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Old Jan 19, 2017, 8:44 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: StartinSanDiego
Please read this Wiki before posting questions in the thread.

Do not post offers or requests for referral links in this thread! The proper thread for referral offers is here.
All Chase issued cards are here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap

This thread--a continuation of previous discussions through May 2015 and December 2016--focuses on general Chase policies & practices for new applications. For information on specific Chase cards and their bonuses/terms/benefits, see the following threads and their associated wikis: Table of Contents
  1. Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?

  2. What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?

  3. Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?

  4. How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?

  5. How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?

  6. Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?

  7. Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?

  8. Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?

  9. I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?

  10. I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?

  11. I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?

  12. How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?

  13. Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?

  14. Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?

  15. Useful Chase telephone numbers

Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?
Chase does not have a known limit. However, several reports (for example) indicate that Chase is highly sensitive to multiple applications within a short time period, and that the second (or subsequent) applications run a substantial risk of being denied. In many cases, this is likely related to Chase's practice of allocating a large credit line (up to an applicant's personal maximum) when approving a new card such as the first application in a series. (See also the discussion below concerning aggregate Chase credit lines.)

What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?
Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own personal cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom, Slate & Freedom Unlimited) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened 5 or more credit cards with any card issuer in the prior 24 months ("the 5/24 rule").

For a few days in early September 2016, Chase included explicit language ("You will not be approved for this card if you have opened 5 or more bank cards in the past 24 months") on the application page for the Sapphire Reserve card--and then promptly removed it. The absence of this language on landing/application pages for the CSR or any other Chase card is not a reliable indicator of whether the 5/24 policy applies.

See the next section for co-branded cards exempt from the 5/24 policy, and the later section discussing potential ways around 5/24.

Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?
Previously the rule did not apply to applications for the Ink Plus business card or to co-branded cards such as United, Hyatt, IHG, etc. However, on May 22, 2016 Chase extended its 5/24 rule to cover Ink business cards and some co-branded cards. (Note that there were premature reports that Chase Ink Plus would be made subject to the rule in March 2016 (which did not happen), and that all co-branded cards would follow in April 2016 (also did not happen).)

Although we had numerous reports of applications prior to May 22 being denied for a United/Hyatt/IHG/WN card by a CSR citing the 5/24 rule, the available evidence strongly suggested that those applicants had other serious issues--multiple Chase applications in a short period; large existing Chase credit line--and that overzealous CSRs gratuitously (and erroneously) invoked the 5/24 rule in the past as an additional supposed justification for the denial. Thus, it is difficult to separate such false positives from any change in Chase policy.

Instead, the most useful data points are those where an applicant is approved for a Chase card despite being over 5/24. Since May 22, 2016, we have such reports for these co-branded cards (in order from oldest to newest for each card):
For a longer list of cards apparently not subject to 5/24, check this link:
In November 2018, Chase seems to have possibly expanded 5/24 to more cards, possibly including some mentioned above. See this link:
Please follow discussion in the thread for current updates.

How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?
The 24-month count includes personal cards opened at other banks, and even cards on which the applicant is only an authorized user and not the primary cardholder. Chase has been extremely inflexible with this policy, with agents stating that there is nothing they can do to circumvent this restriction. However, in some cases Chase may reconsider a denial if the applicant has <5 new cards excluding cards on which s/he is an authorized user. You may need to escalate to the next level of customer service agent, as many front-line agents seem to be unable or unwilling to remove the authorized user accounts from the count.

Note:

How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?
In February 2017, a FTer reported a successful application a day or two after dropping from 5/24 to 4/24. However, because Chase sometimes approves applicants who are at 5/24 exactly (see above), this data point does not conclusively prove that Chase drops cards from its calculation on the exact 24-month anniversary of the previous bonus.

Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?
No. Chase uses the information from your credit report, and closing an account doesn't make it disappear.

Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?
As to targeted mailers, we have insufficient anecdotal evidence to reach any reliable conclusions. (Reports suggesting no exemption from 5/24 here and here.)

