US pre-clearance in German airports
Oct 1, 2014, 4:03 pm
#106
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The question is whether more Europeans will buy into the paranoia or not; and the other question is how many others will concede to US Government interests in this regard. The UK wants in on it, but others are not so keen on it -- at least not prior to governmental intimidation.
DHS/CBP is serious and pushing hard for this because of paranoia about terrorists and asylum seekers.
Some European countries are being told something like this: if you don't do as we in the US want in this regard and a terrorist attack happens in or on the way to the US as a result of CBP not stopping a terrorist coming from Europe, then there will be consequences for your country; and those consequences may involve calls to yank the US VWP or to otherwise allow us in the US to do then what we in the US want to do now.
The EU can't really threaten Turkey and some MENA countries with a whole lot that is meaningful, so they are left policing borders in more traditional ways, including increasingly at the gate/jetbridge on arrival. The US, on the other hand, is not beyond getting creative in intimidation efforts against TATL "partners".
Some European countries are being told something like this: if you don't do as we in the US want in this regard and a terrorist attack happens in or on the way to the US as a result of CBP not stopping a terrorist coming from Europe, then there will be consequences for your country; and those consequences may involve calls to yank the US VWP or to otherwise allow us in the US to do then what we in the US want to do now.
The EU can't really threaten Turkey and some MENA countries with a whole lot that is meaningful, so they are left policing borders in more traditional ways, including increasingly at the gate/jetbridge on arrival. The US, on the other hand, is not beyond getting creative in intimidation efforts against TATL "partners".
Last edited by GUWonder; Oct 1, 2014 at 4:11 pm
Oct 1, 2014, 4:06 pm
#107
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Some European countries are being told something like this: if you don't do as we in the US want in this regard and a terrorist attack happens in or on the way to the US as a result of CBP not stopping a terrorist coming from Europe, then there will be consequences for your country; and those consequences may involve calls to yank the US VWP or to otherwise allow us in the US to do then what we in the US want to do now.
Oct 1, 2014, 4:23 pm
#108
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If you want emails and recorded conversations that can be shared, I'm not the one to supply such things. If I find public records which confirm what I know about this, then I will do like I did earlier in this thread: I'll supply publicly confirming elements like I did earlier in this thread.
If you want to know if I'm willing to bet my life on such exchanges taking place prior to finding a URL or to violating individuals' personal confidence/exchanges (by attributing or making attribution easy) on this matter, then let's just say I'm not expecting to be struck by lightning for mentioning what I know and I'm not going to set up people for informing me.
Oct 1, 2014, 4:46 pm
#109
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Oct 1, 2014, 4:52 pm
#110
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Oct 2, 2014, 2:42 am
#112
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Interesting article in this weeks Spiegel on the work of the CBP agents (it seems there are always 4 of them in FRA) working the departures to the US:
http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutsc...-a-994176.html
Sorry its in German and mostly pay per view. It basically talks about the interference of the officers in the departure process and how they advice the airlines to deny certain pax the right to board the flight without any reason.
Interesting was the end of the article: the CBP/DHS started talks with the German Interior ministry (BMI) about the possibility preclearance facilities in Germany and its seems the German government rejected the idea very early on as it is absolutely not in line with German data protection laws and runs afoul of a few other laws. So no preclearance in Germany for a while ^
http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutsc...-a-994176.html
Sorry its in German and mostly pay per view. It basically talks about the interference of the officers in the departure process and how they advice the airlines to deny certain pax the right to board the flight without any reason.
Interesting was the end of the article: the CBP/DHS started talks with the German Interior ministry (BMI) about the possibility preclearance facilities in Germany and its seems the German government rejected the idea very early on as it is absolutely not in line with German data protection laws and runs afoul of a few other laws. So no preclearance in Germany for a while ^
Oct 2, 2014, 2:59 am
#113
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Interesting article in this weeks Spiegel on the work of the CBP agents (it seems there are always 4 of them in FRA) working the departures to the US:
http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutsc...-a-994176.html
Sorry its in German and mostly pay per view. It basically talks about the interference of the officers in the departure process and how they advice the airlines to deny certain pax the right to board the flight without any reason.
