Virgin America Elevate - When will VX add ORD???

My wife's from Chicagoland so we often fly SFO/ORD on UA, which costs much more than SFO/JFK on UA ps...

When will VX add ORD so that the SFO/ORD flights will (probably) fall in price, or at least be the same or cheaper than SFO/JFK?

It's always frustrating to pay more but get fewer EQM (or equivalent points)... even if the flight is shorter :D

When there are open gates, and planes that can do the service.

Maybe Q2/Q3 2010:

Cush said Virgin America may secure airport gates at Chicago’s O’Hare by early in 2010’s second quarter. The carrier suspended an effort to start O’Hare flights in December when airlines controlling the gates refused to make any available to Virgin America.

Delta Air Lines Inc. is in talks with the city of Chicago to surrender some slots it holds at O’Hare after consolidating operations with Northwest Airlines, which Delta purchased last year, Cush said.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aUvzvOX2eU7E (under the "Chicago Competition" heading)

Here's the skinny...

DL has 5 gates in the L-concourse. In Nov they will be consolidating DL-NW ops in the E-concourse. When this happens the gates over in L will open (as will the current DL Sky Club located there). DL and VX are currently in discussions about VX subleasing gates from DL after the move.

VX can not get to ORD fast enough for me. Been waiting for two years...

Here's the skinny...

DL has 5 gates in the L-concourse. In Nov they will be consolidating DL-NW ops in the E-concourse. When this happens the gates over in L will open (as will the current DL Sky Club located there). DL and VX are currently in discussions about VX subleasing gates from DL after the move.

VX can not get to ORD fast enough for me. Been waiting for two years...

I have also been hoping (and pining) for SFO-ORD since VX started.

A little speculation: VX may have some expansion cash if/when their next round of capital is approved. Let's hope they are planning an ORD expansion. Also, VA (V Australia) is getting friendly with DL - maybe this will help VX with it's gates in some way (probably not).

I have no idea where VX will be in ORD for which the gate space will have opening. Right now, there is no current opening new gate space availability. DL might have to be relocated to concourse E along with NW. If city of Chicago will have to decide own facts to get finalization approval for VX. If VX will have wait to get officially announcement. I'n surely VX will becoming focus cities out of ORD-SFO/LAX/JFK/MIA/BOS/LAS. What about old DL ticket counter will have to be relocated to another terminals. This is particulary consideration VX will wait to get approved from city of Chicago. So just wait to see for which the gate space is available will be choose.

I have no idea where VX will be in ORD for which the gate space will have opening. Right now, there is no current opening new gate space availability. DL might have to be relocated to concourse E along with NW. If city of Chicago will have to decide own facts to get finalization approval for VX. If VX will have wait to get officially announcement. I'n surely VX will becoming focus cities out of ORD-SFO/LAX/JFK/MIA/BOS/LAS. What about old DL ticket counter will have to be relocated to another terminals. This is particulary consideration VX will wait to get approved from city of Chicago. So just wait to see for which the gate space is available will be choose.

As I understand it DL has already announced the consolidation to concourse E beginning in November. All operations (ticketing, lounge, baggae claim and pax ops will move to concourse E at that time and DL wil operate 9 gates out of concourse E (take over those vacated by CO since they are now operating out of UA gates over in Terminal 1).

DL has a long-term lease on the gates in concourse L and can sublet them to whom ever they choose, provided the carrier is granted landing rights. Given the the fact that ORD traffic is in a freefall a la AA and UA tanking and the loss of intl service, and the fact that VX is a highly coveted airline, I cannot imgaine the folks at ORD would say no to VX.

My prediction is sometime early in 2010.

VX CEO Cush has stated to the press that they were in discussions with DL about ORD gate space earlier this year, but the timing didn't work out as to when VX wanted to add a new city. I'd assume that once the DL/NW consolidation happens, they'll be in better shape.