There have been reports of people with more than 5 cards opened in the last 24 months being successful if they are already pre-approved for the card in question. To find out if you are pre-approved, you can call or go into a branch to ask. Success stories appear to be connected to Chase Private Client (CPC) status and the rollout of the Chase Sapphire Reserve card. In-branch pre-approvals (showing a green screen on the banker's computer) result in automatic approvals. Some (but not all) CPC clients had success in recon calls[[I]citation needed].

Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?
It depends. A Chase card may be "churned" when an entirely new version becomes available. For example, business cards are distinct from personal/consumer cards. Note that simple variations among bonus offers do not amount to new versions/products for purposes of this rule.

Beginning in 2014, Chase began including explicit language in most of its offers, such as the following:
This new cardmember bonus offer is not available to either (i) current cardmembers of this consumer credit card, or (ii) previous cardmembers of this consumer credit card who received a new cardmember bonus for this consumer credit card within the last 24 months.
Effective August 2018, Chase imposed stringent additional restrictions on receiving the signup bonus for any version of the Sapphire card. See Sapphire (CSR & CSP) 48 months between bonuses, August 2018 and the master threads for each card (listed above) for details and discussion.

There are four key considerations in determining whether you can churn a given card:
  • The 5/24 policy discussed in detail above.
  • The 24-month bonus waiting period--in the case of Sapphire cards, the collective 48-month period--is measured not from the date of your previous application (or approval date, if different), but instead from the date you received the signup-related bonus on the previous card, which may be 3-4 months later than the approval date. The same rule applies regardless of the type of signup bonus received (points, miles, or free-night certs); anniversary benefits unrelated to spending requirements, such as annual IHG & Marriott certs, do not count as signup bonuses.
  • If you still have your old card of the same type, you're ineligible.
  • Chase's policy does not indicate whether there is also a minimum waiting period between cancellation and reapplication, and there is not yet sufficient anecdotal evidence from FTers to draw firm conclusions. At a minimum, a prudent churner will wait at least a week or two after cancellation before reapplying so that all of Chase's systems fully reflect that closure. (See first bullet point above.) At least one FTer has reported re-applying successfully 14 days after canceling the previous card.
Finally, note that if you reapply too soon, Chase may still issue you the new card. (This differs from some other card issuers, which may deny such applications outright.) In this case, Chase typically notifies you by letter within a month or two after approval that, as a previous cardholder, you will not receive the bonus a second time.

I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?
No. Being an additional user on someone else's account poses no bar to applying for that same card & bonus, except insofar as such cards may count toward the 5/24 rule (as discussed above).

I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?
Yes.

In the past, the conventional wisdom among FTers was that you were more likely to hurt your chances by closing an account or reducing CL unilaterally. However, substantial evidence from 2014 onward strongly indicates that Chase is increasingly likely to reject applications (or at least not auto-approve them) where an applicant has an existing total credit line that is high compared to his/her income & spending patterns. (For many members, the threshold appears to be in the $45K-60K range, but that is highly speculative.)

Recent reports suggest that closing accounts and/or voluntarily reducing credit lines increases the odds of auto-approval or in-branch pre-approval. (You can do either by calling or simply sending a secure message through your Chase online account. You do not need to provide a reason for the request.) For best results, keep at least $5K-10K in excess credit; if your application is not approved, you can always contact the reconsideration department and offer to reallocate that portion of your existing credit line. Note: despite allowing credit line to be moved between personal and business accounts in the past, Chase is no longer permitting such reallocation in either direction.

With respect to timing, it is better to reduce any CL as soon as you can conveniently do so, e.g., after meeting the bonus spend on a card you do not plan to use regularly thereafter. (Do not reduce CL on a given card if it would increase your "credit utiilization"--that is, the ratio of outstanding balance to CL--above ~30%. A high credit utilization number is a red flag for banks and can adversely affect your credit score.) Waiting until one's next application to lower a CL is less than optimal, as the reduced CL is not immediately recognized by all of Chase's systems.

There is no known minimum wait between lowering a CL and having the freed-up amount become available for purposes of a new application. A prudent applicant will, as recommended above, plan well in advance; failing that, an applicant would be wise to wait at least 24 hours between lowering a CL and applying for a new card.

