Had a great return flight from LHR to SAN on Jan 11, 2013 (last night) from a service perspective. CSD and cabin crew were one of the best I've had in terms of following protocol (actually I'm not sure if it is protocol but CSD greeted all gold members personally and took their meal selections first etc). To be honest since I have been gold the only time the CSD didn't personally introduce themselves was most recent outbound SAN to LHR on Jan 5 so I guess it probably is protocol. I don’t really care if it doesn’t happen but it’s nice when it does and you certainly keep a mental note when it doesn’t happen.
Unfortunately on last night’s flight there were two buffoons sitting in 11E and 11F. For the first 4 or 5 hours of this flight these two guys were talking and laughing at the highest of volumes, acting obnoxiously and obviously drinking too much. They also allowed about 3 or 4 visitors from WT or WT+ to sit with them with each visitor each spending 30 or 40 minutes carrying on loudly. I’m pretty sure these two were upgraded as the Club cabin was meant to be 50% full and it turned out the flight was completely full except for 2 empty CW seats. Plus who in the world would select 11E and F unless you’re a family.
Anyway, I'm not sure if someone did complain (I was thinking very hard about it but I'm generally a non-confrontational person so decided against it) but after the first 4 or 5 hours of this the CSD finally spoke to these two guys, stopped their service of alcohol, told them no more visit from friends from WT/WT+ but not without a lot of arguing from them. Even after she spoke to them they both laughed and spoke loudly for another two hours but not as bad as the first 4 or 5. I think they finally passed out and slept the remaining 3 hours or so.
I was glad the CSD intervened 4 or 5 hours into the flight and I told her so later. My question is that I really wanted to complain earlier into the flight but I didn’t want to be known as “that guy” and was just wondering how fellow flyertalk members would deal with this. Was I being selfish wanting some peace and quiet on the plane? I could hear these guys with my earphone on. I can stand a crying baby on the plane and would never ever complain about that as I understand that situation but two grown obnoxious men with zero sense of awareness of fellow passengers is another story. Should I have said something earlier?
I was glad the CSD intervened 4 or 5 hours into the flight and I told her so later. My question is that I really wanted to complain earlier into the flight but I didn’t want to be known as “that guy” and was just wondering how fellow flyertalk members would deal with this. Was I being selfish wanting some peace and quiet on the plane? I could hear these guys with my earphone on. I can stand a crying baby on the plane and would never ever complain about that as I understand that situation but two grown obnoxious men with zero sense of awareness of fellow passengers is another story. Should I have said something earlier?
I would have complained to the crew earlier. I probably would have done so after about 30 minutes. The reason why I would prefer not to speak to them directly is that crew members can order them to be quiet and as long as it is a reasonable order they are legally obliged to comply, whereas I can't order them to be quiet. Also passengers tend to be a bit more compliant towards crew members than another passenger and less likely to start a fight with a crew member than with a fellow passenger.
It is unreasonable, in my opinion, of any passenger (other than infants who have no control over what they do) to be heard clearly by others, except in some exceptional circumstances. They need to keep their voice down in consideration towards others. If an adult can't have enough consideration towards others around them, they don't deserve to be flying.
Yep, tell the crew after a decent interval has elapsed, so you can see whether or not it is just the excitement - which might quickly subside - at being in CW for the first time. You are perfectly entitled to enjoy your flight without disturbance from others. Plus, I presume, there would be some mechanism for the CSD to make a record of a complaint by one passenger about another, particularly if this would help corroborate the crew's own story.
I don't understand this "bringing people up" malarky.
A few months ago I tested out the UUA of a TA booking by upgrading a DME-LHR leg from WTP for some shockingly tiny amount (£3 and a few miles)
After an hour or so I trundled down to WTP to say hi to my colleagues, before swiftly returning upstairs for the rest of my film (and a short phone call home).
Their behaviour sadly seems unacceptable, but if people aren't going to complain, what are the cabin crew supposed to do? Even the pro-active ones only get a snapshot of the cabin, and have no idea about continued behaviour.
As to assumptions that these must be "scum from the back that have been op-upped", and "why would anyone choose 14DE"
* You have no idea how full the cabin was "meant to be". You could see what seats were allocated at a given time.
* I find there are more "entitled" people in Club World, infesting the club lounge, than in WTP. These are typically young businessmen who obviously rarely fly, but who get J seats
* People don't care about pre-selecting their seat. One of my GGL colleagues takes whatever seat he gets by the TA (first Aisle seat near the front). He barely knows how many TP he has.
* Sometimes people want to sit with collegues (to discuss strategising their meeting synergies, or some other nonsense) on board.
