Travel Technology - Time Zones, Calendar Appointments, Smartphones

On my old Palm Treo, when you physically changed time zones, the appointments on the calendar would keep their times. So lets say I had a flight leaving DFW 4pm local and arriving EWR 9pm local. While in my office in New York, I would enter that into Outlook as an appointment from 4pm to 9pm, and it would show up on the Treo as 4pm to 9pm. And while in Dallas, it would still show as an appointment from 4pm (the correct time) until 9pm (the correct time).

But now I have WinMo phone, and the appointments move around when you physically change locations. So an appointment entered as 4pm-9pm in NY appears as 3pm-8pm while I'm in Dallas. If I don't think about it, I show up at the airport early (which happened), and I book my car service for the wrong time (which happened, and cost me $100 in wait time).

Is there some way to get WinMo to behave in a more intuitive fashion for frequent travelers? Other than manually calculating the times, or turning off the automatic time zone - both of which make the phone less useful than my 5 year Treo.

use time-zones when entering the appointments in outlook and when you change the time-zone on your treo the appointments will always be correct.

use time-zones when entering the appointments in outlook and when you change the time-zone on your treo the appointments will always be correct.

One of my frustrations with Outlook 2003 (corporate laptop...) is that one cannot set the timezone when entering an appointment (whereas I can on my Blackberry).

/dnastudios

use time-zones when entering the appointments in outlook and when you change the time-zone on your treo the appointments will always be correct.

Sure, but then the appointments won't have the right "me" time in Outlook. And I enter a lot of appointments from my Windows-based smartphone, and there is no way to set the time zone there - all appointments take the current time zone of phone.

After googling this issue and reading the many, many complaints about this around the web, I'm coming to the conclusion that no matter what I do, I'm going to be calculating times for something in my head. Apparently it's a "feature" of Exchange, which was designed for corporate collaboration, and not for small businesses like mine.

Here's the best discussion I found: http://www.windowsmobiletraining.com/connection/forums/t/2566.aspx

Just another example of a Microsoft product that's designed by engineers, not by users.

That "feature" bugs the hell out of me, too. I hate it. Got a WinMO 5.0 device which I like otherwise.

Thinking about getting an Iphone. Does the Iphone behave better or does it make the same mistake?

Till

Thinking about getting an Iphone. Does the Iphone behave better or does it make the same mistake?

I believe the iPhone allows you to turn off the automatic appointment time "updating".

For my money, the old Palm OS did it best: you got a checkbox for each appointment to say whether that appointment was in "me" time or "network" time.

The only realistic way to make this work is to work out the time zone manually. I disable time updating on my Blackberry, and it always stays in my home time zone. Appointments go into the Outlook calendar in my home time zone (not hard to calculate this for US travel, takes a few seconds for some international trips), and they are always correct. I get alarms / reminders when I should.

I spend 80% of my time in a time zone other than my "home" one, and I barely even give this a moment's thought anymore. Works perfectly well.

Put me on the list of folks who actually like that the system recognizes time zones. I don't want a flight blocking out 14 hours on my calendar if it is only 8 hours long with a 6 hour time zone change. In Outlook it is trivial to show a different timezone on your calendar (Tools | Options | Calendar Options | Time Zone) if you need to see both at the same time.

I think that without time zone updating everything would be just screwy. Notifications wouldn't trigger that the correct time, for one thing. Collaboration on multi-user appointments would be more difficult for another. I wish my BB would automatically update its time zone based off of the network or GPS data, but instead I manually adjust the time zone just so I can use this feature.

FWIW I've always wanted a system that let me chose a "time zone display type" for each event. The two cases are conference calls and flight arrival times. If a conference call happens at 1 pm Eastern, and I travel from NY to SF, then I want to be reminded at 10 am Pacific. However, if I arrive back in New York from SF at 5:30, I don't want to tell people I'll arrive at 2:30 because I saw it displayed in pacific time.

In otherwords some events should ideally be reported relative to your current time zone, some should be reported according to a target time zone, and I wish calendaring software let you specify which is which.

For those who like time zone updating, how would you deal with the following: you are in NY and have a lunch at noon on the 1st, then you'll fly to Paris and have lunch at noon on the 3rd, then on to London for lunch on the 5th?

If you enter everything in NY time, when your Paris lunch person calls you'll have to translate to Paris time. If you enter everything as noon, the appt will fail if you adjust device time to local time. Enter everything in NY time, but note the local time in the appt description?

For those who like time zone updating, how would you deal with the following: you are in NY and have a lunch at noon on the 1st, then you'll fly to Paris and have lunch at noon on the 3rd, then on to London for lunch on the 5th?