As I understand it DL has already announced the consolidation to concourse E beginning in November. All operations (ticketing, lounge, baggae claim and pax ops will move to concourse E at that time and DL wil operate 9 gates out of concourse E (take over those vacated by CO since they are now operating out of UA gates over in Terminal 1).

DL has a long-term lease on the gates in concourse L and can sublet them to whom ever they choose, provided the carrier is granted landing rights. Given the the fact that ORD traffic is in a freefall a la AA and UA tanking and the loss of intl service, and the fact that VX is a highly coveted airline, I cannot imgaine the folks at ORD would say no to VX.

My prediction is sometime early in 2010.

I don't see anything more choice for VX. If ORD does not have any choice to bring more new gate space available. I cannot ask why they are fought against of city of Chicago will have to decide own logical choice. Mainwhile, I don't see any found the evidence VX is not to be considers service to ORD for this time. This is bad situation going on from DL will be swapped to concourse E gates. So unfortunately, we cannot have proved VX is not have to decide bring into ORD. My guessing the answered is no. VX will have to be accepted for awhile.

OK, here's the news article I was looking for (http://www.chicagobusiness.com/cgi-bin/news.pl?id=32106) to back up what I asserted above:

Virgin was having more luck with Delta Air Lines, which is expected to have excess capacity at O’Hare because of its merger with Northwest Airlines.

“They’ve been the most cooperative,” Mr. Cush said. “We just ran out of time. I need a place I can put these airplanes in February.”

So I'd say that once DL leaves their former NW gates, VX will be in better shape, and it will be a question of planes and timing.

Keep in mind DL doesn't serve SFO or LAX direct from ORD, so they are unlikely to be as unhelpful as UA and AA (who do). Of course, if VX wanted to serve ORD from JFK, that might be a problem for DL, since they fly that route with Comair RJs... but I tend to think VX won't do that, and will probably fly from CA.

Keep in mind DL doesn't serve SFO or LAX direct from ORD, so they are unlikely to be as unhelpful as UA and AA (who do). Of course, if VX wanted to serve ORD from JFK, that might be a problem for DL, since they fly that route with Comair RJs... but I tend to think VX won't do that, and will probably fly from CA.

Yeah, I believe that so. VX will have to be consider service for ORD-LAX/SFO or JFK. That's possiblity for VX will have decide to get city of Chicago approval to get more gate space available. If VX doesn't have any opened the gate space in the concourse L. They will have to be accepted own facts. VX will have go to MDW is still have enough gate space available. IT will be perfect time for MDW instead of ORD.

If VX doesn't have any opened the gate space in the concourse L. They will have to be accepted own facts. VX will have go to MDW is still have enough gate space available. IT will be perfect time for MDW instead of ORD.

There are enough gates for VX to use in concourse L. DL had downsize a lot on ORD-ATL thru the years, ever remember the days DL use L10 and 763 to ORD ? And what are they using now ? M80, M90, and occasion 738, plus RJ. DL can totally fit in concourse E, former TW gates never re-used, CO had already moved into T1 B gates with UA.

How do you know MDW has gates available ? Since TZ folded, remember WN had purchased those gates too.

Also the most important thing is the creation of VX is to compete head to head with majors, not minors. That's why VX use SFO instead of OAK, JFK instead of LGA or EWR. MDW is full of leisure travelers, whereas ORD is for business travelers, also with all the international flights. Yields from ORD is way better than MDW. Basically WN already flies to so many cities out of MDW and in a low price. Would those people been flying WN all the time and switch to VX ? Maybe, but defintaely no one would fly F, or buy F upfront, rather than standby upgrade. Also no one is going to pay more for exit or bulkhead, as WN is free for all.

It is not uncommon many companies pay to fly F on ORD-SFO on AA or UA, that's why this route is always expensive even with so many flights a day. In a business, do you want pax pay F upfront or standby for updrades ? Which would earn more money ?

