Go Back   FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Airline Programs > British Airways Executive Club
Sign in using an external account

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old Nov 21, 12, 1:38 am   #1
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Everywhere you want to be
Posts: 295
Screwed by BA? Recommended contact person?

Hello,

I am not quite sure to what extent I should be enraged by BA in respect to the following.

I was scheduled to fly AMM-LHR in early January on flight BA 8175 departing at 8:25. It was book back in March as part of a Star Alliance award while the flight belonged to BMI. BA has just canceled the flight and proposed to rebook "its" passengers on BA 146 departing at 4:20 in the morning. That does not include, however, anyone who booked the flight using the miles of BMI's former Star Alliance partners. BA staff has simply washed its hands of all responsibility, maintaining the matter is solely for Lufthansa to put aright as the booking was made with the frequent flyer miles of the latter's Miles and More program.

Lufthansa, to its credit, has genuinely tried to be helpful. But it has no access to BA flights, has no direct routing between Amman and London either itself or among its Star Alliance partners, and has nothing better available at this late date than AMM-FRA-ZUR-LHR a day later than my flight was initially scheduled.

While I am sure that BMI did not sell itself to get out of its Star Alliance frequent flyer obligations, BA seems to be perfectly content to make use of the sale to precisely that end.

Should I be upset and who should I be speaking with at BA?

Thanx,

cure

edited: for detail and clarity

Last edited by cure; Nov 21, 12 at 2:39 am..
cure is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 1:41 am   #2
Ambassador: British Airways Executive Club
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SFO, NYC, VIE, HKG
Programs: BA Gold, AA ExPlat, UA 1K, Starbucks Gold
Posts: 2,253
I mean, technically BA is right. They can rebook you as a courtesy (which they have apparently offered to do, albeit at an undesirable flight time).
Otherwise it's the ticketing agent (BD, or now probably LH)'s responsibility. Why can't they give you AMM-FRA-LHR? Seems pretty reasonable to me.
DWFI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 1:51 am   #3
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Programs: BA, bmi, HH, SPG, 5C
Posts: 2,433
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFI View Post
I mean, technically BA is right.
Technically, it may be tough for BA to amend a booking made by LH. So technically it may be smoothest to find a solution through LH (which is essentially accepting BA's refund and LH rebooking with the proceeds).

But I don't see why it's not BA's responsibility to put this right. They (as bmi) accepted the contract to fly the OP (for payment from LH) and they have cancelled the flight, not LH.

Both BA/bmi's CoCs and EU261 put the responsibility on the operating carrier, not the agent, to remedy the situation. Which seems quite right to me.
pauldb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 1:59 am   #4
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: WGC, UK
Programs: BAEC Silver, HHonors Diamond, Hertz 5*
Posts: 1,246
I dont quite understand.

BA have offered to book you on the 4am flight, but your not happy with that solution?
__________________
My Flights
stewaran is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:02 am   #5
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Programs: BAEC Silver (woo! hoo!), LH M&M Member
Posts: 1,487
Quote:
Originally Posted by stewaran:19722105
I dont quite understand.

BA have offered to book you on the 4am flight, but your not happy with that solution?
I don't think s/he is saying that. Because the flight was booked using LH M&M miles, BA are refusing to rebook.

Not quite sure why, that sounds a bit strange. I wonder if there is some advice to be found in the M&M forum?
NeverFirst is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:04 am   #6
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: LHR (sometimes CLE, SFO, BOS, LAX, SEA)
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 2,562
Quote:
Originally Posted by stewaran View Post
I dont quite understand.

BA have offered to book you on the 4am flight, but your not happy with that solution?
The original post says "BA has just canceled the flight and proposed to rebook "its" passengers on a flight at 4 in the morning. That does not include, however, anyone who booked the flight using the miles of BMI's former Star Alliance partners."

I interpret that to mean: "BA has not offered to rebook the OP on the 4 a.m. flight and has said that this is because the OP booked a bmi flight as a Lufthansa award ticket; however, BA has offered to book other pax on the 4 a.m. flight."
mherdeg is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:15 am   #7
Ambassador: British Airways Executive Club
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Putney, London, UK
Posts: 3,814
It sounds like that the OPs issue is actually with LH as the ticketing carrier. They would need to arrange either getting you on the newly timed BA flight, or an alternative on a star alliance carrier.

