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Old Jan 19, 2017, 8:44 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: StartinSanDiego
Please read this Wiki before posting questions in the thread.

Do not post offers or requests for referral links in this thread! The proper thread for referral offers is here.
All Chase issued cards are here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap

This thread--a continuation of previous discussions through May 2015 and December 2016--focuses on general Chase policies & practices for new applications. For information on specific Chase cards and their bonuses/terms/benefits, see the following threads and their associated wikis: Table of Contents
  1. Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?

  2. What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?

  3. Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?

  4. How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?

  5. How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?

  6. Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?

  7. Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?

  8. Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?

  9. I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?

  10. I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?

  11. I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?

  12. How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?

  13. Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?

  14. Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?

  15. Useful Chase telephone numbers

Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?
Chase does not have a known limit. However, several reports (for example) indicate that Chase is highly sensitive to multiple applications within a short time period, and that the second (or subsequent) applications run a substantial risk of being denied. In many cases, this is likely related to Chase's practice of allocating a large credit line (up to an applicant's personal maximum) when approving a new card such as the first application in a series. (See also the discussion below concerning aggregate Chase credit lines.)

What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?
Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own personal cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom, Slate & Freedom Unlimited) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened 5 or more credit cards with any card issuer in the prior 24 months ("the 5/24 rule").

For a few days in early September 2016, Chase included explicit language ("You will not be approved for this card if you have opened 5 or more bank cards in the past 24 months") on the application page for the Sapphire Reserve card--and then promptly removed it. The absence of this language on landing/application pages for the CSR or any other Chase card is not a reliable indicator of whether the 5/24 policy applies.

See the next section for co-branded cards exempt from the 5/24 policy, and the later section discussing potential ways around 5/24.

Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?
Previously the rule did not apply to applications for the Ink Plus business card or to co-branded cards such as United, Hyatt, IHG, etc. However, on May 22, 2016 Chase extended its 5/24 rule to cover Ink business cards and some co-branded cards. (Note that there were premature reports that Chase Ink Plus would be made subject to the rule in March 2016 (which did not happen), and that all co-branded cards would follow in April 2016 (also did not happen).)

Although we had numerous reports of applications prior to May 22 being denied for a United/Hyatt/IHG/WN card by a CSR citing the 5/24 rule, the available evidence strongly suggested that those applicants had other serious issues--multiple Chase applications in a short period; large existing Chase credit line--and that overzealous CSRs gratuitously (and erroneously) invoked the 5/24 rule in the past as an additional supposed justification for the denial. Thus, it is difficult to separate such false positives from any change in Chase policy.

Instead, the most useful data points are those where an applicant is approved for a Chase card despite being over 5/24. Since May 22, 2016, we have such reports for these co-branded cards (in order from oldest to newest for each card):
For a longer list of cards apparently not subject to 5/24, check this link:
In November 2018, Chase seems to have possibly expanded 5/24 to more cards, possibly including some mentioned above. See this link:
Please follow discussion in the thread for current updates.

How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?
The 24-month count includes personal cards opened at other banks, and even cards on which the applicant is only an authorized user and not the primary cardholder. Chase has been extremely inflexible with this policy, with agents stating that there is nothing they can do to circumvent this restriction. However, in some cases Chase may reconsider a denial if the applicant has <5 new cards excluding cards on which s/he is an authorized user. You may need to escalate to the next level of customer service agent, as many front-line agents seem to be unable or unwilling to remove the authorized user accounts from the count.

Note:

How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?
In February 2017, a FTer reported a successful application a day or two after dropping from 5/24 to 4/24. However, because Chase sometimes approves applicants who are at 5/24 exactly (see above), this data point does not conclusively prove that Chase drops cards from its calculation on the exact 24-month anniversary of the previous bonus.

Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?
No. Chase uses the information from your credit report, and closing an account doesn't make it disappear.

Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?
As to targeted mailers, we have insufficient anecdotal evidence to reach any reliable conclusions. (Reports suggesting no exemption from 5/24 here and here.)

There have been reports of people with more than 5 cards opened in the last 24 months being successful if they are already pre-approved for the card in question. To find out if you are pre-approved, you can call or go into a branch to ask. Success stories appear to be connected to Chase Private Client (CPC) status and the rollout of the Chase Sapphire Reserve card. In-branch pre-approvals (showing a green screen on the banker's computer) result in automatic approvals. Some (but not all) CPC clients had success in recon calls[[I]citation needed].

Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?
It depends. A Chase card may be "churned" when an entirely new version becomes available. For example, business cards are distinct from personal/consumer cards. Note that simple variations among bonus offers do not amount to new versions/products for purposes of this rule.

