Should First be made smaller?
Aug 2, 2017, 11:37 am
#61
Join Date: Nov 2004
Programs: BA GGL, LH FTL
Posts: 3,578
1) GGLs can Joker up to 5 seats in a cabin. If all F routes had only 8 seats, either this benefit would go, or BA would lose 62% of F seats on some flights to redemptions. This might be such a niche issue it's not a problem, but I'd be concerned about losing that benefit.
Aug 2, 2017, 11:56 am
#62
Join Date: May 2010
Location: UK
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 1,144
I find any BA F seat perfectly fine no matter what aircraft it is and I am not a tiny person so like I will say again I do not understand the comments that people make about it being cramped. An Economy seat is Cramped not an F seat.
Aug 2, 2017, 12:45 pm
#63
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: in a cabin
Posts: 6,521
Agree entirely. Have flown F on all AC except the 789 and while other carriers F seat is a fair bit more spacious I find the BA seat lovely. Let them keep the higher density I say.
Aug 2, 2017, 12:56 pm
#64
Join Date: May 2017
Location: UK
Programs: Deliveroo Plus
Posts: 179
On a chat once with special services they actually asked me of my opinion on ways to improve the first cabin, I know most people are die hard BA but for those ever flown with some of the middle eastern airlines they offer a much better first experience and the same with the far east airlines.
It would be nice if it had a more of 'cabin' feel, not that there is anything wrong with it but really time to catch up, BA are slowly improving their club world product but seem to be leaving first as it is which is a shame for those of us who do pay for it.
Of course anyone doing a one off redemption will have a grin from the moment they board but surely the real revenue for first comes from the fare payers.
Aug 2, 2017, 1:48 pm
#65
Moderator, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges, and Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
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Let me welcome you to Flyertalk and the BA forum yb90. Thank you for sharing those observations, and I hope we will hear more from you. Welcome on board.
Aug 2, 2017, 2:22 pm
#66
Join Date: Sep 2009
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Aug 2, 2017, 4:34 pm
#67
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: London
Programs: BA Gold, Subcard
Posts: 435
The hard onboard product is ok. It's near the bottom of the pack, granted, but it's not so bad that they need to rip the seats out and start again.
It's the inconsistent service (Mixed Fleet in particular) in the air, the dreadful food, and the total lack of any ground handling, which as people have said, make it a very good business class offering.
Quite a lot of these are actually fixable, in a reasonably short amount of time, without substantial capital investment. However it requires management will, and people. Given the current cost-cutting climate, I suspect we're as likely to see that happening as we are a silver winged pig through the window of 1A, mid-cruise.
It's the inconsistent service (Mixed Fleet in particular) in the air, the dreadful food, and the total lack of any ground handling, which as people have said, make it a very good business class offering.
Quite a lot of these are actually fixable, in a reasonably short amount of time, without substantial capital investment. However it requires management will, and people. Given the current cost-cutting climate, I suspect we're as likely to see that happening as we are a silver winged pig through the window of 1A, mid-cruise.
Instead of potentially spending millions on reconfiguring cabins to reduce F seats they could actually invest in the food, staff, training, bedding and ground experience to drastically improve what they already have. I've only ever left a BA F flight happy from great service or grumpy from terrible food and service. I didn't think it was cramped or crowded.
Who's to say smaller F cabins will result in a better overall product?
With the exception of the return of the amuse bouche and flower, what onboard improvements have we seen in the last few years?
Loss of the tasting menu, bistro menu?
Aug 3, 2017, 1:26 am
#68
FlyerTalk Evangelist, Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere between 0 and 13,000 metres high
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Posts: 30,517
And do you find J seats 'cramped' on BA or for that matter any airline? Or even Premium economy seats? Because I don't either but that sort of questions why having a F cabin at all? I mean you could have Y=value but cramped, W for people who don't do cramped, and J for people who want the luxury of seats that recline into flat. Quite frankly, if 'not cramped' is the criterion, I'm unsure why F is needed or justified at all in a world of flat business seats.
Aug 3, 2017, 1:46 am
#69
Join Date: May 2010
Location: UK
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 1,144
And do you find J seats 'cramped' on BA or for that matter any airline? Or even Premium economy seats? Because I don't either but that sort of questions why having a F cabin at all? I mean you could have Y=value but cramped, W for people who don't do cramped, and J for people who want the luxury of seats that recline into flat. Quite frankly, if 'not cramped' is the criterion, I'm unsure why F is needed or justified at all in a world of flat business seats.
Does it bloody matter 😂
Premium Economy and above I do not find cramped. However business and First to me is more about the service and like you say the flat bed. I am more than comfortable in CW but First to me is all about the smaller cabin the more personalised service. The LPGS 😉 and all the little things that add up to an all round better product than if I was further back in CW. I just stick by what I say when others comment on a BA F seat feeling cramped I just think they are nuts! I tell you what I will sit in your Cramped F seat and you can go and sit at the back of the plane how about that?