It also would not really affect UA and AA on the same route at all, as ORD get all the connecting traffic, whereas MDW got none, who would buy two tickets fly WN for one segment, then VX for the next segment ? WN already has 6 flights a day to SFO, and 6 flights a day to OAK. UA and AA had never lower their fares because WN is on the same route, as their demographic are totally different.

MDW are almost completely controlled by WN, with only a handful of flights operated by several other airlines. VX will definately become a loser in MDW to compete aganist WN, as there are also limited expansion for VX.

There are enough gates for VX to use in concourse L. DL had downsize a lot on ORD-ATL thru the years, ever remember the days DL use L10 and 763 to ORD ? And what are they using now ? M80, M90, and occasion 738, plus RJ. DL can totally fit in concourse E, former TW gates never re-used, CO had already moved into T1 B gates with UA.

How do you know MDW has gates available ? Since TZ folded, remember WN had purchased those gates too.

Also the most important thing is the creation of VX is to compete head to head with majors, not minors. That's why VX use SFO instead of OAK, JFK instead of LGA or EWR. MDW is full of leisure travelers, whereas ORD is for business travelers, also with all the international flights. Yields from ORD is way better than MDW. Basically WN already flies to so many cities out of MDW and in a low price. Would those people been flying WN all the time and switch to VX ? Maybe, but defintaely no one would fly F, or buy F upfront, rather than standby upgrade. Also no one is going to pay more for exit or bulkhead, as WN is free for all.

It is not uncommon many companies pay to fly F on ORD-SFO on AA or UA, that's why this route is always expensive even with so many flights a day. In a business, do you want pax pay F upfront or standby for updrades ? Which would earn more money ?

I'm pretty confident for which the gate space available in MDW. I think it will be better time VX will go to MDW instead of going to ORD. I don't have any considers go to ORD due to leaked overcrowded. I think both AA & UA has been already reduction the flights due to the congestions. UA & AA will have more flexibility the schedules. This is problems lot of flights is delayed due to traffic control or weather. I think VX should have enough the space available in the concourse L.

I think it would be perfect time to have to be considering VX will decide to be approved from city of Chicago. Let's the speculation begin! I can see for which specific routes will be choose. I think VX will have more potential new routes from ORD-FLL/JFK/BOS or LAX/SFO. VX have need to be stepped it up to bring more new routes out SFO-AUS/SAT/IAH/MSY/MCI/MCO/TPA/ATL. What about utilitization the aircraft availability to bring the capacity passengers growth out of SFO. When the terminal will be completion done in few more years later. It should have to be console up to bring more demand out SFO/LAX. However, it need to take the advantage of it. This is situation going on for VX will wait to see if they have enough aircraft available to expanded new routes SFO-PHX/ABQ/SLC/RNO/PDX. I think it will be successful out of SFO.

I'm pretty confident for which the gate space available in MDW. I think it will be better time VX will go to MDW instead of going to ORD. I don't have any considers go to ORD due to leaked overcrowded. I think both AA & UA has been already reduction the flights due to the congestions. UA & AA will have more flexibility the schedules. This is problems lot of flights is delayed due to traffic control or weather. I think VX should have enough the space available in the concourse L.




Then VX has to transform itself to be a low cost airline in order to move in MDW. Other than WN, most carriers are using RJ into MDW as the loads are not that good compare to ORD. It has FL, F9 is about to be gone soon, FD is using DH8, DL is using RJ, NW has a few flights to MSP and DTW using mostly RJ, that's all about it. Years ago, UA and US also served MDW, they all had pull out completely, as this is really a low cost, leisure traveler hub. MDW has no way to expand at all because of the airport unlike ORD.

In terms of AA and UA being reduction of flights due to the congestion, I can tell you they may reduce flights on some cities, but never reduce any flight for ORD-SFO, as this is a solid route. I would definately want VX to move in to ORD in order to lower some of the high price charging by AA and UA, and possibly some improvement of services on this route.