American Express Membership Rewards - Amex cost for making the titanium card

I posted someone was selling immitation cards on ebay and the thread went out of hand. These cards were plastic or just metal and obvoiusly looked nothing like the actual card.

I am curious if the cost of the annual membership for centurion had anything to do with the cost of metal going up over the years.

Has amex ever confirmed that this card is 100% titanium or does everyone assume this? And if it is its got to cost a good amount of money to produce, no?

What you guys think?

I'm sure they're relatively inexpensive to make. Like any other marketing gimmick, it needs to be cheap enough in the grand scheme of things to pay off.

Titanium's only +/- $10/lb, and you can probably make a lot of cards from that pound. A purpose-built CNC machine's probably another $1M, but I'm sure Amex just outsourced it, so that wasn't an expense they had to pay.

If I had to pick a number out of thin air, it probably costs them <$30 per card to produce. Probably a lot less depending on volume.

No way it is ground on a CNC machine. I'd bet the blanks are stamped on a regular stamping machine and then the number "punched" in and the mag strip applied. No way the cost is even close to $30, IMO...much lower. Even the laser etching/painting is relatively cheap.

n.b. - I've never actually seen one but I did work for a bit in an office where we were manufacturing things and Ti was one of the more common metals used.

The Black Amex Centurion card is made by First Data. They also handle Visa/Mastercard processing.

I'm sure they're relatively inexpensive to make. Like any other marketing gimmick, it needs to be cheap enough in the grand scheme of things to pay off.

Titanium's only +/- $10/lb, and you can probably make a lot of cards from that pound. A purpose-built CNC machine's probably another $1M, but I'm sure Amex just outsourced it, so that wasn't an expense they had to pay.

If I had to pick a number out of thin air, it probably costs them <$30 per card to produce. Probably a lot less depending on volume.

That would make sense. I guess when the US just had the cards it may have cost them allot more since quantity is a factor. Since all centurion members have titanium cards now

I am curious if the cost of the annual membership for centurion had anything to do with the cost of metal going up over the years.

WILD notion

The Black Amex Centurion card is made by First Data. They also handle Visa/Mastercard processing.

Isnt first data a merchant proccessing company?

No way it is ground on a CNC machine. I'd bet the blanks are stamped on a regular stamping machine and then the number "punched" in and the mag strip applied. No way the cost is even close to $30, IMO...much lower. Even the laser etching/painting is relatively cheap.

n.b. - I've never actually seen one but I did work for a bit in an office where we were manufacturing things and Ti was one of the more common metals used.

Titanium is a very solid metal. You cant embossed it like other metals. I have noticed my freinds earlier card the numbers and name was not very even and almost looked welded on. On the new card it is uniform and looks like a regular card..

I think that whole process may be slightly expensive. Im guessing until they got it down they didnt send everyone the titanium card. I bet in the beggining it was expensive for them.

I bet its not to cheap or other card companys would have done it. Unless they have a trademark of some sort on it?

I received the titanium card in Q4 of 2007. If I remember correctly, they wrote that the card was manufactured at 1700° Celsius (about 3000 °F).

In the reminder booklet for 2009 (dated nov. 2008) it's written : "your card is made from pure titanium which has been meticulously hand-finished ..."

I don't think the metal makes the price, but the partially manual manufacturing process. The card is not embossed, the reverse side is perfectly flat.

I received the titanium card in Q4 of 2007. If I remember correctly, they wrote that the card was manufactured at 1700° Celsius (about 3000 °F).

In the reminder booklet for 2009 (dated nov. 2008) it's written : "your card is made from pure titanium which has been meticulously hand-finished ..."

I don't think the metal makes the price, but the partially manual manufacturing process. The card is not embossed, the reverse side is perfectly flat.

The numbers are raised but I guess not embossed, just interesting how they crafted it to begin with.

Isnt first data a merchant proccessing company?

Yes First Data is a Visa/Masetercard process company but they also makes credit cards including the Centurion.

The card is not embossed, the reverse side is perfectly flat.

i believe that the back is flat because a rear panel is attached over the place where the numbers are punched. if you look closely at the back of your card, you can see/feel the tiny gap between the card body and where the gold bordered back panel is mounted into it.

has anyone ever tried to pull of the back panel? i received a replacement card recently (the white signature strip wore off of my previous card) and am considering trying to remove the back panel of the old one to see what's underneath.

i believe that the back is flat because a rear panel is attached over the place where the numbers are punched. if you look closely at the back of your card, you can see/feel the tiny gap between the card body and where the gold bordered back panel is mounted into it.

has anyone ever tried to pull of the back panel? i received a replacement card recently (the white signature strip wore off of my previous card) and am considering trying to remove the back panel of the old one to see what's underneath.

you're right ! I didn't notice before that this information box was a "removable" panel. Now it's clear for me how they embossed the numbers and name from the back side.

No way it is ground on a CNC machine. I'd bet the blanks are stamped on a regular stamping machine and then the number "punched" in and the mag strip applied. No way the cost is even close to $30, IMO...much lower. Even the laser etching/painting is relatively cheap.

n.b. - I've never actually seen one but I did work for a bit in an office where we were manufacturing things and Ti was one of the more common metals used.

Gosh, I guess I was being generous then. What do you think is accurate? $5-$10?

Gosh, I guess I was being generous then. What do you think is accurate? $5-$10?

I actually think its probably relatively expense to make, otherwise by now another company would have come along and offered a "Titanium" card to drum up business.

