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Chase Product Change/Card Conversion: Downgrade, Upgrade, Keep or Cancel? (2016-2019)

Old Feb 12, 2016, 8:56 am
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Last edit by: beltway
This is the general 2016-2019 thread for weighing the relative merits
of keeping, downgrading, or canceling Chase-issued credit cards.


Post-2019 discussion continues in this thread.

What's the main reason people product change (PC)?
The benefits offered by a particular card, might suit you better than the card you are holding. Many people, unable to qualify for a new Chase Sapphire Reserve application, upgraded from the Sapphire Preferred to the Sapphire Reserve, because the benefits of the CSR's cash reimbursements made the annual fee a nominal difference the first year. And vice versa- the onerous $450 yearly fee of the CSR makes an appealing case to downgrade to the Sapphire Preferred, and eventually to the no-fee Sapphire or a Freedom card.

Many people product change to avoid the annual fees on the premium versions of the card. Keeping the card open, via a product change, keeps the account open. This allows you to retain the seasoned account, and the banking relationship that the older card has established with Chase.

Why not just cancel the card and be done with it?
This may be the right choice for you, but others want some of the card benefits without having to reapply. Also, Chase has become very restrictive for new card applicants. For Chase cards, you must wait 24- 48 months since the last time you received a bonus before reapplying. Please see the threads on the individual cards for updated overlay rules.

An additional (and more stringent) overlay is the infamous 5/24 rule, which Chase instituted in May 2016 as a counter-measure against churning, or, as they refer to it, "Serial Starters." The 5/24 rule is that you won't be eligible for most Chase card products if you've opened more than 5 credit cards in 24 months. For more on this and other application-related issues, see the current "Applying for Chase Credit Cards " Master thread.

Finally, canceling certain cards--those earning Chase Ultimate Rewards--may deprive you of the ability to exchange UR for miles/points in air & hotel programs. See Ultimate Rewards transfer partners, times & rules.

Is there any way I can keep a card without paying the annual fee?
See Chase Retention Bonuses: June 2015-Present

Are there any restrictions on product changes?
Product changes are only allowed within the same card "family," and are not permitted between business and personal cards. Also, Chase cites the federal CARD Act to deny product changes on any account less that one year old.

Will a product change count as a new card?
No, you will keep your same card number, "opened on" date, credit line, automatic payment arrangements, etc. A product change does not count against Chase's 5/24 limitations on new cards.

Will I get a signup bonus when I change?
No, product changes do not result in point bonuses. Signup bonuses are reserved for new applicants only. For the complete list of public sign up offers, check the Chase sitemap here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap

Is there a place I can look to compare cards?
Go here: https://creditcards.chase.com/credit...D=177087865887
Click: All cards
Place a checkmark in the Compare box for up to three cards.
Click: Compare cards...and you should see a side-by-side display.

I've figured out what I want to switch to. How do I product change my card?
Call the number on the back of your card.

Product changes for the Ultimate Reward Business and Personal Card Family

The UR family of cards includes the Chase Ink business cards, the Freedom Unlimited, the Freedom Card, and the Chase Sapphire Preferred, Reserve and Sapphire.

The Slate (personal) card is also available to downgrade to. It has no annual fee and does not earn any type of reward points. It offers a low fee (currently 0% for the first 60 days) balance transfers and APR.

Personal Cards
  • Freedom: 5X points in rotating quarterly categories up to $1500 spend per quarter. If you max out the $1500 every quarter, it totals 7500 UR per quarter, or 30,000 UR per year.
  • Freedom Unlimited: 1.5X for all spending, no bonus categories. $20,000 in spend would net 30,000 UR per year.
  • Sapphire Reserve: $450 annual fee, $300 annual travel credit, 3X points for travel and dining. Books travel through the UR portal for 1.5 per dollar. Lounge access and other goodies. See the thread here for details.
  • Sapphire Preferred: $95 annual fee, 2X points for travel & dining
  • Sapphire: Not available to new applicants. Available as a product downgrade/change only, must tier down from the Sapphire Reserve to Sapphire Preferred to Sapphire or Freedom cards. No annual fee. Some Customer Service Reps are citing that the original product (i.e., the CSR), must be held for one year before downgrading. Please provide data points in the thread if this happens to you.


Business Cards
  • Ink Plus: $95 annual fee, 5X office supplies, 5X cellular/landline/cable; 2X gas and hotels
  • Ink Preferred: 3x on travel, shipping, internet/phone/cable, & some online advertising.
  • Ink Cash: No annual fee, 5X office supplies, 5X cellular/landline/cable; 2X gas and restaurants

If you still have a legacy Ink Classic or Ink Bold business card, neither of which is available for new signups, you can product change to one of the other Ink cards.