If you enter everything in NY time, when your Paris lunch person calls you'll have to translate to Paris time. If you enter everything as noon, the appt will fail if you adjust device time to local time. Enter everything in NY time, but note the local time in the appt description?

Simple. Enter the Paris events in Paris time! Click the little time zone button when adding the appointment in outlook. Do the same for the London events in London time. I do it all the time. (Was this a trick question? Seems too simple to me.)

Interesting to see the differences of opinions here. I use Windows Mobile 6.1 and Outlook 2007 and I feel that frequently travelling / crossing time zones is more intuitive now than ever.

Windows Mobile automatically adjusts appointments to the local time zone. When I'm travelling, my phone is my source of truth. It displays the correct local present time, and the correct local time of my next appointment. No thinking, no time zone conversions in my head. The phone is always accurate.

And when you're in Outlook, adding additional time zones to the calendar is simple, as sbm12 pointed out.

If you live in NY and you're flying to Paris and want to make sure that you show up at all of your Paris meetings on time, and make it to the airport in Paris at the correct time on your return flight back to NY, and schedule your car service for the right time, just enter all of your Paris appointments in Outlook and select the Paris time zone when you enter them. When you get there, Windows Mobile will automatically adjust everything to the local time.

IMHO it couldn't be any easier.

Simple. Enter the Paris events in Paris time! Click the little time zone button when adding the appointment in outlook. Do the same for the London events in London time. I do it all the time. (Was this a trick question? Seems too simple to me.)
My outlook (2003) has the option to show all appointments in two different times zones (tools->options->calendar options->time zones->show an additional time zone). Is that what you mean? If so, my original question had three time zones (NY, London and Paris), so two is not enough to see local time easily displayed. Or do you mean something else?

I suppose this means I should upgrade to 2007, which I see allows entering appointments in any time zone.

My outlook (2003) has the option to show all appointments in two different times zones (tools->options->calendar options->time zones->show an additional time zone). Is that what you mean? If so, my original question had three time zones (NY, London and Paris), so two is not enough to see local time easily displayed. Or do you mean something else?

elCheapo is referring to entering time zones, not displaying them. See the example appointment I created below. Outlook 2007 makes it super easy to enter appointments in other times, or appointments like flights that cross time zones.

If you use a Windows Mobile 6.x device, it will automatically adjust itself to the correct local time based on the time zone you're in, and will automatically represent your appointments in the correct local time.

I'm with elCheapo, this is just too easy.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2447/3654020818_cd02492c47_o.jpg

elCheapo is referring to entering time zones, not displaying them. See the example appointment I created below. Outlook 2007 makes it super easy to enter appointments in other times, or appointments like flights that cross time zones.

If you use a Windows Mobile 6.x device, it will automatically adjust itself to the correct local time based on the time zone you're in, and will automatically represent your appointments in the correct local time.

I'm with elCheapo, this is just too easy.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2447/3654020818_cd02492c47_o.jpg

Is this specific to 2007? I'm still using Outlook 2003.

Also for WinMo can Agenda One handle any of these nuisances? I'm in the camp that doesn't like the appointment times shifting..

Is this specific to 2007? I'm still using Outlook 2003.

Yes, this is a new feature of Outlook 2007

Also for WinMo can Agenda One handle any of these nuisances? I'm in the camp that doesn't like the appointment times shifting..

Just to be clear...Windows Mobile DOES NOT "shift" appointment times. What Windows Mobile does is merely represent the appointment start/end times into the same local time zone that you're physically in, but the appointment itself never moves.

For example, say you enter an appt for 3pm EST then you fly to CST. WinMo will automatically show the appt as starting at 2pm CST. Then lets say you fly to PST; WinMo will automatically show it as starting at 12pm PST. But all the while, the appointment itself is not being modified whatsoever in Exchange and/or Outlook. It remains at 3pm EST, right where you put it. Windows Mobile is merely converting the appointment to your local, physical time zone, without modifying the appointment.

I'm right with you in the camp that doesn't like appointments shifting, and Windows Mobile definitely does not do this. I want my appointments to stay exactly where I put them.

As far as your Agenda One question, I'm not sure, never used it. However I do think that you can disable Windows Mobile's automatic timezone feature.

The iPhone definitely has time zone support. On--it keeps your appts in your local time zone, Off--it changes their times to the time zone of the phone wherever you are at the moment.

The iPhone definitely has time zone support. On--it keeps your appts in your local time zone, Off--it changes their times to the time zone of the phone wherever you are at the moment.

Just to be sure I understand correctly. Say I am in Austin, TX. I enter and appointment into the Iphone for the next week when I will be in Berlin, Germany. I enter the appointment for noon (12pm) while I am in Austin. Then I go to Berlin. The clock on the Iphone will change to local time for Berlin.