If the card only cost $30 to make, why not just offer it to anyone at a low annual fee?

FWIW, the numbering/lettering on the card is somewhat hard to read. They could do a lot better.

I actually think its probably relatively expense to make, otherwise by now another company would have come along and offered a "Titanium" card to drum up business.

If the card only cost $30 to make, why not just offer it to anyone at a low annual fee?

FWIW, the numbering/lettering on the card is somewhat hard to read. They could do a lot better.

I think it's probably very inexpensive, but the manufacturing process might be patented by either Amex or 1st Data, or whoever invented and licensed it to Amex.

That's probably why other issuers haven't caught onto the gimmick.

Hummm now that you say it I did notice that the back of the card were the border is around the number is cut out... interesting

Its patented for sure or everyone would be doing it. I guess its really smart on their part and wonder how long they own the rights for it.

I am positive the process since its patented by amex and the manufacture is not doing it for anyone but them is very expensive. I am sure they are allot of R and D put into this card.

In the 10th anniversary centurion magazine I got yesterday it says this about the card ...."Apart from being the world's only titanium card, the lettering has been individually set and the metalwork has been hand finished."

I still think you guys are deluding yourselves if you think these cost more than $30 a pop, and that's probably being generous.

It looks as though Amex is a part applicant on one or more patents pertaining to metal transaction cards (specifically mentioning Titanium).

Gandel, Lasch and Webb are the inventors on Patent 11/044662 (2006/081385) filed around 01/26/2005 (from memory, only individuals can be accredited as inventors - not companies).

The 3 inventors are US applicants - and the fourth applicant was American Express Travel Related Services Company Inc (US and non-US).

Abstract
Metal-containing transaction cards, useful for the purchase of goods and/or services, and methods of making the same are provided. The metal-containing transaction card may have a magnetic stripe, an embedded microchip, a signature panel, a holographic image, or any other feature typically contained on or within a transaction card. The transaction cards have at least one layer of metal with, optionally, other layers of substrates, such as thermoplastic polymers, other metals or adhesives. In addition, the metal-containing transaction card may be anodized, coated, or laser-engraved. Preferably, the metal is titanium or stainless steel.


The 3 inventors have similar transaction card patents and may work for Amex but this cannot be certain.

What can be certain though, is that Amex can exercise an element of control who uses this particular technology/process to produce metal cards.

If someone wants to cost out the process, a method of production is included in one of the patents. Just search for "United States Patent Application 20070170264" and click on the link to freepatentsonline.

It looks as though Amex is a part applicant on one or more patents pertaining to metal transaction cards (specifically mentioning Titanium).

Gandel, Lasch and Webb are the inventors on Patent 11/044662 (2006/081385) filed around 01/26/2005 (from memory, only individuals can be accredited as inventors - not companies).

The 3 inventors are US applicants - and the fourth applicant was American Express Travel Related Services Company Inc (US and non-US).

Abstract
Metal-containing transaction cards, useful for the purchase of goods and/or services, and methods of making the same are provided. The metal-containing transaction card may have a magnetic stripe, an embedded microchip, a signature panel, a holographic image, or any other feature typically contained on or within a transaction card. The transaction cards have at least one layer of metal with, optionally, other layers of substrates, such as thermoplastic polymers, other metals or adhesives. In addition, the metal-containing transaction card may be anodized, coated, or laser-engraved. Preferably, the metal is titanium or stainless steel.


The 3 inventors have similar transaction card patents and may work for Amex but this cannot be certain.

What can be certain though, is that Amex can exercise an element of control who uses this particular technology/process to produce metal cards.

If someone wants to cost out the process, a method of production is included in one of the patents. Just search for "United States Patent Application 20070170264" and click on the link to freepatentsonline.

Thats really interesting. I wonder if they have patented the use of or the procedure more or less.

It would be insane to say that no card company can make a card out of metal.

It would be insane to say that no card company can make a card out of metal.

other companies do make credit cards out of metal.

i believe in the the year before last's neiman marcus incircle catalogue (that described the perks for the different incircle levels) once you reached chairman's circle you received an 18 karat white gold neiman marcus incircle charge card. they changed the incircle programme substantially this year so i'm not certain if they still give these out.

saks fifth avenue also had a (real) gold card charge plate that you could purchase in the 1980's. i remember seeing it in one of their catalogues when i was in high school. if i remember correctly it was $1500.

other companies do make credit cards out of metal.

i believe in the the year before last's neiman marcus incircle catalogue (that described the perks for the different incircle levels) once you reached chairman's circle you received an 18 karat white gold neiman marcus incircle charge card. they changed the incircle programme substantially this year so i'm not certain if they still give these out.

saks fifth avenue also had a (real) gold card charge plate that you could purchase in the 1980's. i remember seeing it in one of their catalogues when i was in high school. if i remember correctly it was $1500.

Wow very cool I did not know this.
I think gold is to soft to use as everyday chargecard but for sure would be cool

Not the same Lisa Ann Webb that was part of the team for the transparent Blue card, hence the L A Webb on the front for all marketing shots?

I actually think its probably relatively expense to make, otherwise by now another company would have come along and offered a "Titanium" card to drum up business.


Why mass produce a card that has trouble being used in machines that ingest the card (not just swipe)?

Why mass produce a card that has trouble being used in machines that ingest the card (not just swipe)?

Because you need reasons to charge $7500 for the first year and $2500 in subsequent years for a credit card.