Beginning in 2014, Chase began including explicit language in most of its offers, such as the following:
This new cardmember bonus offer is not available to either (i) current cardmembers of this consumer credit card, or (ii) previous cardmembers of this consumer credit card who received a new cardmember bonus for this consumer credit card within the last 24 months.
Effective August 2018, Chase imposed stringent additional restrictions on receiving the signup bonus for any version of the Sapphire card. See Sapphire (CSR & CSP) 48 months between bonuses, August 2018 and the master threads for each card (listed above) for details and discussion.

There are four key considerations in determining whether you can churn a given card:
  • The 5/24 policy discussed in detail above.
  • The 24-month bonus waiting period--in the case of Sapphire cards, the collective 48-month period--is measured not from the date of your previous application (or approval date, if different), but instead from the date you received the signup-related bonus on the previous card, which may be 3-4 months later than the approval date. The same rule applies regardless of the type of signup bonus received (points, miles, or free-night certs); anniversary benefits unrelated to spending requirements, such as annual IHG & Marriott certs, do not count as signup bonuses.
  • If you still have your old card of the same type, you're ineligible.
  • Chase's policy does not indicate whether there is also a minimum waiting period between cancellation and reapplication, and there is not yet sufficient anecdotal evidence from FTers to draw firm conclusions. At a minimum, a prudent churner will wait at least a week or two after cancellation before reapplying so that all of Chase's systems fully reflect that closure. (See first bullet point above.) At least one FTer has reported re-applying successfully 14 days after canceling the previous card.
Finally, note that if you reapply too soon, Chase may still issue you the new card. (This differs from some other card issuers, which may deny such applications outright.) In this case, Chase typically notifies you by letter within a month or two after approval that, as a previous cardholder, you will not receive the bonus a second time.

I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?
No. Being an additional user on someone else's account poses no bar to applying for that same card & bonus, except insofar as such cards may count toward the 5/24 rule (as discussed above).

I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?
Yes.

In the past, the conventional wisdom among FTers was that you were more likely to hurt your chances by closing an account or reducing CL unilaterally. However, substantial evidence from 2014 onward strongly indicates that Chase is increasingly likely to reject applications (or at least not auto-approve them) where an applicant has an existing total credit line that is high compared to his/her income & spending patterns. (For many members, the threshold appears to be in the $45K-60K range, but that is highly speculative.)

Recent reports suggest that closing accounts and/or voluntarily reducing credit lines increases the odds of auto-approval or in-branch pre-approval. (You can do either by calling or simply sending a secure message through your Chase online account. You do not need to provide a reason for the request.) For best results, keep at least $5K-10K in excess credit; if your application is not approved, you can always contact the reconsideration department and offer to reallocate that portion of your existing credit line. Note: despite allowing credit line to be moved between personal and business accounts in the past, Chase is no longer permitting such reallocation in either direction.

With respect to timing, it is better to reduce any CL as soon as you can conveniently do so, e.g., after meeting the bonus spend on a card you do not plan to use regularly thereafter. (Do not reduce CL on a given card if it would increase your "credit utiilization"--that is, the ratio of outstanding balance to CL--above ~30%. A high credit utilization number is a red flag for banks and can adversely affect your credit score.) Waiting until one's next application to lower a CL is less than optimal, as the reduced CL is not immediately recognized by all of Chase's systems.

There is no known minimum wait between lowering a CL and having the freed-up amount become available for purposes of a new application. A prudent applicant will, as recommended above, plan well in advance; failing that, an applicant would be wise to wait at least 24 hours between lowering a CL and applying for a new card.

I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?
It may be better to avoid calling Chase unless your application is denied. Many recent calls on pending applications led to denials, and many people report having success letting applications work their way through the system. Be patient. Time is on your side; increasingly, Chase CSRs are not.

If you do call, expect extensive and possibly hostile questioning. Be prepared to answer questions regarding the need for more credit, past credit apps for both Chase and other banks, income, business finances, etc. Know your CLs with Chase before you call so you know which card/s you are willing to decrease the CLs on. If the app is for a significant other who dislikes such calls, they can authorize you to speak on their behalf and hand the phone over to you.

How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?
Just send Chase a secure message (SM) through your online account. Although the deadline should in theory be N months from the date of approval (not the date of application or card activation)--where N is the number of months specified in the offer--Chase typically pads this period to account for the time required to fabricate and deliver physical cards. For example, a recent "3-month" deadline was in fact 114 days, as confirmed by Chase's SM confirmation.

Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?
Bonus points typically accrue at the close of the billing period in which you incur the corresponding charges. Points should appear in your hotel/airline account within a few days thereafter.