Which setting do I need to choose so that the calendar still indicates noon and not 7pm for my appointment?

Thanks.

Till

Just to be sure I understand correctly. Say I am in Austin, TX. I enter and appointment into the Iphone for the next week when I will be in Berlin, Germany. I enter the appointment for noon (12pm) while I am in Austin. Then I go to Berlin. The clock on the Iphone will change to local time for Berlin.

Which setting do I need to choose so that the calendar still indicates noon and not 7pm for my appointment?

Thanks.

Till

I can't answer your question, but I'm just curious what your desired result is? I'm unclear, in this example is the appointment at noon Paris time or 7pm Paris time?

Do you want your iPhone to display the appointment in the correct local time once you get to Paris, or do you want your iPhone to display the appointment in Texas time while you're in Paris?

Just to be sure I understand correctly. Say I am in Austin, TX. I enter and appointment into the Iphone for the next week when I will be in Berlin, Germany. I enter the appointment for noon (12pm) while I am in Austin. Then I go to Berlin. The clock on the Iphone will change to local time for Berlin.

Which setting do I need to choose so that the calendar still indicates noon and not 7pm for my appointment?

Thanks.

Till

You need to enter the appointment for 5am in Texas since that is when it actually is happening. Times are not absolute; they are relative.

I haven't used outlook 2007, either. Do all day events, like Thanksgiving, still shift from midnight to midnight in your home timezone, to offset times in your current local timezone? [Thanks]

I can't answer your question, but I'm just curious what your desired result is? I'm unclear, in this example is the appointment at noon Paris time or 7pm Paris time?

Do you want your iPhone to display the appointment in the correct local time once you get to Paris, or do you want your iPhone to display the appointment in Texas time while you're in Paris?

It is a lunch appointment. So that's 12pm local time in Paris or Berlin. I am just entering it now already while I am in the States. I want to pencil in the appointment for noon for when I am in Berlin. If I had a paper calendar, that's exactly what I would do. I want my electronic calendar to behave like a paper calendar. When I write an appoint for a day, I know where I will be that day and I know that I want to have lunch at noon, not at 7pm. :)

You need to enter the appointment for 5am in Texas since that is when it actually is happening. Times are not absolute; they are relative.

Are you talking about the Iphone or a WinMO device? I know that times are relative. :p

This just reminds me that I have an appointment for lunch tomorrow. Thanks FT. :)

Till

It is a lunch appointment. So that's 12pm local time in Paris or Berlin. I am just entering it now already while I am in the States. I want to pencil in the appointment for noon for when I am in Berlin. If I had a paper calendar, that's exactly what I would do. I want my electronic calendar to behave like a paper calendar. When I write an appoint for a day, I know where I will be that day and I know that I want to have lunch at noon, not at 7pm. :)

Ahh, OK. If I were in that situation I would enter the appointment in Outlook for noon and select the Paris time zone. It would then automatically appear on my WinMo device at the correct local time once I get to Paris.

In fact I do this all the time. I'm in sales and half of my territory is EST and the other half is CST. I enter my appointments into Outlook using whatever time zone my appointment is in, and then as I'm driving back and forth my WinMo device will automatically adjust my appointments into the correct local time and I never have to worry about it.

You need to enter the appointment for 5am in Texas since that is when it actually is happening. Times are not absolute; they are relative.

not necessarily. You can turn on timezone support and if you enter the appointment as a 12 noon appointment in austin, it will still show it as 12 non when you are in paris. The iPhone lets you decide whether you want the times shown in absolute time or relative time. So as the iPhone says "Time Zone Support always shows event dates and times in the time zone selected for calenders." i.e. Austin. "When off, events will display according to the time zone of your current location." This is if you set the iPhone to automatically update your time based on the system time.

not necessarily. You can turn on timezone support and if you enter the appointment as a 12 noon appointment in austin, it will still show it as 12 non when you are in paris. The iPhone lets you decide whether you want the times shown in absolute time or relative time. So as the iPhone says "Time Zone Support always shows event dates and times in the time zone selected for calenders." i.e. Austin. "When off, events will display according to the time zone of your current location." This is if you set the iPhone to automatically update your time based on the system time.

Cool, thanks very much. ^

Also for WinMo can Agenda One handle any of these nuisances? I'm in the camp that doesn't like the appointment times shifting..

No.

I've tried most of the WinMo calendar apps I could fine, and the only one to support time zones is Pocket Informant - but even that is limited. First, it only supports time zones on WinMo phones with a touch screen. Second, it only allows you to enter a time zone when you create an appointment. If you later need to change the time of the appointment, you lose the ability to select a time zone.