I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?
It may be better to avoid calling Chase unless your application is denied. Many recent calls on pending applications led to denials, and many people report having success letting applications work their way through the system. Be patient. Time is on your side; increasingly, Chase CSRs are not.

If you do call, expect extensive and possibly hostile questioning. Be prepared to answer questions regarding the need for more credit, past credit apps for both Chase and other banks, income, business finances, etc. Know your CLs with Chase before you call so you know which card/s you are willing to decrease the CLs on. If the app is for a significant other who dislikes such calls, they can authorize you to speak on their behalf and hand the phone over to you.

How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?
Just send Chase a secure message (SM) through your online account. Although the deadline should in theory be N months from the date of approval (not the date of application or card activation)--where N is the number of months specified in the offer--Chase typically pads this period to account for the time required to fabricate and deliver physical cards. For example, a recent "3-month" deadline was in fact 114 days, as confirmed by Chase's SM confirmation.

Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?
Bonus points typically accrue at the close of the billing period in which you incur the corresponding charges. Points should appear in your hotel/airline account within a few days thereafter.

NOTE: If you complete your required spending in the last 7-10 days of the statement period, the bonus may not post until the following month's statement, even if the regular per-dollar points post on the first statement. This is normal behavior for Chase and is not worth a phone call.

Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?
Useful Chase telephone numbers
(800) 432-3117 – General Application Status Line, automated
(800) 436-7927 – Alternative General Application Status Line, automated
(888) 609-7805 – Alternative Personal Reconsideration line with live rep
(888) 269-8690 - Business Credit Card Application Status Line, automated
(800) 453-9719 – Business Credit Card Reconsideration Line with live rep
(800) 955-9900 – General Card Services and Application status, automated
(888) 298-5623 – Credit Reallocation Office (Personal cards)
(800) 453-9719 – Credit Reallocation Office (Business cards)
(888) 622-7547 – Executive Offices
(877) 470-9042 – Personal Application Verification line with live rep
Twitter: @ChaseSupport
Note: In the past, automated telephone status reports stating that Chase would notify you in 2 weeks often resulted in an approval, whereas the "7-10 days" telephone recording often indicated imminent denial. In 2016, this pattern became increasingly unpredictable, with many applicants receiving approval despite an earlier "7-10 days" automated telephone message. As a result, automated telephone responses should not be regarded as reliable indicators of an application's likely outcome.
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Applying for Chase Credit Cards, 2017-2019

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Old Jan 5, 2017, 2:21 pm
  #31  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Carolina Beach, NC
Programs: Hiltonhonors gold, Priority Club platimum, Club Carlson gold, Marriott gold
Posts: 108
Yes, the CSP was my 6th in 24. I was shocked when I got instant approval for that card. I just didn't know if I would be pushing it by trying to apply for the CSR. It looks like in the T/C's that they can close your accounts if it looks like you are getting cards just for points. Which I kinda am but I have at least 10K spend on a couple of the cards.
beggsmoore is offline  
Old Jan 5, 2017, 2:25 pm
  #32  
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: BOS
Programs: MR, UR, AA, AS, HH Gold, SPG Gold, HGP, RR
Posts: 708
Just got an instant approval on the CSR 100K app.

I have 5/24 exactly with nothing set to age off until next June but when I saw that the offer was being reduced soon I decided to chance it.

Data points that may or may not be relevant:

Of the 5, one of the accounts was closed after a year (6/16) and one is not really a cc although it looks like one on my report. It shows up as Wells Fargo revolving but is really a furniture store account.

I have several Chase accounts including my mortgage and current CF and Ink cards but no bank accounts with them as they have no branches in my state.

I canceled my CSP last year after 5 years and did not move the 20K+ credit line, just let it drop

My credit score is over 800

No apps in past 6 months

I hope this info helps someone else.
SquarePeg is offline  
Old Jan 5, 2017, 8:55 pm
  #33  
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2
Chase's 2x30 Rule & Targeted IHG Offer?

I'm 6/24, with my last two cards being CSP & CFU. I applied and was instantly approved for both cards on 12/14 through Chase's pre-qualified page.

