CX reports Atlantic (LHR-JFK) bid uncertain--slowed down at EU
Jan 26, 2004, 7:52 am
#1
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CX reports Atlantic (LHR-JFK) bid uncertain--slowed down at EU
From this link:
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Cathay's Atlantic Bid Faces Uncertainty
January 26, 2004
An open skies deal that would give Hong Kong's dominant carrier Cathay Pacific Airways access to the United States via London could face delays due to opposition in Europe, Cathay said on Monday.
The deal negotiated by Britain and Hong Kong in November would also give the UK's Virgin Atlantic the right to fly between Hong Kong and Sydney, and will be subject to legislation before the European Parliament.
"We hope the agreement comes through [the process] unscathed but it is under attack from some quarters," said Andrew Pyne, Cathay's general manager for international affairs, after meeting European Commission officials in Brussels recently.
"This will mean a significant delay and it could be toward the end of 2004," he added.
The deal's implementation was originally deferred until the European Commission confirmed it would not run counter to its common transport policy. But there had been hopes that the deal would be approved quickly.
"There is quite a degree of uncertainty. If it was altered we feel it would effectively kill the deal," Pyne added.
Richard Branson's Virgin Atlantic had said it hoped to start flying to Sydney via Hong Kong in the summer to hook up with its Australian low-cost carrier Virgin Blue.
British Midland Airways (bmi) and Cathay's main Asian rival Singapore Airlines, are both opposed to the deal.</font>
January 26, 2004
An open skies deal that would give Hong Kong's dominant carrier Cathay Pacific Airways access to the United States via London could face delays due to opposition in Europe, Cathay said on Monday.
The deal negotiated by Britain and Hong Kong in November would also give the UK's Virgin Atlantic the right to fly between Hong Kong and Sydney, and will be subject to legislation before the European Parliament.
"We hope the agreement comes through [the process] unscathed but it is under attack from some quarters," said Andrew Pyne, Cathay's general manager for international affairs, after meeting European Commission officials in Brussels recently.
"This will mean a significant delay and it could be toward the end of 2004," he added.
The deal's implementation was originally deferred until the European Commission confirmed it would not run counter to its common transport policy. But there had been hopes that the deal would be approved quickly.
"There is quite a degree of uncertainty. If it was altered we feel it would effectively kill the deal," Pyne added.
Richard Branson's Virgin Atlantic had said it hoped to start flying to Sydney via Hong Kong in the summer to hook up with its Australian low-cost carrier Virgin Blue.
British Midland Airways (bmi) and Cathay's main Asian rival Singapore Airlines, are both opposed to the deal.</font>
Feb 8, 2004, 5:34 pm
#5
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by jakob:
nope, HK Gov't is trading HKG-SYD rights for ex-LHR 5th freedom rights to JFK.</font>
nope, HK Gov't is trading HKG-SYD rights for ex-LHR 5th freedom rights to JFK.</font>
Feb 8, 2004, 6:31 pm
#6
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GB, No, that isn't true.
The "new" agreement between HK and UK (including VS to SYD) all requires an all clear from the EU before the HK & UK authorities will sign off on it.
At the moment, the new EU aviation mandate could be read to mean that if HK grants HK-SYD rights to one EU airline, they must be granted to all, so a ruling is required from Brussels on this
The "new" agreement between HK and UK (including VS to SYD) all requires an all clear from the EU before the HK & UK authorities will sign off on it.
At the moment, the new EU aviation mandate could be read to mean that if HK grants HK-SYD rights to one EU airline, they must be granted to all, so a ruling is required from Brussels on this
Feb 8, 2004, 6:48 pm
#7
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If oneworld fan was lurking on this board, he would be shaking his head at Guy Betsy for his lack of understanding on aviation matters.
I would back oneworld fan and agree with him that Guy Betsy is very confused on this issue.
Just my point of view.
I would back oneworld fan and agree with him that Guy Betsy is very confused on this issue.
Just my point of view.
Feb 9, 2004, 4:35 am
#10
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Let me get it straight for once and all, I am not oneworld fan nor am I StarAlliance Fan.
Before anybody drills me over my comments about oneworld fan, I was simply making a point here. If Guy Betsy cannot take a little correction for his mistake, then it shows very little of him.
As for the rest, I will answer you feedback accordingly.
If CX does not get the trans-Atlantic deal, then VS doesn't get HKG-SYD route either. A deal is a deal. If CX does get it, then the Hong Kong authorities will not allow VS the deal either. Tit for Tat!
Before anybody drills me over my comments about oneworld fan, I was simply making a point here. If Guy Betsy cannot take a little correction for his mistake, then it shows very little of him.
As for the rest, I will answer you feedback accordingly.
If CX does not get the trans-Atlantic deal, then VS doesn't get HKG-SYD route either. A deal is a deal. If CX does get it, then the Hong Kong authorities will not allow VS the deal either. Tit for Tat!
Feb 9, 2004, 9:40 pm
#12
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 18
i am not here to take sides and actually did a search to find some answers. perhaps this article will clear some matters:
quoted from the hk standard:
here is the link: http://www.thestandard.com.hk/thesta...139&intcatid=1
best
dvdtug
quoted from the hk standard:
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2"> the team from the Economic Development and Labour Bureau insisted the European Commission give its blessing to the agreement before it was implemented. </font>
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2"> Hong Kong negotiations have made clear that the respective Virgin and Cathay flights and other concessions agreed in the talks are a package. As such, if the commission objects to the Cathay services between London and New York and no solution is found then the UK-Hong Kong agreement will be scrapped. </font>
best
dvdtug
Feb 10, 2004, 3:56 am
#13
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,027
it seems that according to EU sources, Singapore Airlines is the real culprit, not CX. the two deals are interdependent (although not according to the agreements in preparation) I am sort of an insider with Brussels and there seems to be no concerns in terms of EU policy about CX flying across the big A.
According to this source (reported also here: http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/b...d73592?source= , albeit not the way I heard it), SIA, major shareholder in Virgin, is objecting to both Virgin stealing business from SIA on the aussie route and to CX flying across the pond. SIA wants Virgin to withdraw its route bid, thus killing the CX deal.
[This message has been edited by mhtaipei (edited Feb 10, 2004).]
According to this source (reported also here: http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/b...d73592?source= , albeit not the way I heard it), SIA, major shareholder in Virgin, is objecting to both Virgin stealing business from SIA on the aussie route and to CX flying across the pond. SIA wants Virgin to withdraw its route bid, thus killing the CX deal.
[This message has been edited by mhtaipei (edited Feb 10, 2004).]
May 13, 2005, 6:43 am
#15
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Held hostage by the US in the US/EU Open Sky negotiations. It looks unlikely to have any progress in 2005 and maybe not until 2008 the way things are now. Effectively the route is dead for CX (and they've used the slots at LHR for the daytime daily service LHR-HKG).