents who are currently in the country.
In applying the provisions of the President's Executive Order, the entry of lawful permanent residents is in the national interest. Accordingly, absent significant derogatory information indicating a serious threat to public safety and welfare, lawful permanent resident status will be a dispositive factor in our case-by-case determinations.
https://www.cbp.gov/border-security/...-united-states
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2. Does this Executive Order apply to green card holders from one of the seven countries listed?
Yes - if the green card holder (a Lawful Permanent Resident, or LPR) was out of the country at the time of the order’s signing, or travels out of the country after the order was signed. However, green card holders are eligible for national interest waivers consistent with the provisions of the Executive Order. It does not affect lawful permanent residents who are currently in the country.
In applying the provisions of the President's Executive Order, the entry of lawful permanent residents is in the national interest. Accordingly, absent significant derogatory information indicating a serious threat to public safety and welfare, lawful permanent resident status will be a dispositive factor in our case-by-case determinations.
https://www.cbp.gov/border-security/...-united-states
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http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...e-order-234505,
Does anyone think that, with the inconsistencies and unknown nature of the orders, that in some situations, it may be worthwhile for people returning to fly through a pre-clearance airport? The benefit seems to be that these people would not be detained if they are unable to travel and Canada seemed to indicate that they would take at least some of the people who cannot enter the US.
Which courts have jurisdiction over pre-clearance airports? Would they be considered part of the Federal Circuit? The DC Circuit?
Feb 1, 2017, 2:54 pm
#162
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T the US.
Feb 1, 2017, 3:14 pm
#163
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According to this article, Irish authorities have said that they have no jurisdiction over US policies being implemented at pre-clearance facilities in Ireland. http://www.irishtimes.com/news/polit...orts-1.2958610
If a pre-clearance agent acts in a way inconsistent with US law in Ireland, one can't go to the Irish court to challenge it. Which US court would have jurisdiction to hear the case?
Feb 1, 2017, 3:55 pm
#164
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I don't understand exactly how this works. Say an official at a pre-clearance facility is breaking a US law. Which court would one go to to challenge this?
According to this article, Irish authorities have said that they have no jurisdiction over US policies being implemented at pre-clearance facilities in Ireland. http://www.irishtimes.com/news/polit...orts-1.2958610
If a pre-clearance agent acts in a way inconsistent with US law in Ireland, one can't go to the Irish court to challenge it. Which US court would have jurisdiction to hear the case?
According to this article, Irish authorities have said that they have no jurisdiction over US policies being implemented at pre-clearance facilities in Ireland. http://www.irishtimes.com/news/polit...orts-1.2958610
If a pre-clearance agent acts in a way inconsistent with US law in Ireland, one can't go to the Irish court to challenge it. Which US court would have jurisdiction to hear the case?
Feb 1, 2017, 5:15 pm
#165
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LA Times and BBC Persian both reported around 4:30 EST that there's a California injunction claiming nationwide jurisdiction now that should apply to all immigrant visa holders (e.g. spouses of USCs yet to make first entry). Is this ruling just going to be ignored by the airline contractors and CBP, as seems to be happening with the Massachusetts ruling that also appeared to cover nonimmigrant visa holders?