Aug 3, 2017, 2:59 am
#70
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 5,797
Orbitmic,
Does it bloody matter 😂
Premium Economy and above I do not find cramped. However business and First to me is more about the service and like you say the flat bed. I am more than comfortable in CW but First to me is all about the smaller cabin the more personalised service. The LPGS 😉 and all the little things that add up to an all round better product than if I was further back in CW. I just stick by what I say when others comment on a BA F seat feeling cramped I just think they are nuts! I tell you what I will sit in your Cramped F seat and you can go and sit at the back of the plane how about that?
Does it bloody matter 😂
Premium Economy and above I do not find cramped. However business and First to me is more about the service and like you say the flat bed. I am more than comfortable in CW but First to me is all about the smaller cabin the more personalised service. The LPGS 😉 and all the little things that add up to an all round better product than if I was further back in CW. I just stick by what I say when others comment on a BA F seat feeling cramped I just think they are nuts! I tell you what I will sit in your Cramped F seat and you can go and sit at the back of the plane how about that?
Aug 3, 2017, 3:21 am
#71
Join Date: May 2010
Location: UK
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 1,144
and for the hundredth time a First seat is not cramped. I pay for First for several reasons and I am happy with it or I wouldn't pay for it and clearly thousands of other people pay for it or upgrade to it using miles. In fact the general population would find a business class flat bed seat more than sufficient for long haul travel never mind a First seat/cabin environment. it is only on FT generally where you find people are so bloody hard to please.
Aug 3, 2017, 3:24 am
#72
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Ipswich
Posts: 7,543
I like the bigger F seats on other airlines because they allow me to sit in a variety of positions - with BA you pretty much have to sit upright with your legs straight in front.
In other seats, I can sit slightly sideways with my legs curled under me which I find really comfortable for reading (curling up with a good book anyone?).
I agree the BA seat is pretty roomy for sitting up in (or reclining etc). You'd have to be pretty wide to feel hemmed in. But it doesn't afford me the same sort of wiggle room/seating positions I like on a long flight.
In other seats, I can sit slightly sideways with my legs curled under me which I find really comfortable for reading (curling up with a good book anyone?).
I agree the BA seat is pretty roomy for sitting up in (or reclining etc). You'd have to be pretty wide to feel hemmed in. But it doesn't afford me the same sort of wiggle room/seating positions I like on a long flight.
Aug 3, 2017, 3:31 am
#73
Join Date: May 2010
Location: UK
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 1,144
I like the bigger F seats on other airlines because they allow me to sit in a variety of positions - with BA you pretty much have to sit upright with your legs straight in front.
In other seats, I can sit slightly sideways with my legs curled under me which I find really comfortable for reading (curling up with a good book anyone?).
I agree the BA seat is pretty roomy for sitting up in (or reclining etc). You'd have to be pretty wide to feel hemmed in. But it doesn't afford me the same sort of wiggle room/seating positions I like on a long flight.
In other seats, I can sit slightly sideways with my legs curled under me which I find really comfortable for reading (curling up with a good book anyone?).
I agree the BA seat is pretty roomy for sitting up in (or reclining etc). You'd have to be pretty wide to feel hemmed in. But it doesn't afford me the same sort of wiggle room/seating positions I like on a long flight.
we are all different people and the world would be very boring if we were all the same
I appreciate other airlines have a bigger seat and more space and whatever but it is when people call the seat cramped I think they need a reality check! 
It's all about the service for me in F I like BA cabin crew. Emirates F is good but I never got the hype in the past when I used them quite a bit. the tacky gold bling used to offend my eyes 
Aug 3, 2017, 3:42 am
#74
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 5,797
I like the bigger F seats on other airlines because they allow me to sit in a variety of positions - with BA you pretty much have to sit upright with your legs straight in front.
In other seats, I can sit slightly sideways with my legs curled under me which I find really comfortable for reading (curling up with a good book anyone?).
I agree the BA seat is pretty roomy for sitting up in (or reclining etc). You'd have to be pretty wide to feel hemmed in. But it doesn't afford me the same sort of wiggle room/seating positions I like on a long flight.
In other seats, I can sit slightly sideways with my legs curled under me which I find really comfortable for reading (curling up with a good book anyone?).
I agree the BA seat is pretty roomy for sitting up in (or reclining etc). You'd have to be pretty wide to feel hemmed in. But it doesn't afford me the same sort of wiggle room/seating positions I like on a long flight.
Aug 3, 2017, 3:59 am
#75
Join Date: May 2010
Location: UK
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 1,144