NOTE: If you complete your required spending in the last 7-10 days of the statement period, the bonus may not post until the following month's statement, even if the regular per-dollar points post on the first statement. This is normal behavior for Chase and is not worth a phone call.

Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?
Useful Chase telephone numbers
(800) 432-3117 – General Application Status Line, automated
(800) 436-7927 – Alternative General Application Status Line, automated
(888) 609-7805 – Alternative Personal Reconsideration line with live rep
(888) 269-8690 - Business Credit Card Application Status Line, automated
(800) 453-9719 – Business Credit Card Reconsideration Line with live rep
(800) 955-9900 – General Card Services and Application status, automated
(888) 298-5623 – Credit Reallocation Office (Personal cards)
(800) 453-9719 – Credit Reallocation Office (Business cards)
(888) 622-7547 – Executive Offices
(877) 470-9042 – Personal Application Verification line with live rep
Twitter: @ChaseSupport
Note: In the past, automated telephone status reports stating that Chase would notify you in 2 weeks often resulted in an approval, whereas the "7-10 days" telephone recording often indicated imminent denial. In 2016, this pattern became increasingly unpredictable, with many applicants receiving approval despite an earlier "7-10 days" automated telephone message. As a result, automated telephone responses should not be regarded as reliable indicators of an application's likely outcome.
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Applying for Chase Credit Cards, 2017-2019

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Old Jun 26, 2017, 5:24 pm
  #826  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: On strike
Posts: 8,135
Originally Posted by jediwho
I think above 60K is when they start getting nervous.
Have you read the discussion in the wiki on this subject?
beltway is offline  
Old Jun 27, 2017, 9:39 am
  #827  
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: DEN
Programs: Hilton Diamond Hyatt Globalist Marriott Gold AA EXP
Posts: 1,012
Originally Posted by duranza
Just applied and approved for the Hyatt. ( not under the 5/24 rule). looks like their bonus of 2 free night ends June 29th
Is this true?
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Old Jun 27, 2017, 2:09 pm
  #828  
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
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Originally Posted by bbriscoe34
Is this true?
Just google it.. a bunch of reports say so.

https://thepointsguy.com/2017/06/hya...drops-june-29/

dropping from two free nights at any Hyatt property in the world to 40,000 points
duranza is offline  
Old Jun 28, 2017, 12:59 pm
  #829  
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: DEN
Programs: Hilton Diamond Hyatt Globalist Marriott Gold AA EXP
Posts: 1,012
Does anyone else get their chase.com account locked out whenever they apply for a new card?

My wife's has been locked twice in the past two days - just after she applied for 2 different cards. I'm wondering if it is related.
bbriscoe34 is offline  
Old Jun 28, 2017, 1:20 pm
  #830  
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 488
Wife was at 4/24 counting only primary cards when she got a denial letter for the UA Explorer card, which stated that she had too many cards "associated with" her in the last 2 years..." She had 2 AU cards where I was the primary (both closed) that were opened Nov 2015. We called Recon and explained that she wasn't responsible for paying the charges on those 2 AU cards, then she got approved.

I stopped getting AU cards in wife's name a while back when I learned they were counting AU cards in determining 5/24 status.

Meanwhile, I had 6/24 primary cards and I applied for a Marriott Biz card. I got a message saying they needed more time to review my app, but within a few days, I was approved.
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Old Jun 28, 2017, 1:58 pm
  #831  
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Posts: 25,933
Originally Posted by Long Islander
Meanwhile, I had 6/24 primary cards and I applied for a Marriott Biz card. I got a message saying they needed more time to review my app, but within a few days, I was approved.
It's known that the Marriott biz card isn't subject to 5/24. (The Marriott personal cards are subject to 5/24.)
sdsearch is offline  
Old Jun 28, 2017, 2:43 pm
  #832  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: SJC/SFO
Programs: WN A+ CP, UA 1MM/*A Gold, Mar LT Tit, IHG Plat, HH Dia
Posts: 6,284
Originally Posted by darthbimmer
I applied for the Marriott Business card recently. I am at 10/24. The application seemed pickier than last time I applied for a biz card. Went pending. Per advice in this thread and my own experience with hostile Chase reps I am not going call recon. Well, at least not for a week or two.
Update: A few business days have passed with no word back from Chase. Just yesterday, however, I was checking my Marriott Rewards account and noticed that a bonus of 15 elite qualifying nights (an annual benefit of the card) had been posted. So it looks like my MR business card has been approved. I wonder if Chase will ever notify me... other than via the arrival of my card in the mail in 7-10 more days.
darthbimmer is offline  
Old Jun 28, 2017, 6:45 pm
  #833  
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 43
How long do you have to wait after canceling a card before signing up for the same card again to get the bonus?