Considerations for downgrading/upgrading:

Can I combine my UR points?
Yes, UR can be combined freely across the cardholder's own personal and business accounts.

What about transfering my UR to another person's Chase UR account? To their air/hotel partner account?
With restrictions, UR from a personal card can be transferred to a person living at the same address. Business cards allow transfer to owners of the company listed as authorized users.

However, be warned that there are transfer restrictions. Unauthorized transfers have resulted in shut-downs. Review the Chase T&C for details before planning a transfer. For discussion, see http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...-accounts.html.

The Freedom cards, no-fee Ink Cash, and no-fee Sapphire cards do not allow UR transfer to airline/hotel partners. If you are downgrading from a premium UR card and will only have no-fee cards left, it may be prudent to transfer your points to the partner of your choice beforehand.

I know I can use UR to pay for travel directly (as opposed to transfering points into a travel partner program). Do the Chase UR cards differ on this?
Only the Sapphire Reserve books travel on the UR portal for 1.5. So you can stack your card bonus opportunities when your UR points are combined into your CSR account and used for booking travel. If, for instance, you earned 5x on your Ink Plus on your phone bill, and combine those 5x Ink earned points into your CSR's UR account, you'll now get an additional .5 in value when you redeem them on the travel portal.

Product Changes for United Airlines Cards

There are options to downgrade or upgrade UA cards.
  • United Mileage Plus Card- no annual fee, 1 UA mile per $2 in spend
  • United Mileage Plus Explorer Card- $95 annual fee, 1 mile per dollar earning, additional award inventory on UA, free checked bag, 25% bonus on the shopping portal.
  • United Plus Club Card- $450 annual fee, 1.5 miles per $1, many additional premium card benefits
  • Business Cards for the Mileage Plus and Club Card give you a choice to upgrade or downgrade between those two.

Southwest Airlines Cards

The difference here is a nominal $30/3000 points per year.

Personal cards
  • Plus Card- $69 annual fee, 3000 bonus points upon renewal
  • Premiere Card- $99 annual fee, 6000 bonus points upon renewal
The Business cards also have a Plus and Premiere version.
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Chase Product Change/Card Conversion: Downgrade, Upgrade, Keep or Cancel? (2016-2019)

Old Feb 21, 2016, 6:30 pm
  #46  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
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Any idea can we convert SW Plus card to CSP ? I got the points for CP and dont have any use for the card. Ill keep SW Premier till AF for some promotions.

CSP i cant get it bcoz of 5/24. I already have freedom and cant apply for INK since i dont have a business and cant justify bcoz of my immigration status.

CSP i like the insurance benefits and transfer ability. Atleast can do some MS on it
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Old Feb 21, 2016, 8:45 pm
  #47  
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Originally Posted by kingofkingsforu
Any idea can we convert SW Plus card to CSP ?
AFAIK - Chase does not allow product change of a co-branded card, unless the co-brand relationship has ended. In that case, you will be converted to a Slate.

But there is nothing prevent you from asking. The worst is a "no" answer.
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Old Feb 21, 2016, 10:07 pm
  #48  
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Originally Posted by garykung
AFAIK - Chase does not allow product change of a co-branded card, unless the co-brand relationship has ended. In that case, you will be converted to a Slate.
For the record, last fall Chase forcibly converted all Amtrak co-brand cards to Freedom, not Slate.
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Old Feb 27, 2016, 8:56 pm
  #49  
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Should my spouse downgrade to Chase Ink Cash

"Nobody" seems to even know that Chase has a no-fee Ink Cash card:

https://creditcards.chase.com/ink-bu.../ink-cash-card

There's some good reason for the obscurity: while the Ink Cash card rewards program is set up like the much more popular Ink Plus (with $25K limit on office supply spend) you generally can't transfer the UR points to airline/hotel partners. The exception seems to be if you have a Sapphire or Ink Plus card, or if the business's "co-owner" has one.

Both my wife and I currently have Ink Plus cards. When my $95 annual fee hit, Chase retention offered me 5000 UR points if I paid it. I did. My wife's annual fee has now come due, and they're offering her nothing.

We probably don't "need" 2 of these accounts -- especially with Bluebird shut down and the greatly increased hassle and expense of disposing of $200 and $300 Staples gift cards. Unless things change, it seems unlikely that we're going to be spending more than 50K at office supply stores in the next year.

That said, given Chase's crackdown on churning cards, it seems unlikely my wife would qualify for a new Ink card if she cancels this one. At the same time, it's hard to see great benefit in paying the $95.