* May have been a last minute ticket purchase (on a £9500 J return), or change in plan, but all the good seats could have gone because of silvers on £1000 WTP tickets with UUA that booked 10 months ago in a sale had snapped up most of the seats)
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I agree. I think after the meal service, people should really be settling into something quietly so as not to disturb others who wish to work, rest or read. First passengers may invite a guest to join them for a while, but the facility is not extended to Club World and the crew should certainly have discovered this for themselves and politely, but firmly returned the visitors to their own cabin!
Then again, on BA it seems as though passengers think they have a right to use the Club or First washrooms when travelling in WT and very few crew stop them. Other airlines seem to have very firm rules concerning crossing cabin dividers - some don't even permit walking through the galley.
Unfortunately, the continual carping on about "customer service" seems to be interpreted as letting customers do whatever they damned well please. However, good "customer service" means doing the right thing by the majority of your customers. Appeasing one or two selfish people queers the pitch for everyone else.
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You're ok i'm sure Uncle T but i've heard things about that hoard of bears...
Personally i'd pay a discrete visit to the galley to complain to the crew. I don't see why you should put up with that kind of behaviour and I also don't think you'd be wise to complain to the person yourself.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usrabbs
Should I have said something earlier?
Yes, of course. You are not required to put up with it; it's best handled by the crew; and if you don't complain they might not be fully aware of the disturbance caused.
I don't understand this "bringing people up" malarky.
A few months ago I tested out the UUA of a TA booking by upgrading a DME-LHR leg from WTP for some shockingly tiny amount (£3 and a few miles)
After an hour or so I trundled down to WTP to say hi to my colleagues, before swiftly returning upstairs for the rest of my film (and a short phone call home).
Their behaviour sadly seems unacceptable, but if people aren't going to complain, what are the cabin crew supposed to do? Even the pro-active ones only get a snapshot of the cabin, and have no idea about continued behaviour.
As to assumptions that these must be "scum from the back that have been op-upped", and "why would anyone choose 14DE"
* You have no idea how full the cabin was "meant to be". You could see what seats were allocated at a given time.
* I find there are more "entitled" people in Club World, infesting the club lounge, than in WTP. These are typically young businessmen who obviously rarely fly, but who get J seats
* People don't care about pre-selecting their seat. One of my GGL colleagues takes whatever seat he gets by the TA (first Aisle seat near the front). He barely knows how many TP he has.
* Sometimes people want to sit with collegues (to discuss strategising their meeting synergies, or some other nonsense) on board.
* May have been a last minute ticket purchase (on a £9500 J return), or change in plan, but all the good seats could have gone because of silvers on £1000 WTP tickets with UUA that booked 10 months ago in a sale had snapped up most of the seats)
You're right - I shouldn't have assumed they were op-ups. I only said that as i heard from the one of the cabin crew that WT and WT+ were compeltely full and I overheard 3 fellow passegnger in CW talking on the way off the plane how lucky they were to be op-uped. Additionally a week ago the J cabin had plenty of seats still available for sale so maybe it was a bad assumption on my part. Plus the fact that they had 3 or 4 visitors from WT or WT+ swayed my opinion on that matter.
FYI - I never said "scum" as I understand that most people in WT and WT+ are good people. That was your assumption. I meant no offense and sorry you interpretated it that way. Regardless you're right that my initial assumption was a bad one.
Last spring travelling from LHR to LAS in WT a group of twenty or so lads on a stag do we're enjoying themselves a bit a few rows in front of where me and Mrs Spruce were sitting.
A member of the cabin crew had been over to them a couple of times presumably to tell them to keep the noise down. I guess this had the desired effect, except for two members of the group who decided to distance themselves from the rest of the group and come and stand in the galley space about two rows back from my seat.
To be fair to them they were only having a conversation (which was a little too colourful for the surroundings), but anyone who has walked into a pub at 10pm sober will know, people who've had a few beers don't realise how loud they are actually being.
After about 30 minutes or so, and despite Mrs Spruce telling me not to, I decided to be "that guy" and turned around and told them in my dulcet Teesside tones to keep the noise down. It had the desired effect. They probably formed some thoughts on me after that but I didn't lose any sleep over it. In fact I managed to gain some about half an hour later!
I would not have said anything directly to the passengers but definately would have said something to the CSD about very disruptive passengers.
I'm someone who generally pays for WT+ then Uaa's to CW and am about to lose my Silver status but that doesn't mean that my comfort is considered to be less than someone who has paid more £'s than I have. In some way or another, CW or F pax have paid in some way for (generally) peace & quiet and that should not be abused by others who have either paid more or are from another cabin. We are all in that cabin for the same reason and that should be respected by everyone who is travelling in those cabins.
On a night flight I would have said something to the CSD much earlier. Passengers on overnights in F/J should - ideally - get on, make no noise, sleep and get off at the other end. If you can't sleep then sit quietly or read. Use IFE if you must but minimise light in the cabin.
I find it the "we are in business, lets eat and drink as it is free" approach rather sad.
to LTN Phobia's reply.