I've also received an email offer from IHG for 100k points. I'd like to apply, but the offer says it expires on 1/13. By my count, that would be exactly 30 days after I received 2 Chase cards.

Between this being a targeted offer and being exactly 30 days after I was last approved for a Chase card, I'm wondering if anyone has a guess on the likelihood that this app would trigger an automatic denial for too many applications within 30 days.

Anyone have any insight here?

EDIT: came across another thread that highlighted that the catch with this offer is that Chase/IHG is not waiving the annual fee and not providing the statement credit, making it only marginally better than existing best offers. Now inclined to not risk another hard pull on a potential auto-decline.

Last edited by jj879421; Jan 5, 2017 at 9:07 pm
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Old Jan 6, 2017, 5:01 am
  #34  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
Programs: Airline Free Agent, Fairmont Lifetime Platinum, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Honors Diamond
Posts: 3,041
Any bets on which bloggers will shut up about the 100k option available at the branch and only promote the 50k affiliate offer they get a sales commission on #developing
gpapadop is offline  
Old Jan 6, 2017, 6:33 am
  #35  
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: BOS
Programs: MR, UR, AA, AS, HH Gold, SPG Gold, HGP, RR
Posts: 708
Originally Posted by jj879421
I'm 6/24, with my last two cards being CSP & CFU. I applied and was instantly approved for both cards on 12/14 through Chase's pre-qualified page.

I've also received an email offer from IHG for 100k points. I'd like to apply, but the offer says it expires on 1/13. By my count, that would be exactly 30 days after I received 2 Chase cards.

Between this being a targeted offer and being exactly 30 days after I was last approved for a Chase card, I'm wondering if anyone has a guess on the likelihood that this app would trigger an automatic denial for too many applications within 30 days.

Anyone have any insight here?

EDIT: came across another thread that highlighted that the catch with this offer is that Chase/IHG is not waiving the annual fee and not providing the statement credit, making it only marginally better than existing best offers. Now inclined to not risk another hard pull on a potential auto-decline.
Where did you find the "Chase pre-qualified page"?
SquarePeg is offline  
Old Jan 6, 2017, 11:38 am
  #36  
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 731
Wife got denied for "too many accounts" although she is only 3/24. Reconsideration rep wouldn't even give her a chance to discuss options on opening the card such as reallocating credit or closing another one of her accounts. Rep was quite rude to her saying "Look, you got denied and that's the end of story. There's nothing I can do for you." She's pretty shook up by the way the rep talked to her and will try to call again tonight.
yOyOYoo is offline  
Old Jan 6, 2017, 11:49 am
  #37  
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NYC
Programs: UA, BA Avios, AMEX Plat
Posts: 497
Originally Posted by yOyOYoo
Wife got denied for "too many accounts" although she is only 3/24. Reconsideration rep wouldn't even give her a chance to discuss options on opening the card such as reallocating credit or closing another one of her accounts. Rep was quite rude to her saying "Look, you got denied and that's the end of story. There's nothing I can do for you." She's pretty shook up by the way the rep talked to her and will try to call again tonight.
Wow. Definitely call back.

My wife was denied initially too based on 5/24 but she's only 2/24 but is AU on 3 of my card. Explained that to the very friendly rep and she cleared the denial and sent it along recommending approval at second review. Will see what happens. In the rush to apply I forgot they count AUs .
eyeballer is offline  
Old Jan 6, 2017, 1:40 pm
  #38  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,431
My wife is currently 8/24 but 4 of those will fall off on 3/31, so she'll be 4/24 on 4/1. We want the Southwest CP so she would like to apply for the Chase SWA personal and business cards. Applying for just one of those cards will put her at 5/24, but what if she applies for them one immediately after the other?
DaveInLA is offline  
Old Jan 6, 2017, 2:13 pm
  #39  
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 7,903
Originally Posted by DaveInLA
My wife is currently 8/24 but 4 of those will fall off on 3/31, so she'll be 4/24 on 4/1. We want the Southwest CP so she would like to apply for the Chase SWA personal and business cards. Applying for just one of those cards will put her at 5/24, but what if she applies for them one immediately after the other?
The business card application is subject to the rule but is not counted. So if you apply for it first you will be OK. (Even if you applied for 2 personal cards though I'm not sure whether Chase would count the first one toward your total on that day.)
rrgg is offline  
Old Jan 6, 2017, 7:14 pm
  #40  
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2
Originally Posted by SquarePeg
Where did you find the "Chase pre-qualified page"?
Chase's pre-qualifed page is described here: http://www.doctorofcredit.com/view-y...-credit-cards/