I just canceled my Hyatt card two days ago, but kind of want to get in for 2 more free nights before the bonus changes.
thinkorswim is offline  
Old Jun 28, 2017, 8:54 pm
  #834  
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Join Date: Aug 2002
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Originally Posted by thinkorswim
How long do you have to wait after canceling a card before signing up for the same card again to get the bonus?

I just canceled my Hyatt card two days ago, but kind of want to get in for 2 more free nights before the bonus changes.
Please read the WIKI above. All your answers are there.
philemer is offline  
Old Jun 29, 2017, 8:51 am
  #835  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,784
Originally Posted by philemer
Please read the WIKI above. All your answers are there.
The short answer is 2 years from the date you got the sign up bonus on the previous card. AFAIK, as long as it's been cancelled, when you cancelled the card is irrelevant.
RobertHanson is offline  
Old Jun 29, 2017, 10:08 am
  #836  
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 5
I'm currently at 4/24 but would like to optimize my strategy to obtain the Southwest companion pass for 2018/2019. Am I able to apply for the Business Premier today (assuming this maintains 4/24), then apply for both the Personal Premier and Plus in December?

Not sure if it was possible to get all 3 cards in one calendar year assuming under 5/24.
USP45expert is offline  
Old Jun 30, 2017, 8:13 am
  #837  
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Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Intermountain West
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Originally Posted by USP45expert
I'm currently at 4/24 but would like to optimize my strategy to obtain the Southwest companion pass for 2018/2019. Am I able to apply for the Business Premier today (assuming this maintains 4/24), then apply for both the Personal Premier and Plus in December?

Not sure if it was possible to get all 3 cards in one calendar year assuming under 5/24.
Sure, it's 'possible' to get 3 Chase cards in 12 months. YMMV of course. Getting 2 in one month would be a tougher chore, IMO. I'd try to wait 30 days, or more, between apps.
philemer is offline  
Old Jun 30, 2017, 11:32 am
  #838  
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 17
Applied for Southwest Premier card yesterday at 2/24. Got the Plus card back in February. Lowered credit limit by $8k an hour before applying. 30 day by mail notice. Consensus is don't call yet, yes?
cyntax is offline  
Old Jun 30, 2017, 4:53 pm
  #839  
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 480
Hi Gang,

Need a check on my understanding on 2/30.

On 5/31/17 I applied for a CSP for girlfriend (who was 0/24) and she was auto approved with a $10K limit. Date activated is 6/2/17.

On 6/25/17 I applied in girlfriend's name for both SWA Plus and Premier cards. She was auto approved for the Plus with a $23K limit. But we got the denial letter today (6/30/17) for the Premier. We applied for these cards on Sunday 6/25, but the denial letter is dated Monday 6/26/17.

Is the rule of "no more than 2 cards in 30 days" from the initial date of application of the first card or date activated?

Plan was to recon the second SWA card and reallocate credit from the first to the second card, but I am just trying to figure out when specifically I'd be at day 31. By my
count, tomorrow (7/1/17) would be day 31 from application of CSP.

Thanks all!
purdue1015 is offline  
Old Jul 2, 2017, 8:22 pm
  #840  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Intermountain West
Programs: Too many to list
Posts: 12,080
Originally Posted by purdue1015
Hi Gang,

Need a check on my understanding on 2/30.

On 5/31/17 I applied for a CSP for girlfriend (who was 0/24) and she was auto approved with a $10K limit. Date activated is 6/2/17.

On 6/25/17 I applied in girlfriend's name for both SWA Plus and Premier cards. She was auto approved for the Plus with a $23K limit. But we got the denial letter today (6/30/17) for the Premier. We applied for these cards on Sunday 6/25, but the denial letter is dated Monday 6/26/17.

Is the rule of "no more than 2 cards in 30 days" from the initial date of application of the first card or date activated?

Plan was to recon the second SWA card and reallocate credit from the first to the second card, but I am just trying to figure out when specifically I'd be at day 31. By my
count, tomorrow (7/1/17) would be day 31 from application of CSP.

Thanks all!
Basically, your GF applied for 3 Chase cards in a 26 day period (5/31>5/25)? I'm not surprised she was turned down for the last one. There is no "2 cards in 30 days" rule. It's a guideline. It is always YMMV. But prudent people don't get greedy. A safe way to play the game with Chase is to wait over a month between apps. Quit counting days and slow down. I would wait 30+ days from 6/25, not 5/31. Just my .02.

Also, I'd suggest rereading the wiki post at the top of the thread. Good luck and let us know how the recon call goes. Prepare her for some tough questions.
philemer is offline  


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