Whilst BA is culpable for changing the flight from BD to BA flight numbers and re-timing it, it would seem that Lufthansa are actually responsible for the OP in getting from A to B, or Amman to London.

You need to speak with M&M I'm afraid. Not apologising for BA in any way, but just saying how things are.
Dave_C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:23 am   #8
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Southern Med
Programs: BAEC Silver, Flying Blue Gold, Gulf Air Gold, Aegean Gold, M&M FQTV, Air Malta Diamond
Posts: 618
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_C View Post
It sounds like that the OPs issue is actually with LH as the ticketing carrier. They would need to arrange either getting you on the newly timed BA flight, or an alternative on a star alliance carrier.

Whilst BA is culpable for changing the flight from BD to BA flight numbers and re-timing it, it would seem that Lufthansa are actually responsible for the OP in getting from A to B, or Amman to London.

You need to speak with M&M I'm afraid. Not apologising for BA in any way, but just saying how things are.
See post #3, it is BA's responsibility.
Final 3 Greens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:27 am   #9
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Programs: BA Exec Club Silver, EK Skywards Silver, A-Club Platinum
Posts: 179
"Screwed by BA"


"I am not quite sure to what extent I should be enraged by BA..."

"Should I be upset and who should I be speaking with at BA?"



Haha. Don't you just love Flyer Talk.
surryson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:30 am   #10
Ambassador: British Airways Executive Club
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Putney, London, UK
Posts: 3,814
I thought, from the other side of the fence, that's what all the challenges people from Diamond Club have been having with changes to star alliance rewards made in the final days of the DC's existence? With all the schedule changes, BA are now left holding the baby without availability and are responsible for rebooking people?

It's either up to the home mileage programme i.e. M&M in this instance, with whom there's a contract and Diamond Club / Exec Club for the people on the BMI forum. Or instead the operating carriers as you seem to be suggesting?
Dave_C is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:38 am   #11
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Southern Med
Programs: BAEC Silver, Flying Blue Gold, Gulf Air Gold, Aegean Gold, M&M FQTV, Air Malta Diamond
Posts: 618
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_C View Post
I thought, from the other side of the fence, that's what all the challenges people from Diamond Club have been having with changes to star alliance rewards made in the final days of the DC's existence? With all the schedule changes, BA are now left holding the baby without availability and are responsible for rebooking people?

It's either up to the home mileage programme i.e. M&M in this instance, with whom there's a contract and Diamond Club / Exec Club for the people on the BMI forum. Or instead the operating carriers as you seem to be suggesting?
Dave C, you need to read the regulations, I have saved you the trouble of reading the whole lot, but extracting some parts of it.

EU261/2004

‘operating air carrier’ means an air carrier that performs or
intends to perform a flight under a contract with a
passenger or on behalf of another person, legal or natural,
having a contract with that passenger;

Article 5
Cancellation
1. In case of cancellation of a flight, the passengers
concerned shall:
(a) be offered assistance by the operating air carrier in accordance
with Article 8; and
(b) be offered assistance by the operating air carrier in accordance
with Article 9(1)(a) and 9(2), as well as, in event of rerouting
when the reasonably expected time of departure of
the new flight is at least the day after the departure as it
was planned for the cancelled flight, the assistance specified
in Article 9(1)(b) and 9(1)(c); and
(c) have the right to compensation by the operating air carrier
in accordance with Article 7, unless:
(i) they are informed of the cancellation at least two
weeks before the scheduled time of departure; or
(ii) they are informed of the cancellation between two
weeks and seven days before the scheduled time of
departure and are offered re-routing, allowing them to
depart no more than two hours before the scheduled
time of departure and to reach their final destination
less than four hours after the scheduled time of arrival;
or
(iii) they are informed of the cancellation less than seven
days before the scheduled time of departure and are
offered re-routing, allowing them to depart no more
than one hour before the scheduled time of departure
and to reach their final destination less than two hours
after the scheduled time of arrival.
2. When passengers are informed of the cancellation, an
explanation shall be given concerning possible alternative transport.
3. An operating air carrier shall not be obliged to pay
compensation in accordance with Article 7, if it can prove that
the cancellation is caused by extraordinary circumstances
which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable
measures had been taken.
4. The burden of proof concerning the questions as to
whether and when the passenger has been informed of the
cancellation of the flight shall rest with the operating air
carrier.