But I actually meant to say the "selected offers for you" page, which I guess is different: http://www.doctorofcredit.com/new-wa...ed-datapoints/
jj879421 is offline  
Old Jan 7, 2017, 1:01 pm
  #41  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: PHX
Posts: 4,787
I'm thinking about trying to reduce my chase credit limit to see if I can get branch pre-approval on reserve before the offer downgrades.

Does anyone happen to know whether business and personal credit limits are combined (my personal card is as a sole proprietorship using my same SSN).
lkar is offline  
Old Jan 7, 2017, 5:59 pm
  #42  
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: NYC
Programs: Marriott Plat, Hilton Gold, UA Silver
Posts: 2,272
I've seen people saying both ways and I am wondering if this is a consensus yet. I am 5/24 but one of those cards is my ink plus from a year and a half ago. I want to go for the CSR but is Chase counting their own business cards as part of the 5/24?
Red259 is offline  
Old Jan 7, 2017, 6:09 pm
  #43  
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 66
Up until a few minutes ago I had the maximum amount of credit Chase is willing to give me (~$60k), will that impact the likelihood of my wife getting approved? I just lowered my line by $30k in case it does. She's either 4/24 or 5/24, but they're all AU, so I might try and steel her up and have her call if she gets denied.
Tylt33 is offline  
Old Jan 7, 2017, 10:05 pm
  #44  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: MSP
Programs: UR, RR, MileagePLus, Dividend Miles (R.I.P), AAdvantage, HHonors, IHG, Skymiles
Posts: 108
Originally Posted by Tylt33
Up until a few minutes ago I had the maximum amount of credit Chase is willing to give me (~$60k), will that impact the likelihood of my wife getting approved? I just lowered my line by $30k in case it does. She's either 4/24 or 5/24, but they're all AU, so I might try and steel her up and have her call if she gets denied.
You and your wife have different profiles with Chase. Your extended credit shouldn't affect her at all. I've reduced my CL to $5k on all Chase cards (via SM) one or two nights before I have applied for a new Chase card. I have done this several times and have got instant approvals each time.

Wife just applied for Reserve a few minutes ago and got "7-10 days pending." We did not reduce her current Chase CLs this time. Might be a coincidence.

Now I'll have to steel her up to call recon tomorrow
valuetactics is offline  
Old Jan 7, 2017, 10:35 pm
  #45  
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Programs: 747 Upper Deck QF J LAX-BNE; A380 SQ SuiteC+D SYD-SIN & SIN-HKG; 777 CX F HKG-JFK; Park Hyatt Sydney
Posts: 513
Originally Posted by valuetactics
You and your wife have different profiles with Chase. Your extended credit shouldn't affect her at all. I've reduced my CL to $5k on all Chase cards (via SM) one or two nights before I have applied for a new Chase card. I have done this several times and have got instant approvals each time.

Wife just applied for Reserve a few minutes ago and got "7-10 days pending." We did not reduce her current Chase CLs this time. Might be a coincidence.

Now I'll have to steel her up to call recon tomorrow
No need for her to be nervous, EVERYONE applying online who is not instantly approved gets a 7-10 day message. It's the message seen on the computer screen after applying where it states that if you're approved, you'll receive your card in 7-10 days. Unfortunately this has been confused over and over again with the 7-10 day message associated with calling the automated response line.

A 7-10 day message received online immediately after applying is in no way indicative of approval or denial PERIOD.
The 7-10 day message from the automated response line is the one that has the negative connotation (yes I know there have been exceptions, but that's not relevant to what I'm pointing out here).

Last edited by Ed Janowsky; Jan 7, 2017 at 10:41 pm
Ed Janowsky is offline  


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