petaluma1

Out of curiosity, had you been asked if you had anything organic in your carry-on, how would you have answered? I've read of more than a handful of people (including Mr. Vanderklok) being asked that question*, answering "no" never considering the protein bars to be organic and then being threatened and subjected to the whole shebang because their response was "not truthful".

Organic matter

*There seemed to be a spate of "organic matter" questions for a while and I wondered if this was designed purposefully so that screeners could do more invasive screenings, knowing most people would answer "no".


File a complaint with the DHS IG: https://www.oig.dhs.gov/hotline/hotline.php

yandosan

After 6 pleasant months in Thailand some Customs <redacted> at LAX freaked
out over some Thai beach sand at the bottom of my backpack,
insisting it was "organic" until his colleague told him to shut up.
What's the obsession over organic matter, anyway? I don't get it.
I think these guys have watched too many CSI shows...<redacted>

Carl Johnson

An example of the integrity of TSA clerks in general can be found in the TSA blog's response to Vanderklok's acquittal (on the ground that the [perjured] testimony of the TSA clerk, even if true, did not give evidence of a crime), and his suit against the TSA over the false arrest:

http://blog.tsa.gov/2015/02/response...arrest-at.html

Excerpt:

Mr. Vanderklok was arrested on January 26, 2013 on a charge (supported by a perjured statement) of making terroristic threats, and was only released 23 hours later, after posting $40,000 bond. The TSA Blog post, which came two years after the arrest, and after the acquittal and suit, avoided mentioning the acquittal and tried to make the arrest appear legitimate. This behavior shows both the clumsiness and the dishonesty of the members of the TSA blog team. And the OP's experience, really, is an instance of corruption. The TSA clerk used his position for personal reasons - he took actions that were directed not toward providing security, but only to abuse a passenger, or to make himself feel important - who knows. This is the same fundamental lack of integrity that infects the TSA blog, and such wasting of time and focus on issues other than correct, courteous screening, is the reason that the TSA misses 95% of all weapons presented at checkpoints.

cbn42

Everyone has organic matter with them in their bags. Books are made of paper. Many things are packaged in cardboard. Any liquid in the 3-1-1 bag probably has some amount of dissolved organic matter.

But back to the topic of this thread, I've flown out of several smaller airports and I've noticed a couple of them have had stricter-than-normal security checks, probably due to the lack of passengers and the agents trying to justify their own jobs. They don't feel the pressure to keep the lines moving like at larger hubs. But there are certainly many smaller airports where this doesn't happen.

petaluma1

Of course they do, but when TSA asks if they have anything organic in your bag, most people are going to think of some kind of fruit or plant material, not books or granola bars.

I'd wager that most screeners don't have a clue what organic matter is and if the traveler answered "yes" and went on to list all the organic items in his/her bag, there would be trouble big time at the checkpoint, with threats of arrests or fines.

chollie

If they ask about 'organic' matter, I'm going to ask 'what do you mean by organic'?

If you ask me anywhere besides the checkpoint if I have anything 'organic', I automatically assume you mean 'organic' food/products. If I have a non-organic apple and a Snickers bar, I wouldn't answer 'yes'.

If TSA asks me, I answer the same way I do when they ask me if I have anything sharp in my bag: not that I can think of.

After all, I usually have books and papers in my bag. I have sustained a few nasty paper cuts over the years when I happened to reach into my own bag the wrong way. I've even cut myself on the edge of my home-printed BP. Paper cuts on finger tips are not only nasty, they could get me arrested at the check point if I failed to declare the sharp-edged paper in my bag.

Boggie Dog

In today's world the term organic can mean different things. At the grocers one apple may be organic and another not. Perhaps TSA should ask the question in another way.

Flaflyer

The non metal components in a bag are made of plastic and man made fabric, which are made from oil, which makes the entire bag itself "organic" from the chemistry definition of "contains carbon."

FliesWay2Much

Do you have to take high school chemistry for a GED?

84fiero

Not that I in any way agree with this TSA ridiculousness, and I would have reacted similarly in your shoes - but as an aside, the sand at some beaches can consist heavily of calcium carbonate from ground up shells. Still, a TSA clerk shouldn't be claiming to know the composition of a given bit of sand, much less hassling you about it.

Seems like a reasonable response to their silly question.

Loren Pechtel

Organic matter?

My backpack is primarily nylon. That's derived from oil--it's organic.

manneca

Organic in a chemistry sense refers to carbon compounds (with some exceptions). So, anything made from anything that ever lived is organic. Are you wearing wool? Cotton? Linen? Leather? Are you carrying coffee? You, of course, are organic.

I was coming back from a diving vacation and everything in my camera bag was swabbed and then everything was taken apart and examined. The TSA person said that the swabs had revealed "unexpected organic results".

RadioGirl

Oh, great, bring actual science into the argument and confuse everyone.

In TSA land, "organic" is one of those words (like "respect" or "voluntary") that they just say without really knowing what it means.

My office cafeteria once stocked a brand of (unflavored) bottled water labeled "Organic H20". After a bunch of scientifically literate staff said "oooh, yuck, I'm not drinking that!" and explained what organic meant, the cafeteria switched to a different brand.

:D!

I wouldn't drink "organic H-twenty" either

GUWonder

Jet fuel is organic. Need those hydrocarbons to get me around. When will we see "USDA organic" jet fuel at an airport near us soon? Maybe after the turf wars -- or is it tarmac wars??? -- the DHS can regulate that too.

The country -- and the world -- has an education and labor market deficit/dynamic that shows up in various ways at airports too. This is just one way. But the audience for these questions is also part of the issue, since colloquialial vernacular and scientific language are separated by a deep chasm in some ways.