Interesting was the end of the article: the CBP/DHS started talks with the German Interior ministry (BMI) about the possibility preclearance facilities in Germany and its seems the German government rejected the idea very early on as it is absolutely not in line with German data protection laws and runs afoul of a few other laws. So no preclearance in Germany for a while ^
http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutsc...-a-994176.html
Sorry its in German and mostly pay per view. It basically talks about the interference of the officers in the departure process and how they advice the airlines to deny certain pax the right to board the flight without any reason.
Interesting was the end of the article: the CBP/DHS started talks with the German Interior ministry (BMI) about the possibility preclearance facilities in Germany and its seems the German government rejected the idea very early on as it is absolutely not in line with German data protection laws and runs afoul of a few other laws. So no preclearance in Germany for a while ^
If that were all the US DHS wanted, then there wouldn't be a need for such a push for a PreClearance facility agreement, as even CBP's predecessor had people available to double check things at UK and German airports. The Immigration Advisory Program (and its predecessor the Immigration Security Initiative) has a rather recent history of being in play around UK and German airports, and that was quite distinct from the current CBP PreClearance facility agreements which the US is pursuing now.
https://www.wikileaks.org/plusd/cabl...RLIN768_a.html
https://www.wikileaks.org/plusd/cabl...RLIN768_a.html
Oct 2, 2014, 3:19 am
#114
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The US Government's eager desire to expand CBP PreClearance in Europe has nothing to do with wanting to improve the processing times for passengers; nor anything to do with making for a generally better travel experience; nor anything to do to increase frequency/viability of air service or competition. This push is very different from what drove US PreClearance arrangements in Ireland, in Canada and in some other parts.
This latest, aggressive US push to expand US "homeland security" beyond US borders -- as evidenced also by public statements of the head of US Department of Homeland Security -- is about the US Government's paranoia about security-screened people flying to the US who don't need a visa to travel to the US or have a US visa already.
Most all of the people this is meant to turn away and make into a more European problem: innocent people (including Americans) who have been blacklisted in some form by (or on behalf) of my US government; and refugees/asylum seekers who have gotten a hold of someone else's valid passport that either needs no visa or already has a visa for travel to the US. We repeatedly kicked the hornets' nests nearer to you, and now we'll let those hornets and those fleeing hornets become your problem and stay your problem by expanding "US homeland security's" borders into Europe.
This is not meant to make your typical trips to the US better, so don't expect it to do that. It's meant to do anything but that.
This latest, aggressive US push to expand US "homeland security" beyond US borders -- as evidenced also by public statements of the head of US Department of Homeland Security -- is about the US Government's paranoia about security-screened people flying to the US who don't need a visa to travel to the US or have a US visa already.
Most all of the people this is meant to turn away and make into a more European problem: innocent people (including Americans) who have been blacklisted in some form by (or on behalf) of my US government; and refugees/asylum seekers who have gotten a hold of someone else's valid passport that either needs no visa or already has a visa for travel to the US. We repeatedly kicked the hornets' nests nearer to you, and now we'll let those hornets and those fleeing hornets become your problem and stay your problem by expanding "US homeland security's" borders into Europe.
This is not meant to make your typical trips to the US better, so don't expect it to do that. It's meant to do anything but that.
Feb 5, 2015, 2:47 pm
#115
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Thanks for putting that up here. I had read that PDF early last week but didn't get around to posting about that in here because there were some items in there that I needed more time to criticize.
They have something to sell, and I am not a captive audience buying into this expansion as a great thing for me during my trips back to the US.
They have something to sell, and I am not a captive audience buying into this expansion as a great thing for me during my trips back to the US.