SkyTeam - AF or DL in paid Business to JNB

If you had the choice of paid business AF on a 777-300 in Affaires or DL on a 777-200LR in Business Elite which would you choose?

The AF is IAD-CDG (for a lovely 12 hours in Paris)-JNB and return.

The DL is DCA-ATL-JNB and return.

They are both in the ~$4,000 range.

I have never ever been on an AF OR DL flight...hell, I've never NOT been on a Star Alliance flight, so even after over a million miles in the air this is all new to me. Please be gentle. :D

The DL flight unless you really want the 12 hrs in Paris.

I agree with hfly. 12 hours isn't really enough to get to Paris for anything worthwhile, and the AF lounges are pits IMO.

There's another aspect. If AF go on strike - it does happen - you'll be wishing you chose DL.

DL's 772LR have truly flat seats. AF's are angled. That would generally be enough to tip it to DL for me, unless you want the time in Paris.

And you can actually get into town for a bit during the 12 hour layover, certainly enough for some food and a few hours wandering the streets of Paris or hitting a museum or two. But it isn't terribly convenient to do so - reasonably expensive cabs or a mediocre bus service for transfers. I'd skip Paris just because it isn't worth it for me, but if it interests you then that is a decent option.

You could probably also mix the two and get the Paris stop one-way, I'd think.

DL's 772LR have truly flat seats. AF's are angled. That would generally be enough to tip it to DL for me, unless you want the time in Paris.

That's pretty significant.

Anyone have thoughts on the relative merits of the soft product?

This has been a debate on FT for many years that generally goes like this: Those who do not fly long haul regularly for some reason sometimes think that AF 's soft product is good. Those who fly TA on a weekly or monthly basis such as myself think it the pits. Delta catering is generally superior in every way. Delta has far wider drink selection, exponentially better than Af, unless you fancy yourself a wine person, and think that the one selection of white and one selection of red on AF is better. Delta's IFE is generally much better, although Af has caught up a bit (KLM's is one of the best in the sky if you get new a/c weirdly). Lastly the average DL FA is generally much better than the average Af FA, as AF FA's tend to serve the meal as fast as humanly possible (especially on evening flights) and then generally run away and hide in the galley and gossip/read magazines the entire flight, while DL FA's actually go through the cabin from time to time and ask if you want something (if you are up).

With the longer route AF will probably give you more miles? (Not sure about this after the changes to Flying Blue et al). So if you want to collect miles to use them later check which option is better for that.

This has been a debate on FT for many years that generally goes like this: Those who do not fly long haul regularly for some reason sometimes think that AF 's soft product is good. Those who fly TA on a weekly or monthly basis such as myself think it the pits. Delta catering is generally superior in every way. Delta has far wider drink selection, exponentially better than Af, unless you fancy yourself a wine person, and think that the one selection of white and one selection of red on AF is better. Delta's IFE is generally much better, although Af has caught up a bit (KLM's is one of the best in the sky if you get new a/c weirdly). Lastly the average DL FA is generally much better than the average Af FA, as AF FA's tend to serve the meal as fast as humanly possible (especially on evening flights) and then generally run away and hide in the galley and gossip/read magazines the entire flight, while DL FA's actually go through the cabin from time to time and ask if you want something (if you are up).

As someone who flies alot and have flown both DL and AF in Biz (and F on AF) I would say you have hit the nail on the head.

Your choice is a no-brainer, take DL.

As someone who flies alot and have flown both DL and AF in Biz (and F on AF) I would say you have hit the nail on the head.

Your choice is a no-brainer, take DL.

I just got off this flight (in Y). I generally avoid US carriers internationally as a rule, but I this experience has given me cause for pause. The AVOD is on par with the best I've ever used, the seats were as comfortable as Y seats get, the food was as edible as Y food gets (I particularly appreciated the open snack area), but more than anything the crew was incredible. Aside from a generally positive attitude, I don't think I've ever been on a flight with more water runs throughout the entire night. If I had that experience in Y, I can only assume J will be that much better. While I assume AF will have more polished FAs and service, my experience with Delta was overwhelmingly positive and lie flat vs. angled would make it an absolute no brainer.

Well your assumption is wrong. AF FA's are rarely more polished, etc. Many wear a scarf tied sideways around their neck, for certain midwestern people on their first trip to Europe that may be considered more polished. Then again the sky theme fleece t-shirt they wear certainly isn't. On TA they are perhaps a bit younger and thinner, but that is it.

If you have a choice between a fully flat seat, and an angled seat, choosing the fully flat seat is a no-brainer. Seriously, the food will be edible on both airlines, and the service will be fine. You'll be done with both two hours into the flight and at that point the only thing that will matter will be the seat -- all you'll want is the closest thing to your bed and a bottle of water.

I've never flown on a DL flat seat, but have flown on flat seats on other airlines. I've also flown AF's business, and I can tell you that you will be much much happier when you land after having 7+ hours of sleep on a flat bed, which, unless you are an amazing sleeper, you will not get on a ski slope seat.

Go for the flat bed seat.

Having done the AF, KLM and DL, and SAA flights to Joburg, mostly in coach, let me say this.

These new 777 LR that DL is running from ATL are amazing! Food good, seats comfortable, flight (even at 17 hrs) is easy.

KLM uses 747-400s on their leg. Ok, but no where near DL

AF: well, I really don't like AF regardless of where I'm going. I've had worn out seats, bad service, attitude, etc.

For me, there is no comparison at this point. DL has this leg hands down.

Of course, if you flew AF or KL, you'd earn more miles.

Well, fwiw, I was sold on DL but then decided to pocket the $4gs and book a *A F ticket on LH IAD-FRA-JNB instead. So I'll get the lay-flat AND the LH F Terminal experience at FRA (including a day-room at a hotel near FRA).

But I certainly appreciate the advice. I'd have thought AF would be the way to go. Thank goodness for FT. ^