Article 8

Right to reimbursement or re-routing
1. Where reference is made to this Article, passengers shall
be offered the choice between:
(a) — reimbursement within seven days, by the means
provided for in Article 7(3), of the full cost of the ticket
at the price at which it was bought, for the part or
parts of the journey not made, and for the part or parts
already made if the flight is no longer serving any
purpose in relation to the passenger's original travel
plan, together with, when relevant,
— a return flight to the first point of departure, at the
earliest opportunity;
(b) re-routing, under comparable transport conditions, to their
final destination at the earliest opportunity; or
(c) re-routing, under comparable transport conditions, to their
final destination at a later date at the passenger's convenience,
subject to availability of seats.
2. Paragraph 1(a) shall also apply to passengers whose
flights form part of a package, except for the right to reimbursement
where such right arises under Directive 90/314/EEC.
3. When, in the case where a town, city or region is served
by several airports, an operating air carrier offers a passenger a
flight to an airport alternative to that for which the booking
was made, the operating air carrier shall bear the cost of transferring
the passenger from that alternative airport either to that
for which the booking was made, or to another close-by destination
agreed with the passenger.

Article 9

Right to care
1. Where reference is made to this Article, passengers shall
be offered free of charge:
(a) meals and refreshments in a reasonable relation to the
waiting time;
(b) hotel accommodation in cases
— where a stay of one or more nights becomes necessary,
or
— where a stay additional to that intended by the
passenger becomes necessary;
(c) transport between the airport and place of accommodation
(hotel or other).
2. In addition, passengers shall be offered free of charge two
telephone calls, telex or fax messages, or e-mails.
3. In applying this Article, the operating air carrier shall pay
particular attention to the needs of persons with reduced mobility
and any persons accompanying them, as well as to the
needs of unaccompanied children.
Final 3 Greens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:41 am   #12
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Everywhere you want to be
Posts: 295
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWFI View Post
Why can't they give you AMM-FRA-LHR? Seems pretty reasonable to me.
The only Star Alliance inventory available was AMM-FRA-ZUR-LHR on the 3rd.
cure is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:43 am   #13
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Everywhere you want to be
Posts: 295
Quote:
Originally Posted by stewaran View Post
I dont quite understand.

BA have offered to book you on the 4am flight, but your not happy with that solution?
No. They have offered this rebooking to 'their own' passengers. They have refused to offer to me as my ticket was booked through Lufthansa's Miles and More.
cure is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:54 am   #14
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: WGC, UK
Programs: BAEC Silver, HHonors Diamond, Hertz 5*
Posts: 1,246
Quote:
Originally Posted by cure View Post
No. They have offered this rebooking to 'their own' passengers. They have refused to offer to me as my ticket was booked through Lufthansa's Miles and More.
apologies, Shouldn't FT whilst busy at work!

Good luck getting this sorted
__________________
My Flights
stewaran is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 21, 12, 2:55 am   #15
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Moscow / Aylesbury / Leeds
Programs: PADI DM BA-G BMI-G, SU-G, AF-G, CX-G Agean, G, UN B, Hhonours G, Starwood G, IHG G,
Posts: 661
Then you need to contact M& M as it's their award. They sold it (Miles are a currency too) and they will rebook you. The fact BMI flights (LH Codeshare or Star Alliance) became BA Flights (No LH Codeshare and no longer Star Alliance) after the purchase and therefore are no longer bookable by M&M would have been known by M&M, as Lufthansa did the selling to BA.

Not fun, I know, but M&M are your point of contact to address. They sold it so have the responsibility to provide travel on another LH, LH Codeshare or Star Alliance Flight.

This happened to a number of flights where after takeover, the flights were canceled or reschedulled to fit a different network needs and affected friends of mine and there is not a lot you can do with BA, only with LH
Behindthecurtain is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Bookmarks


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 6:44 pm.




SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.