I see that someone in the retention thread has been successful in downgrading an Ink Plus to an Ink Cash. Does that seem like the best strategy in this situation? Am I correctly understanding the Chase UR transfer policy (I have an additional card on my wife's Ink account, and that seems to be good enough for co-owner status). Any real reason to pay the $95 and keep 2 Ink Plus cards in the family? Thanks.
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Old Feb 27, 2016, 9:45 pm
  #50  
 
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Ink Plus can go to Cash

Ink Cash can go to Plus

I have both and they both can go up or down.

All Chase UR cards have a change option or 2 after 1 year, call and see what yours are.

Plenty of folks know about the Ink Cash.
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Old Feb 27, 2016, 9:53 pm
  #51  
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Originally Posted by mhdena
Ink Plus can go to Cash

Ink Cash can go to Plus

I have both and they both can go up or down.

All Chase UR cards have a change option or 2 after 1 year, call and see what yours are.

Plenty of folks know about the Ink Cash.
And if I have a companion card on my wife's Ink Cash account, there should be no problem transferring her points to my UR account?

BTW, I can find almost no discussion of Ink Cash on Flyertalk, so if it's "widely known," the topic is well hidden!
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Old Feb 29, 2016, 3:10 am
  #52  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
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So regarding the 5/24 rule - is it based on a strict calendar dates? Meaning if i open 5 accounts on Jan 1st of 2015(and no more thereafter), will the 5/24 rule no longer apply to me on Jan 2nd of 2017?
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Old Mar 1, 2016, 8:13 pm
  #53  
 
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Originally Posted by Heliface
So regarding the 5/24 rule - is it based on a strict calendar dates? Meaning if i open 5 accounts on Jan 1st of 2015(and no more thereafter), will the 5/24 rule no longer apply to me on Jan 2nd of 2017?
AFAIK it's going by the months the accounts were opened, not exact dates. So you would have to wait until February 2017 to be safe, especially considering that new accounts are often delayed with reporting.
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Old Mar 3, 2016, 7:13 pm
  #54  
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will my fico take a hit if I cancel a credit card?

I've had the chase United presidential plus for 6 years. I recently switched my flying to AA and a month ago started using my new Citi AA plat card. I have not used the chase card since and don't plan to either.

Will I incur any credit "penalty" by canceling my Chase card? I don't want to keep it -- it's $495 a year to have it.

Also I believe the chase renewal in August. If I cancel now will I still have UC access until then?
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Old Mar 3, 2016, 7:18 pm
  #55  
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Not to my knowledge. It's not a soft hit or a hard hit, so I don't see why it would hurt your credit score, especially since you've had the United Presidential Plus for 6 years now.
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Old Mar 3, 2016, 7:21 pm
  #56  
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How much of a credit line does the card have? What is the sum of your total credit limits? How much debt do you carry across all credit cards?

The debt to credit limit ratio does have some impact on credit scores.
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Old Mar 3, 2016, 7:28 pm
  #57  
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Originally Posted by aztimm
How much of a credit line does the card have? What is the sum of your total credit limits? How much debt do you carry across all credit cards?

The debt to credit limit ratio does have some impact on credit scores.
The chase was $10K limit and the Citi is $13k. Monthly balances average $5K month and always paid in full so I never paid a dime in interest.

Let me guess...paying balances in full monthly is not a good thing, credit score wise?
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Old Mar 3, 2016, 7:40 pm
  #58  
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Originally Posted by enviroian
Let me guess...paying balances in full monthly is not a good thing, credit score wise?
Huh? I have never ever not paid a bill in full, since the dawn of time. I almost have a perfect credit score.
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Old Mar 3, 2016, 7:43 pm
  #59  
 
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Can you downgrade it to a no-fee version? That would enable you to keep the credit line and account age.
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Old Mar 3, 2016, 7:44 pm
  #60  
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A. 2 Credit Cards, 10k & 13k. No debt. Close 10k card. Credit line is down by almost 50%. Major hit. Especially if you only have 1 card and the citi is only open recently. That's 6 years credit history gone.

B. 5 Credit Cards, 10k, 13k, 9k, 7k, 5k. No debt. Close 10k card will affect you less than scenario A since credit line down by lower percentage. Close 5k card will affect you less than 10k card by the same reasoning.

IMHO, unless you need to apply for mortgage in a short time, close your chase card and take the hit. Not worth paying $495/year to keep the score. Next time, apply several more cards to strengthen your overall FICO.

Originally Posted by Ord Liza
Can you downgrade it to a no-fee version? That would enable you to keep the credit line and account age.
This is also a good option

Last edited by 9Benua; Mar 3, 2016 at 7:57 pm
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