SPLP007

Just some data:

Been with Chase 30-40 years
have 7 personal cards--
pay fees on most of them including $395 on a Untd club card
have 4 business cards pay fees on all of them and do not buy G.C. at Staples

one card is 30 years old-other 0 to 5 years

keep very,very large deposits in chase

pay off all cards end of month

do not do any MFG spending

never been denied a card --EXCEPT last week

tried to move credit around -- tried to offer to close some cards

First CSR -- said denied - new "POLICY" to many "CARDS " in last 2 years
read off to me "every" card I had opened -- said 24 cards --when passed to supervisor she said to the supervisor MR XXX requested to speak with you, I TOLD HIM THE "NEW" POLICY TO MANY CARDS IN PAST 2 YEARS

spoke to supervisor -- same except she said 23 cards last 2 years

RE called next day -- told -- we already told you.........
asked for supervisor -- she put me on hold 5 minutes -- DENIED to many cards in 2 years said not Chase just in general

last time that I was approved for Chase cards was 2 personal in mid march and 2 business in Oct.

Almost all the other cards in last 24 months were 13 Citi Hiltons - 3 Amex 6 Chase

have about 30 cards in total open with "all" banks

after Chase denied -- same day I was auto approved for one more Hilton and 3 AMX all auto apprvd --been with amx 40+ years

m
Moral of story -Chase HAS changed! --- the question is --how many is to many in 24 months -is it # pulls --# cards opened my guess some combo

Since I am not going to stop applying to other banks and therefore my card count will never go down , very little chance to get new Chase cards --- not willing to wait 18 or so months so that it will show maybe 6 cards in last 2 years

beltway

Perhaps we can map this territory a bit. My DW was recently insta-approved for the BA Visa; in her previous 2 years, she opened 14 (or 15) new cards, 7 of which were with Chase. (It might be 15 because one app was 2 years + 2 days earlier & required a followup call--date uncertain--for approval.)

pkoo

Another data point for the current discussion:

- I've been churning for over 3 years (not very intensive)
- 710+ score with all 3 bureaus at any given point
- Great & long credit history with 2 LOC and 1 auto loan
- Never a single default in my history
- Great relationship with chase; I've had a CSP for my everyday spend for 2.5 years now
- Chase has never denied me for a personal card
- I've had the IHG, Hyatt, CSP, BA, Ink, UA Explorer, UA Explorer B and never burned chase

I did a 5 card AoR last night which included a CHASE FREEDOM card which I've never had. I got auto-denied so I called a credit analyst for recon and he told me that because I've opened too many accounts within the past 2 years (21 accounts), I can't open another card with chase for the time being. I asked if there is any way I can get approved without extending additional credit such as moving credit lines. He said no and because of the stated reason, he can't even consider me for reconsideration.

I've never received such a response before. Chase has always been the easiest when it came to recon.

On another note, that very AoR included a Barclay Arrival+ MC that I had to call in for recon and they approved me after asking me 1 trivial question....

RNE

Nothing has changed. Chase has never wanted to give credit cards to people it thinks are acquiring cards primarily for the benefits. Your 20+ cards in <5 years is egregious. Moral of the story: be glad Chase didn't shut you down.

You're being too (not "to") hasty with your conclusions.

• Other banks may begin balking at your applications, thus you won't have as many cards as you think.
• Chase may relent in as little as six months; one never knows.

Insder

I also recently ran into the "too many cards" reasoning (12 in the past 12 months) and I believe this only applies in recon.

I wanted to go for two in one day (combined hard pulls)...I reduced a bunch of credit limits on existing cards to 5k and closed one card. I applied for both cards. The first was auto-approved for the brand new combined limits that I just reduced, and the second was declined in recon.

My thoughts are as such: go for auto-approvals. The old Chase that allowed any approval with a CL shift from another card is likely gone. I have an experiment that I am going to try for my fiancee....I'll reduce a credit line, apply for a card and hopefully get an auto-approval, then reduce a credit line again and apply again.

Chase's reductions are almost instant, as I reduced all of my CL's and closed a card the morning of, and later that day I was able to apply and get a new LOC with the same amounts that I got rid of.

Light

I made 2 Chase business applications within the same hour. Apparently, it resulted in two hard pulls (according to recon). So either what I've been told is wrong or this CSR is wrong.

The recon CSR is also telling me that a hard pull is even required for the recon process. I keep telling the person to not proceed with one. Should I just get another CSR?

italdesign

Good theory and data points, Insder. Now we just need more data points to complete the picture.

Lumpylump76

We did a data collection thread on reddit. There were no reports of any sort of new limitation reported from apps within the last two weeks. This looks really isolated.

http://www.reddit.com/r/churning/com...pp_experience/

Light

First attempt at recon got declined. Is it worthwhile to call multiple times or is it pointless?

Insder

Recon will know you have called before. I actually hung up from the first call being told that I had too many recent accounts opened, and as soon as I did my second call a few minutes later, the next rep said "I see that you called and spoke to us earlier and we spoke to you about your application. Did you have anymore information for us?".

She gave me the same reason as the first guy and it was a hard decline, unable to reconsider (said multiple times). I even offered to shift or close from one of my other personal cards (some still above the 5k minimum) but they weren't having it.

Insder

I don't believe it's isolated...see further data points here:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...lidated-6.html

I'm on reddit too and saw that thread, but I experienced myself and I've never been denied for a Chase card that I couldn't fix in recon. Chase has two of the oldest tradelines on my report and I use Sapphire/Freedom as my daily spenders.

Light

I'll save my time then.

Did you apply for multiple business cards at once or just one? I'm still wondering why the pulls weren't combined, as I've always read they are. Is this a recent policy change?

Insder

I have never done more than one business at a time; my anecdote was two personal cards (which have always been easier than business, but especially so since business tightened the reins last year).

I do know one business/one personal do not get combined (two different branches of Chase lending).

Note that my comment was not to dissuade you from calling again. It was simply to give you a heads up to have an excuse on why you are calling again, because they can/will mention it. I have called back three times and I am actually waiting for a supervisor callback as I really don't have anything to lose on these apps (I've been pretty good to Chase and not bonus chasing them; all of my new accounts are with other banks).

Brugge

Our experience too. DW recently was denied for a Chase Ink Cash. Combined household income of 6 figures, CR around 800, 9 month old business with continually increasing income and high profit level.

But we never got around to discussing the business, only her 2 "recent" personal Chase apps, Brit Air last December ( since when is 5 months "recent"?) and UA 2 months ago. CSR said not enough spend history on those new cards. Apparently her $60K spend in a 2 year span on a previous Brit Air card is ancient history since it was over 18 moths ago.

Most startling was the mention of "number of new accounts in the past 2 years". Since she has been churning AA Exec cards, yes, that's a considerable number. But this is the first time I've had any CSR mention 2 years.

We have both been making a point of spending on every open Chase card every month to stay in their good graces. But if they aren't going to approve any new cards, we won't bother to do that anymore.

Sorry, Chase, but we are not going to give up a Citi card every 33 days in order to get one card per year with you. With this new policy, just like AMEX with it's once in a lifetime rule, Chase is 'dead' to us.

I hope they enjoy the results of this, as people hit their renewal point and cancel, then get denied for new Chase cards, and shift their spend over to new cards from Citi and Barclays. In DW's case, that means her $20K yearly spend that she wanted to shift from AMEX Gold Bus to Chase Ink will stay with AMEX for now.

ZBigFam

yes something definitely changed with chases' underwriting. My wife tried to apply after only getting a Citi card in the last 6 months...and they declined her. I think it had to do with the fact that she cancelled her two RR Visa's recently. She has a 6 figure income and 815+ FICO.